It is unfortunate that those who work for minimum wage do not see the advanage of being unionized. Its a crime that the owners make millions and their work force lives next to the poverty line.
Cheers

It’s unfortunate that the average unionized worker thinks that business owners ‘make millions’. The old tired myth that ‘the Man’ is out to screw his or her employees needs to die.

They improve the life of union bosses for sure! Last I checked, the union has consistantly been dropping in numbers over the last 3 decades! The membership pays lots and does not get represented well!

Unions have their good and bad points.

Good ones are, stopped children working, brought in safety,benefits, retirement, regular working hours, fair wages.

Bad, back the “bad” employees, a guy steals, comes to work under the influence etc and fights for them to keep their jobs.

I think a equal balance of union/non union is good. Keeps each other in check.

It’s a Right to belong to a Union, it’s up yo the Membership to run it proper , the same you don’t have to Join ” the Rand Formula” you still pay Dues , so you may as well join this way you can Vote!

My union takes my money every month and then can’t be found when our collective agreement is being violated.

Labor unions are a necessity in keeping the wages up for all of the working force…The problem we have today is how unappreciative and disrespectful many of the members can get…Also the seniority rule sucks. A lazy grumpy jerk gets all consideration for advancement because he’s been employed longer…work ethic takes a back seat.

I am a bit hypocritical because I feel we need unions to keep up the wage and benefit scales…l just would rather work for non-union companies who are forced to pay competitively in my trade…I don’t need a union for job protection.

Minimum wage is necessary for many businesses to survive ie restaurants and also serve a purpose in supplying work and experience to unskilled workers.

My union takes my money every month and then can’t be found when our collective agreement is being violated.

Out West has the answere for you. I was a union member the entire time that I worked. There was always a Shop Steward around to take your complaints If there isnt maybe going to a union meeting and leting the Local know that you are not being represented properly.
Cheers

You know what will happen if you go to a union meeting and tell them you are not being represented? They will all tell you to become a shop steward. This accomplishes two things: You stop criticizing the chair and the rest of the elected local who largely do nothing but go on trips paid for by union dues, and the same group of do nothings will dump as much work as they can on you to impress you with how much work there is, keeping you too busy to point out they do nothing, and allow them more time to do nothing while taking credit for your work as a steward. You will spend a lot of time doing paperwork, going to meetings and either waiting on the employer or union, who both conveniently “forget” to do things as simple as signing they have read and understood a piece of paper. It is a rigged system. Anyone who is part of a union should look through their collective agreement and seek out the relevant section where you can redirect your union dues to a charity for religious reasons. It is a simple form, and at least the money which then would go to the union might do some good in the world.

“The old tired myth that ‘the Man’ is out to screw his or her employees needs to die”

It can die very quickly by putting union representations on corporate boards as they have done in the EU and some other countries.

http://www.eurofound.europa.eu/eiro/1998/09/study/tn9809201s.htm

Talk about working in “partnership. eh???? ;-)

“Good ones are, stopped children working”

I believe that in the USA, one of the key founders was a clergyman who formed the National Child Labor Committee in 1904.

Within a short time they had some prominent politicians, philanthropists, clergymen, and intellectuals advocating for the group: former president Grover Cleveland, Senator Benjamin Tillman of South Carolina, and the president of Harvard University, Charles W. Eliot among them.

Their original awareness raising campaign involved hiring a sociology professor who advocated photography as an educational medium, to document child labor in American industry. Over the next ten years thousands of photographs designed to pull at the nation’s heartstrings were published.

The fair labor standards act was enacted in in 1938 which outlawed child oppressive labour for interstate commerce.

While labour unions may have had a part to play in the USA it does not seem to have been a significant one.

Look where the EU and some other Countries are to-day. Up S..t Creek without a paddle.

The present system in Canada works fine if we could just get greed out of the equation.\

Something works just fine if only …….. LOL

Kind of defies any sort of logic, doesn’t it? LOL.

It either works fine, or it doesn’t work fine. Not one of those things were it works half way or 75% of the way.

What we are talking about is corporate culture, not economic well being of a country. Two different things.

The notion of having financial shareholders as well as worker representatives on boards came about in Germany when strikes were killing the coal and steel industry with strikes.

The German word used for the system is translated into English as “co-determination”. The system based on the German model is a two tiered system. The Swedes created a one tier system. The EU adopted it as an EU law.

If you wish, you may attribute the economic success of Germany and Sweden to being the creators and early adopters of the system which came about because of a mindset which we simply do not yet have in North America, at least not to the point where it is the law.

I would not go there, however, since there are countries who are economically successful without having a co-determination law.

Gus.. Any part that takes kids out of the work force is significant.

FYI Gus…. We live in Canada, I am sure you can find something to cut and paste about it.

P Val ….. for your information we live on a sphere hurtling through space called the earth.

Earth is populated by by many organic organisms. Some of those organisms call themselves humans.

I find that there is an interesting thing about humans. They are generally social beings and some have developed the ability to learn from each other and improve their well being much faster as a result. From grade school on right through university we are taught how to work in groups and teams in order to increase our productivity quality of work.

With today’s travel and communication technology Mr. Roger’s neighbourhood has gone viral and is reaching around the globe.

Interestingly, according to Canadian Business, one of the 26 key barriers which is holding Canada back to becoming an economic superpower is not having enough global experience. From that article: “Currently, 3% of Canadian students go abroad, which is just abysmal. Our competitors are up around 9%” It is all part of that favourite topic of people such as yourself, P Val, globalization.

And, just to make you happy, here is a link to a Canuck site.

http://money.ca.msn.com/investing/26-things-holding-canada-back#image=23

enjoy …. ;-)

Of coursse I agree about the concern of children working P Val. You conveniently diverted from my point that it was not the union movement which speaheaded the efforts on this continent as you suggested.

But hey, I know that to correct a notion or bring forward another point of view does not win popularity contests ….. especially among parochial minded people …. ;-)

Gus.. thanks for the science lesson.. didnt know the earth was a sphere or it was moving.

As for your numbers of the students going abroad.. could it be that we have better schools ? Or its cheaper to go to school in Canada than travel to another country ? Could that also be why so many others go to different countries, like ours ? Better, cheaper etc.

Then again.. 80% of statistics are made up on the spot.. you may have brought that up to 81.

As for your dig about me being limited in my thinking.. hope you have a mirror to look in ;)

PVal: “As for your dig about me being limited in my thinking.. “

Don’t take it personally. A pretty common complaint from gus, the only enlightened soul on this site. We mere mortals could only aspire to be as great as he.

P Val …. you sound like you would be the life of a party … join hands with JohnnyBelt … ;-)

————————————-
“As for your numbers of the students going abroad.. could it be that we have better schools”

Now I know for sure that you do not understand the metric that Canadian Business magazine used. It is not my metric, it is theirs. All I can be accused of is being the messenger …. notheless, I agree with it. It has aboslutely nothing to do wth schools being better here or there.

So, in answer to your rhetorical question … the answer is no, it could not be because schools are better here than there. It has to do with experiencing the culture and thinking of other countries.

BTW P Val, have you ever heard of the Rotary Group Study Exchange?

Same concept.

I know, this might all be a bit too weird and foreign to you …. LOL

http://www.rotary.org/en/serviceandfellowship/makeconnections/groupstudyexchange/pages/ridefault.aspx

psssst … this page might be from the USA instead of Canada. Hope you can forgive me …. ;-)

“80% of statistics are made up on the spot”

Can you quote your source for that, please. Has it been verified by a peer review board?

When you are up to your backside in alligators, it’s difficult to remember that your main objective was to drain the swamp.

Unions have their role. (To erode the rights of their employers)And to protect the rights of their members. (The process of advancement in the ranks by seniority only)

I have a problem with both of these . So, here is where many of us differ.

Why is it that so many companies have opted to contract out services that were previously performed by unionized workers?
Cheaper? Why is it when I go to the store, I find my product “Made in China, Taiwan, Korea? Could it be that unions have outpriced themselves and companies are finding a lot more profit from having things manufactured elsewhere?
Yes unions used to have their place, however, there’s a reason we’ve lost so many jobs.

To true Johnny.. Gus is by far the best at cutting and pasting ..lol