Prince George, B.C. – Provincial New Democrat leader Adrian Dix has indicated he doesn’t think the Province of B.C. could stop the Enbridge pipeline if that project is approved by the Joint Review Panel.
Dix was speaking on the Meisner program on CFISFM this morning, and when posed with the hypothetical scenario of the project being approved and Dix being Premier, he indicated he didn’t believe he could stop the project “The Constitution I think is fairly clear on these questions, the regulatory decision is a federal jurisdiction so you can’t be , shall we say, just harassing as a Provincial jurisdiction even though we own the land. So we are reviewing those questions, and they are legal questions but the best thing that could happen is that the pipeline would be dealt with in the federal review.”
Dix says the decision on the pipeline lies within the process “The Federal Government is doing the regulatory review on Enbridge, and what that means is, people, first and foremost, have to get involved there. That’s why our MLAs Robin Austin and Gary Coons and Doug Donaldson, from the region are speaking at the hearings. Our environment critic Rob Fleming is speaking at the hearings. I think these people are right to this extent, that while there are other things that can be done, the primary place for the decision that will be made on Enbridge is in this Federal regulatory process and they have to get involved, and they are. I think people in the northwest in particular, but all over the north are getting involved in this process and I think that’s a good thing.”
Dix says the Enbridge issue is very divisive “It’s been divisive in the north, all over the province, the Prime Minister has attacked, Mr Oliver has attacked the people opposed to it and there is a heightening of the debate and it would be better , as in the case of the Prosperity Mine, where the mine lost in the federal review, that it happen that way rather than continued confrontation.”
On the matter of the teachers dispute, Dix says the problem with the teachers negotiations is “There hasn’t been much to negotiate. The government brought in bill 27 and Bill 28 in 2002, they essentially said to teachers ‘you negotiate working conditions’. Then in the last number of rounds, they also said you can’t negotiate salary. Well, you can’t negotiate salary and you can’t negotiate working conditions it’s hard to have a range of issues you can come to agreement on. I don’t think its any great surprise that as a result of that, that it’s been difficult to come to an agreement.”
Comments
At least Dix doesn’t sit on the fence like Clark.
Atta a boy Dix spoken like a true fiberal. The fibs can weasel out of trying to stop the pipeline by saying its the feds not us. This way the fibs can pretend to oppose the pipeline while all their buds line up to cash in.
Their fight with the teachers is just a diversion from how they and friends are ripping off the taxpayer.
Dix also said on air today that if elected he will put corporate taxes back up and also stated the HST should be returned to june 2010 rules. After that the sales tax could be re-visited as it has been many times since the inception of PST in 1948. Dix said that they know how to collect the tax this is no problem. But the lieberals are going to get every last dime that can and then just before eelection day revert back to PST. I think everyone knows that already, but Dix did say that. He also said that, in the same way the lieberals will NOT call an election until the very last minute just like the 2 by-elections that are now due to be called. These, Cristy knows she and her party are going to LOOSE big time and when the by-elections are finally called this is gonna shave off 2 of her people. Same is going to happen in the election when ever we get to attend. One thing I say is that attendance should be record breaking. EVERYONE wants the lieberals out of office.
YESTERDAY
“On the matter of the teachers dispute”
How about asking how he would handle the dispute and reach a settlement with the BCTF. How would he fund any increases? What about the HEU? BCGEU? Doctors? Me-too clauses in current agreements?
It’s all fine to put a microphone under the nose of a politician who is in opposition, no matter what the political stripe, and ask what the governing party is doing wrong. Pretty easy pickings from the cheap seats. Would like to see the media ask the hard questions for a change rather than just providing a soapbox.
So Dix has thrown in the towel. Right, he is not sitting on the fence. He basically stated there is no fence. There is a process and if the outcome of the process is to allow the pipeline then the process has ended.
“The Constitution I think is fairly clear on these questions, the regulatory decision is a federal jurisdiction so you canât be , shall we say, just harassing as a Provincial jurisdiction even though we own the land”
Yes, I realize the REGULATORY decision is a federal jurisdiction.
That does not give the feds the right to not deal with the question of appropriate compensation. In the end, if the approval is given on the technical and even social side if that is what they will hear, there is the question of fair compensation.
Canada has gone through this in the past. The hydro corridor through Quebec for the electricity generated in Labrador/Newfoundland was a hot item, to say the least. Quebec still benefits from it. The First Nations likely still suffer from it.
We have all the same players. Two provinces – except no other province in Canada has the clout that Quebec has – and the First Nations. We have environmental impacts at the source of the oil, possible impacts along the corridor, and further possible impacts on the west coast shores.
For those who are not familiar with that case, read up on it by starting here.
http://www.heritage.nf.ca/law/cfimpacts.html
Thanks to Adrian Dix for answering the question honestly re: the Enbridge Pipeline this morning.
And who elected mattyc as the voice of everyone?
Some people use the Kalamazoo oil spill as reason against the pipeline out west. What is left out is that pipeline is 60 years old.
“Keystone Pipeline: The Cornell University Global Labor Institute produced a study claiming that the negative impacts of the proposed Keystone XL pipeline, over the next 50 years, may be more detrimental than the benefits. The study relies on emotional photographs and testimonials more than facts. The study correctly states that oil from Canada is more viscous than ordinary crude, therefore requiring higher pressures and temperatures to move than ordinary crude. The study cites spills over the past three years from other pipelines moving Canadian crude and extrapolates these spills to what may take place up to 50 years hence.
The major spill in the study occurred on the Lakehead pipeline into a creek feeding into the Kalamazoo River. The study fails to mention the Lakehead system is over 60 years old. Pipeline technology has changed significantly in 60, years including much better sensors and drilling under rivers and creeks. The Cornell study is similar to attributing to todayâs telephone system the characteristics of the telephone system of 1950, when it was dominated by operators.
The study highlights the value of the agriculture industry from the various states the pipeline will cross, implying the pipeline will destroy agriculture in the state if a spill occurs. The authors did not bother considering the extensive pipeline system that moves oil and gas through the East Coast of the US. This study is an example of how extreme some academic institutions have become. Please see links under âCommunicating Better to the Public â Exaggerate!â
The Canadian Constitution divides legislative powers between the federal and provincial government.
Among other things the federal government has power over “Works connecting provinces; beyond boundaries of one province; within a province but to the advantage of Canada/or more than one province”
But provinces have jursidiction over Management of Public Lands, Natural Resources, & Property among other things.
Like many legal issues there is not a clear answer on this one. In 1867 John A Macdonald and the others didn’t specifically address who will have jurisdiction over an oil pipeline from Fort Mac to the Pacific. I think that if the Government of BC is in opposition of the pipeline they have a constitutional arguement that this is within their jurisdiction.
Dix is just being a politician. Taking a position on the pipeline is going to offend a lot of people so he has choosen to not take a position. He would rather give up the opportunity for the people of BC to have a say on this rather than take a position on the issue.
Was just saying what Dix said today on the HST which is important and it’s the first time I ever heard Dix say that. And corporate taxes will be going up also. Dix said to 12 percent. I am not elected to anything. Would not want to be. But everyone needs to know what Dix said on HST. And it will be extnguished. And corporations will pay their share in order to pay for the things required in this province. He did a good interview I thought. Just wish Ben would post everything he said is all.
Kolberg, you hit the nail on the head very accurately. Thanks for that. It is a constitutional question which perhaps needs to be answered.
Dix may not be sitting on the fence to some people, when he actually may be.
What is clear to me is that Dix does not seem to have the fight in him. Lousy provincial leader material.
At least Clark has put Alberta on notice that BC needs something more tangible out of the process. So, she is doing the soft approach …. the question is, will she be able to follow through.
Dix is not even in the battle.
I think he was pretty clear, Lonesome Sparrow, Dix said he was going to raise corporate tax.
Hard questions like…..BC Rail? Lonesome? Why did the mainstream media give the Liberals a pass on BC Rail???
What kind of hard questions are you refering to, Lonesome?
“But everyone needs to know what Dix said on HST”.
It says that he siad HST should go back to June 2010 …..
We all know that, they are next spring. It seems to me that no one understands that there was a 5 year agreement. After 5 years we can opt out. So, we are. Supposedly without penalty and supposedly a couple of months earlier than the 5 years.
What am I missing? It’s old news.
It’s not surprising that many don’t like what Dix said, but there is a saying about picking your battles.
According to Ben’s article in the “Views” section, Mr. Dix went from ‘not on my watch’ to his current position. What changed between then and now? What information did he find out?
Make no mistake, this pipeline is a long way from happening… As of today, I’d give it a 50/50 chance at best in its current proposal. But let’s not confuse the fact that the processes and regulations for everything from review to construction to ongoing operation and maintenance are federal.
So the Feds have the authority to approve the pipeline, fair enough. Do they have the authority to physically clear and alter Provincial lands so that the pipeline can be run?
“the processes and regulations for everything from review to construction to ongoing operation and maintenance are federal”
But provinces are not lame ducks and the constitution csn be challenged. As somone already said in another way, it is not cast in stone. It is what is called a living document. We must not forget that. Dix may very well have forgotten that.
He may just not want the election debate to start to early.
Personally, I think the debate should be taken out of the BC election and Dix and Clark should go talk to Alberta together and let them know in no uncertain terms that no matter who is in government aftet the May 2013 election, they will be dealing with like minds on the issue of the pipeline and the benefits that need to accrue to BC should the feds push it.
Think outside the box ….. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sa9fVAmVpWc&feature=relmfu
BTW, I have not heard of any provincial premier conferences lately. Have I missed them?
Perhaps this issue has Canada-wide applications.
Gus, so Dix isn’t provincial leadership material in your mind. Is Clark? Won’t even address the pipeline issue directly to the people of BC. Has a little banshee in a tight skirt restricting media access to her so she doesn’t have to answer questions. Yup, that’s leadership. Run and hide Christy.
Seamutt, so the spill into the Kalamazoo River was from a 60 year old pipleline. Well all pipelines, including the ones now being built, will be 60 years old at some point.
There’s one particular clean up of dirty dirt happening in the Fort St. John area. While cleaning up the mess from a known leak, they discovered another that has been leaking for quite some time, and was a bigger mess than the one they were doing.
It doesn’t have to be a massive rupture to cause damage. In some of the areas where the pipeline is proposed to be built, there could be a drip for years, and wouldn’t be noticed until it’s too late.
What are lieberals and fiberals?
mattyc:” EVERYONE wants the lieberals out of office.”
“EVERYONE” of course means you and the mouse in your pocket.
Maybe the headline is meant to say:
Dix Doesn’t Think! Province Could Stop Pipeline! ;-)
“Clark? …. Won’t even address the pipeline issue directly to the people of BC.”
There you go, neither will Dix …. It will be an election issue. The review won’t have its decision out till afterwards. There is still a whole year to go for the panel to take in information and write the report …. let the people do the talking …. listen …
Remember, political leadership is about finding where the line is forming and eventually work your way to the front so that you can play follow the leader ….
60 year pipe yes and the technology has improved in those 60 years, leak detection, monitoring etc. Hey I am on the fence gathering information. Still how come the doom and gloomers did not mention the pipe was 60 years old. Media by hype.
seamutt, if our technology was really that awesome we wouldn’t need oil anymore.
gus: “But provinces are not lame ducks and the constitution csn be challenged. “
Perhaps, but maybe Adrian Dix realized that all a challenge will do in this case is get some lawyers rich on the backs of taxpayers.
mattyc:” EVERYONE wants the lieberals out of office.”
“EVERYONE” of course means you and the mouse in your pocket.
Wrong sir. “EVERYONE” It means the majority of citizens of BC. Don’t know what cave you been staying in lately but every poll says that the liberals are TOAST. Do you disagree with that? Or are you going to say that the liberals will be re-elected? Which is it? Tell us here what you mean. If you say the latter it would show all of us how stupid you are. So come on let’s hear it PrinceGeorge.
Soon the HST will be extinquished and the liberals will be all gone. There I spelled their disgusting name properly for you.
“maybe Adrian Dix realized” … a person, any person, can realize all they want that it will be useless, in their mind, to pursue something.
But it is not those people who effect change. It is those who realize that and find a way to did it anyway who are the ones to effect change. The others might even be considered to be realists, but they are not adventurers, idealists, critical thinkers, or any one else who advance groups, communities, mankind.
Sure gus. Maybe you can enlighten me –why do you believe this pipeline project is subject to a Consitutional challenge, when no others have been to this point? Why does this require precident setting changes to the Consitution of Canada?
I will say in general that people around these parts don’t know squat about the oil and gas or pipeline industries. They know forestry, but all they know about gas and oil are images fed to them by the media. That contributes to a lot of fear and ignorance, and it runs rampant on this site.
JohnnyBelt … I do not believe that it is subject at this time to a Supreme Court interpretation and most certainly not an amendment.
The process in place has to be followed through to its conclusion. The Supreme Court of Canada, as I understand it, will not entertain a hypothetical question dealing with constitutional interpretation, which only stands to reason.
All I am saying is that it is a direction which could be taken should a decision and other associated conditions not be acceptable to the Province, especially those conditions which may affect or appear to affect the rights of the Province to enjoy the benefits of a federal system.
It is far too early, in my mind, to predict where this issue is heading.
Dix is prejudging the actions which could be taken should the ruling be in favour of building the
1. pipeline;
2. terminal
3. increasing the capacity of the tar sands project
4. and bringing the largest tankers to an area of the BC coast which have not yet seen that amount of tanker traffic
5. selling bitumen without further processing.
6. selling oil outside of the American Continents.
To me those are all issues. Only some of them seem to be addressed with the hearings.
The province won’t have to stop it. The people with brains will.
gus: “The process in place has to be followed through to its conclusion.”
Agreed. Are you willing to accept any decision that comes from that process or will you reject it if you don’t like it?
“Are you willing to accept any decision that comes from that process or will you reject it if you don’t like it?”
I am sorry .. that does not compute .. ;-)
Let’s get real here. I know my opinion won’t matter one iota. I can’t even get my dog to come into the house if I want him to. He comes in his own sweet time.
However, if I were in a position of considerable influence such as the premier of the province at that time, and I and my cabinet found it detrimental to the people of this province, you bet your sweet bippy I would do everything in my power to have it overturned – political first with the prime minister, then the Supreme Court of Canada. There is an appeal process, and I would take it.
Dix has now said what he would do. Clark has not faced that particular question, but she is already “working the room of influence”, so to speak.
Dix is foolish to take the weak position and capitulate before the battle ignoring his very real powers as a premier. To do so on the most important issue of the next election shows he is not capable of leadership IMO.
I think Dix just signaled that he supports Gateway, but his party doesn’t, so he is taking an out on the issue.
What if Nathan Cullen is elected leader of the federal ndp and takes the position on BC’s behalf protecting BC sovereignty on the pipeline issue. Sure will make for awkward meetings with Dix.
If BC government wanted to stop the pipeline all we would have to do is not grant the land for the pipeline and not grant the rights to clear the right of ways… regardless of what the Joint Review Panel from the rest of Canada decides.
Seamutt
I’m a little confused by your first post. I thought Adrian Dix was with the NDP.
I think Dix just gave the NDP the death blow here in BC because even if he comes out against the pipeline later on, who is going to believe he has the resolve to fight it? Not me. We need a legit 3rd party in the province. I don’t want either the gliberals or the emptyPs. I don’t care if the feds do have jurisdiction on passing the go ahead of the pipeline, they still can’t come into BC and start cutting down trees and bulldozing land without BCs sayso.
The province wouldn’t have to try and stop the pipeline. A coalition of environmentalists, first nations, BC residents, youth, students, teachers, grannies, and about any other group you can imagine will be blockading any attempt to install this pipeline……it’s fini.
gus: “Let’s get real here. I know my opinion won’t matter one iota…”
I know this and I was going to put something to that effect in my last post, but didn’t.
The province has a role to play, but it’s not after the pipeline gets approved (if it does).
You mean after the pipeline gets approved by the review panel which is made up of 2 people from Alberta (read oilmen) and 1 from Ontario.
my2bits: “You mean after the pipeline gets approved by the review panel which is made up of 2 people from Alberta (read oilmen) and 1 from Ontario.”
Do you have any facts to back that up, or you exaggerating to make a point? Don’t respond, I already know the answer.
“The province has a role to play, but it’s not after the pipeline gets approved”
I hope you did not read into my post that I did not think the province has a role to play before that. I never said that or even wnet there.
It most certainly does.
What makes you think they are not playing a role now and into the future? That role is multi-facetted.
http://gatewaypanel.review-examen.gc.ca/clf-nsi/bts/jntrvwpnl-eng.html
The three-headed panel. All reside in Alberta. No one even originates in BC.
You have to quit shooting from the hip JohnnyBelt. Your aim is miserable like that. ;-)
Of course, all that being said one must say one is a First Nations guy, albeit from Ontariario … the other has a biology background and deals with environmental issues.
—————————–
Matthews – As a professional geologist, Mr. Matthews has extensive knowledge of the Canadian natural resources industry. Since 2007, he has been the manager of mineral exploration with Mohawk Garnet Inc., was a mine/project geologist for the Xstrata Nickel Mine in Falconbridge, Ontario, and was the vice-president of Exploration with Arizona Explorations.
I do not think we are exploring in this case ….. we are transporting ….
———————————
Bateman – Mr. Bateman is a Canadian energy lawyer and former senior executive in the Canadian energy sector.
Mr. Bateman has been involved in numerous land and off-shore pipeline hearings such as the Brunswick Pipeline Project, Deep Panuke and Keystone XL.
Ah, someone with a track record that can be checked ……
————————————
Leggett – Before joining the National Energy Board, Ms. Leggett was a board member with the Natural Resources Conservation Board, which conducts hearings into natural resource development projects in Alberta. Prior to this, Ms. Leggett was a vice-president and senior consultant with an environmental consulting firm and a founding board
member for Alberta Ecotrust.
She has served on numerous NEB regulatory panels, nine of which she has chaired. One of those included serving as the chair for the Emera Brunswick Pipeline Project, the first National Energy Board hearing substitution for the Canadian Environmental Assessment Agency joint review panel process. Ms. Leggett is also the chair of the NEB’s Governance Committee.
Reasonable experience … bit bureaucratic, but then that is fair for the chair …
Again, great info for some background checks …… to see how they think.
Nobody’s perfect.
Legal, schmegal. Take a position. I am disappointed in this response, as reasonable as it sounds. This is one instance where the people of BC are totally affected, assuming all risk, with most or all benefits flowing elsewhere. Defy the Federal government if necessary. Promises of jobs of questionable numbers while admitting that there can be no guarantee that spills can be prevented or avoided? Why in hell should we shoulder this burden? Particularly in view of the fact that we are dealing with a country that is less than concerned with environmental issues (and perhaps have become one). If there is a spill – major or not – China and the rest of Canada will go about their business, leaving us to deal with the fallout. And where will Harper be? Probably in China, making sure they received their latest shipment!
Legal, schmegal. Take a position. I am disappointed in this response, as reasonable as it sounds. This is one instance where the people of BC are totally affected, assuming all risk, with most or all benefits flowing elsewhere. Defy the Federal government if necessary. Promises of jobs of questionable numbers while admitting that there can be no guarantee that spills can be prevented or avoided? Why in hell should we shoulder this burden? Particularly in view of the fact that we are dealing with a country that is less than concerned with environmental issues (and perhaps have become one). If there is a spill – major or not – China and the rest of Canada will go about their business, leaving us to deal with the fallout. And where will Harper be? Probably in China, making sure they received their latest shipment!
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