Ok, heck of a deal, we spend 25 million and use maybe $100 thousand in wood. Wow.
This will keep Carrier lumber running maybe 2 hours. Oh, and is it fireproof?
Just asking.

Airport design has received a certain amount of recognition.

[url]http://www.archello.com/en/project/prince-george-airport[url/]

Wow – Carrier can move 2000 cubic meters (almost 850,000 board feet) in two hours. They must have done some upgrades
*eyeroll*

ps – there is going to be a little more going on here than 2x4s out of Carrier…

World Trade centers built out of steel and concrete were they fireproof? A little closer to home Boston Pizza built out of brick and the fire did not have to huff and puff too hard.

Laminated beams actually hold their strength better than steel in a fire and for longer.

That is amazing. It looks just like a big square box. It is so innovative and pleasing to look at. This will definitely enhance the downtown.

Wow! I’m underwhelmed. Actually, they should stick the cops in this box & use the new cop shop for something more useful.

http://www.archello.com/en/project/prince-george-airport

Better looking than former building and should have fewer sidewalk pizzas to step around.

THAT is one ugly building, looks like a box with tooth picks….

“Wow! I’m underwhelmed. Actually, they should stick the cops in this box & use the new cop shop for something more useful.”

I think the basic idea of that suits me.

I am hoping the design shown is very preliminary. The airport is a bit more INNOVATIVE if one were looking for that. This is a basic post and beam building. I was thinking they would bring a few more innovations to the building than that. It should be a building which should also point the way to how to develop downtown properties better than the other “high” rises we have, which really do little to enhance the street level, and even the second level, experience to draw people to the downtown.

What I see here will do little to improve the downtown other than fill a hole with a dead building which will empty out at 5 pm.

A box the same height as the Ramada, only $25 million taxpayer dollars? What a deal!

Reminds me of the old buildings that were built years ago in Vancouver……yuk.

” A building that can be used as a demonstration” = not a commercially viable building.

That great sucking sound is your taxpayer dollars disappearing from your wallet.

Less than the price of one fast ferry engine and will not crack every time it is used.

I can do better with a deck of cards.

lonesome sparrow
time for another mea culpa? I have seen you do it twice already.

What is this building going to be used for and what benefit does it do for the citizen’s of Prince George?

I still don’t understand how they are allowed to construct a 6 storey wood building. The maximum allowable according to the building code is 4 storeys.

http://www.nrc-cnrc.gc.ca/ci-ic/article/v17n4-9

This is under review but will be discussed in the summer of 2013. Why are they going ahead with this building when it’s not a sure thing that the building code will change?

If somebody know that the building code will change, it sounds like corruption since it technically is still under review.

And “if approved, will be incorporated into the 2015 edition”.

How can we begin construction before approval?

Outside iron fire escapes on the other side of the building not seen? Like in old New York? Big elevator in the middle of the building, with a do not use sign? Cement stairwells? No smoking signs everywhere? Too cold for termites right now, but… “climate change”? Could happen.

I have never understood why we don’t build more with wood in northern BC. I agree with Dr. George Iwama we need to take the lead here in PG not the lower mainland with wood innovation…. we have the knowledge, the skills, and plenty of fiber.

We already had a wood building on that site. Remember the PG Hotel? Too many people in PG have champagne tastes ignoring the fact we have a beer budget. Want fancy new buildings? Move to Vancouver.

Is this a joke?
Start building it in April so the incoming government after the election will have little choice but to keep spending?
Bell seems a bit arrogant…if all the questions have been answered, why are they still being asked?
Actually…I think there are a lot of questions regarding this box that need to be asked yet!

So we forget aboutpot holes in our streets and infastructure repair for another year because some a-s h-le thinks a wood design centre is more important. I certainly hope the NDP investigate just what is going on here. My taxes have taken enormous jumps for the past few years and I’m n ot sure that I can keep up to these turkeys.

Whenever I see all that wonderful glass, I immediately think about how much it will cost to heat. Especially if I have to pay for it.

And, it has a lot less attractive than the Art and Convention center on 4th and Victoria.

Must be getting the wood from China for 25 mill. LOL

Talk about political BS. Bell and Bond wanting to get their final photo op

The more I sit an think about this, the more I think this needs to looked at hard a long before one dime of taxpayers money is spent.
There is an odd smell to this…and it isn’t wood shavings!
Why the rush?
Why the arrogance from Pat Bell?
What’s his hurry?
And why fly at it before the election?….oh wait…votes for the likes of Bell and Bond, I suspect?

Wow look at the liberals go, I definately
shall vote for them in the upcoming election.

Might be $25 million from the taxpayers’ pockets, but that is a $25 million project being built in PG, not down south. There will be some money being pumped back into the local economy because ofthis project.

When the building is up and running – hotels, restaurants, airport will all benefit from the WIDC.

Then there is the educational benefits (once the programming is added to UNBC) – engineering students from outside of PG will need places to stay, etc.

This project has more positives than negatives – some people just need to remove their tinfoil caps.

^^^^^enlighten us how hotels, restaurants, airport will all benefit from the WIDC.

Just who is going to be providing something of value within the WIDC again? Are these new jobs?

If this is such a great deal and such a great business opportunity, why doesn’t Pat Bell finance it himself? Let him put his money where his mouth is. But no, he plays with public money, but Wendys’ is where he makes his bucks.

If the private sector is not willing to build it, why should the public pay?

Good question guesswhat. I doubt if he can enlighten us, but lets wait and see.

In the meantime the contractor and design architect are from Vancouver so they will make all the profits. The wood will come from other places for the most part, especially the wood beams etc; so Vancouver and Penticton, and the Transportation industry will make a dollar. In addition there is an acute shortage of workers in Prince George so I would expect that the contractor will bring his own crews with him, or at least a good portion of them.

The office space and industry use will take business away from private enterprise, and at the end of the day this whole sham, will cost us tax dollars with no return on investment what so ever. Then after leasing the property for a dollar per year for 26 years, we will get this building back, about the time that it will need major reno’s,.

Plenty of projects this money could have been spent on, however because of the election we will now get this monstrosity, to add to the Taj Mahal police station, and the soon to be announced (2 years?) performing art centre.

This is like paying $250,000.00 for an operating table, then hiring a quack to perform operations. The table holds up well, but the patients die.

The Liberals will not get any extra votes because of this sham, and will be sent packing, as they should be. I can’t wait for May 15th.

I absolutely want something of significance built on this site, but honestly, I’m not stoked about it being constructed out of wood.

Anyone with a shred of common sense is going to do a cost benefit analysis on a major building project, which will include a myriad of factors like insurance, maintenance, risk, materials, life expectancy, etc.. You know why people who live in an area rich with cheap accessible timber face their homes with vinyl? Because it makes sense to. Most people don’t want to scrape and repaint their houses every 2 years anymore.

I believe in investing in research and development to create value added wood products and extract the most out of our resources as possible, but trying to convince people to build multi-storey buildings from wood doesn’t fit that model. It’s lazy thinking mixed in with political opportunism and I think most people are hip to it. You start trying to enforce the consideration of wood in the construction of all new government buildings of a certain scale and prepare yourself to get run over by pissed off taxpayers. Kindly remove your heads from your bums and go away quietly.

actually Sine – do a bit of research on cross-laminated panels. Many areas that are earthquake prone and have watched cement buildings collapse might take your list of factors and decide on wood. Who woulda thunk it? ;)

Then let earthquake prone areas test this new type of building structure. Why should we be the guinea pigs that pay?

It appears to me that there is a problem in the timeline after reading this.

http://www.nrc-cnrc.gc.ca/ci-ic/article/v17n4-9

guesswhat: ^^^^^enlighten us how hotels, restaurants, airport will all benefit from the WIDC.

—-

When it is under operation, there will be conferences, presentations, research teams. These attendees will come from other areas (usually by airplane); many of them would need a place to stay (hotels); guess they may need to eat (restaurants).

How many people (from Prince George) would complain if this was built in Fort St John or Penticton with BC Taxpayers money?

So if they can only build 4 storys, does that mean it will cost us only $16 million?

PCL… Where they not over budget on the Convention Center and the stadium roof,are they invovled in the BC roof cables lawsuit and who is the recipient of any polictical donations that PCL gives out….Hmmmmm I wonder?

Should one generation consume beyond its means and either expect or hope that the next generations will somehow pick up the tab?

-Chris Martenson

I see the NDP are starting to rumble about this on CBC.
This is going to get sticky…or stinky,whichever you prefer.
5 will get you 10 this $25 million dollar taxpayer funded wooden box is far from built yet.
I am not against it totally, but I am against rushing into it simply because there is an election coming and a couple of local politicians think it just might save their bacon.
I also think the design is poor…very poor.
Is it a rush job?

Olddog and others. Here is the skinny on Building Codes in Canada

There is the National Building. It used to be the building code for the entire country. Before that happened, cities had their own codes. The City of Vancouver still does since they have a Charter which gives them the right to creating their own code.Over time, the provinces created their own building codes.

Then, in the early 70’s for BC, the provinces took over the building code responsibility by creating their own which started off with being the same as the national code with the exception of some administrative processes. Over time, the provinces diverged here and there from the national building code which still continues as the model.

The height allowance for wood buildings used to be 3 storeys. Vancouver allowed 4 during those times.

In 2009 the BC enacted wood first legislation which included the ability to construct buildings out of wood up to 6 storeys high. So, in BC, this building has been legal for about 4 years and people have been building such buildings in the lower mainland since then.

When the government went to an expression of interest, they proposed to build a 10 storey building. The responses from all or most of the companies who sent in their interest was to not design a 10 storey building since it would be too complex for the contractor to receive permission to buld to 10 storeys. You see, it is quite possible to not meet the building code as long as one could show that there are steps taken to not reduce the building and occupants’ safety. It has been done before. One of the best examples is Scarborough City Hall in the 1960s which changes the way buildings looked inside throughout the entire country.

Now that was innovation!!!

The other thing is, the provincial government can exempt itself from meeting the code. They do not like to do it, I am sure, but they can.

Sorry for the lecture once more. I have made it several times on here.

http://www.vancouversun.com/business/real-estate/First+story+wood+frame+housing+comes+market/7208943/story.html

BTW, that is a 5 storey building on a concrete podium.

As usual, Prince George politicians are a day late and a dollar short.

Anything you want to know about wood, or wood innovation can be obtained at various places around the globe. Pr George has this inane idea that they are at the cutting edge of technology, when in fact they are bringing up the rear.

A case in point is the Oregon Wood Innovation Center, Oregon State University, CorvallisOre. This wood innovation center has done huge research into the various applications of wood. I would defy any engineers in Prince George to come up with some wood innovation idea, that is not already on the market. Oregon State Center was started in 2006 and they have plenty of information on their website.

As usual we have located an idea that is already functioning somewhere else and then try to duplicate in PG, and pretend it is new. Good God, just how dumb are we.
Are we spending $25 Million just to re elect a couple of MLA’s???

“I am against rushing into it”

Rushing???? This has been announced several times over the last 4 or 5 years. The thing has been in the process of finding a builder/designer for almost a year.

This is unfinished business whci has taken far to long to get to this stage. Why do you think all these people are bitchin. The longer the process, the more potential fo bitch sessions; oh I was promised to be shortloisted; oh we are going to get the College of Arts involved … and CNC … and INBC will get an engineering faculty .. and Commonwealth is going to ensire private money will come in … and the Ramada will buy the property for a parking lot …. I mean, it never ends … and still won’t.

Have your plan worked out before it is announced, then get the builder/architect and get the dammed thing done.

This town is one big gossip cesspool and it was proven big time once more.

Bad place to prolong the pain.

The world is made up of research centres. We cannot rely on Oregon. We can, however, rely on the federal research centres at UBC and in Quebec City – FPInnovations. They are the ones which invented the oriented strand beams/columns which are used in the Admin building at UNBC. In fact, they would be usable for the building depicted.

Who is going to pay for the operation cost of this UNBC WIDC? Recall the multi million UNBC sport center project? The UNBC sport center has been costing UNBC and city hall more than half a million a year in operation cost. Half a million/year in the past 6 years is $3 Million. With $3 Million the UNBC could have had its engineering program by now and the city had its roads repaired.

Do we want the city money to be used on city infrastructure or on maintaining half empty buildings?

This is yet another election time propaganda by Shirley Bond to fool PG to reelect her and don’t be surprised if she has plans to replace Christy Clark after the election.

Who wants to rely on Oregon. Fact of the matter is they have all the information we need on wood innovation. Also as you state, this info is available all over the world. So why duplicate the wheel. Lets do something else with our money. Wood is on the wane. (Pun intended)

Prince George could be considered a Provincial City. Definition of Provincial.

**Not fashionable or sophisticated, limited in perspective, narrow and self centered**

What we badly need in Prince George is a Betty Ford like Center to send Shirley Bond to it for rehab.

She is addicted to wasting tax payers money.

I think keeping it simple is a great design. It is an unprecedented structure – let’s do it right instead of fidgetting with frills. The wood will speak for itself.
http://ckpg.com/wood-inovation-design-centre-announcer-video

Also UNBC, has a pretty impressive maintenance record. I think the building is in good hands

Classic example how things get mixed up in Prince George….we are currently building a police station that by the looks of it should be a performance art center and now we are building a WIDC building that could make a very nice police station. We spend 79 million to process criminals and 25 million to invest in the future…. :(

“they have all the information we need on wood innovation.”

I am sure many people said the same thing when Henry Ford came out with the Model A…that’s it no point in even trying anymore, Ford has reached the peak of automotive technology.

well from the comments I see here I am beginning to think it isn’t the crime that makes this city undesirable but the negative feeling of it’s citizens towards anything new or out of the norm. Lets keep it old style because if it is new and different they might come.
Just a last minute thought.
Have a great weekend.

How much did Green get paid for this building design? What I see in the above photo is nothing to brag about and certainly not something I would be sure to show any out of town visitors. How much more would it cost to design and build a truly innovative WIDC? We deserve better than this.

Hadenuf

“Build it and they will come”

Doesn’t work for jumbo jets and doesn’t work for wood technology. But this magical thinking seems to prevail among the Lieberal supporters in Prince George.

To the people thinking that we do not need this I can tell you that the south are envying us . Think about this ,if they don,t put the money in Prince George why are’t you all crying about taxpayer money when they spend $480 million on the Kelowna bridge,560 million on the roof of BC place . We deserve some of the tax money seeing that 80 percent of mining and forestry money go to the south. When they built the Cocahalla they started it and finished it with no stopping, also the Malahat on Vancouver Island. We still have. 2 lanes but in forty years will maybe have. Four lanes. So I say to the people of PG thank. Shirley and Pat for doing a great job for us in PG, if the NDP come in the money will not show up in the north but to buttered up south.

Hadenuf. There are many many Cities in Canada, that are not anal about building things to attract people.

Fact of the matter is, very few people (especially professional or skilled trade people) come to this City. We barely get enough to maintain the status quo.

So lets quit the BS. Just as many people leave this town as come. Especially in the past 15 years. Negative growth.

There are plenty of Cities in BC and Canada for people to live in and Prince George is just one of them.

If we looked after our water, sewer, roads, parks, etc; and ensured that all business buildings, and run down areas of the City were spruced up, plus got rid of the dust in the streets sooner, rather than later, reduce taxes, and service charges, we could be a much better place to live.

Further we need to quit pretending that we are so much more than we are.

This City (the people in it) have a huge inferiority complex, and are constantly pandering for approval.

Ohhhh. We have a University, Ohhhh. We have a cancer clinic. Ohhhhh. We have a college, Ohhhh. We have a WHL hockey team. Ohhh. We have a casino.

I say big deal. We also cant control out spending, have s….y roads, pollution, mostly caused by the City, we are in debt up to our butts, and we cannot seem to stop spending money we don’t have.

Build it and someone will come, screw the down Town should have been at UNBC if anywere

View from 5th
http://mg-architecture.ca/wp-content/uploads/2013/03/Render_night-960×700.jpg

View from George Street.
http://mg-architecture.ca/wp-content/uploads/2013/03/Render_george-exterior_reduced-960×700.jpg

A lesson in how to de-activate a street.

This architect is a sculptor, not an architect. When it comes to streetscapes, architects are supposed to animate downtown streets, not kill them.

We have to remember that between 95.057% to 97.983% of the people really do not care what material the building is built of. They see a building for its mass. They are interested in the building for the things it has in it which they use – a coffee shop, a bar, a laundry, a shoe store, a restaurant, a deli, etc. They might brag to outsiders about buildings that are unique such as the RCMP station, the Courthouse, Barton Insurance, Costco, 711, etc.

This building will be about the size of the Scotiabank building on Victoria. It is even the same 6 storey height. For the people who work there, it is an important building because of that. For those who bank there, it is likely less so. In the context of activating downtown, causing people to want to come downtown because it is a great place to hang out, it is really a non-entity.

This is no more than a Mies Van Der Rohe building built of wood instead of steel.

So, how many storeys are shown in he drawings?

This is innovation, at least for North Americans.

Watch the video. A prefabricated building, a storey a day erected on site. Classical European systems buildings.

http://www.creebyrhomberg.com/lct1/index_en.php?utm_source=CREE+GmbH&utm_medium=Release&utm_campaign=GreenBuild+Release

The innovation for Europe is the composite structural system using wood in combination with concrete, each in location best suited for their structural properties.

Thanks Gus for the video clip. That’s really amazing. I think we are heading for “honky” status in Prince George….spending tax dollars to fill space downtown….and a second campus for UNBC….is our university so big now that we need to expand it into the city core? This isn’t Montreal’s McGill university or Toronto’s York university, this is UNBC which is still a young university getting established. What are our leaders doing leaching UNBC, if anything the WIDC should be built there, not down on George street to take up space! -:(

I like it. New building downtown PG, not downtown Vancouver. It’s a win from every angle. I wish people would see that rather than complain, complain, complain.

Let the private sector build on this site. Throwing government money at a hole in the ground is not a recipe for success. The $25 million to build it is only the start of the subsidies. The drain on public finances will continue for the life of this building. And we have more important things to spend our money on.

With the NDP 20 points ahead, those involved in the controversy swirling around this building should think carefully about proceeding with this project. If it proceeds, it is guaranteed to attract an inquiry, and serious legal implications for any malfeasance.

If they said that they were building a 6 storey office building on George street I would certainly have the same response as you mwk.

BUT, that is NOT what they are saying. It is the rest of the hyperbole that has some concerned, including me. And that is not to even mention the political hay that is being made of the people who assembled the land and wanted to assemble more for a few more flips, etc. etc.

1.It will not be a force which will turn the downtown around.
2.It is not a particularly innovative building from many points of view, including the wood structure part.
3.It will take a function which should be at the UNBC campus and deposit it downtown.
4.It will continue to promote the splitting of the office district into two. The main one on Victoria, the satellite on George. Nothing in between to speak of. That stretches the services for those uses – coffee break, lunch, and small item convenience shopping – too far apart to allow for larger, more economically robust retail.

I can go on, but maybe some will understand a bit of the dynamics of what makes a successful downtown. It is more than just CBD daytime users and pretty buildings, not that this is one of those.

Just go to the Smart Growth renderings to see the type of buildings which are alive on the ground and even second floors which make a successful downtown revitalization project.

“If it proceeds, it is guaranteed to attract an inquiry, and serious legal implications for any malfeasance.”

If it does not proceed, it also has the potential of attracting legal or even quasi-legal pursuits. In fact, maybe even moreso.

The groups that are on the hot seat here are those who flipped the PG Hotel lots and purportedly admitted they wanted to do more of it. The groups who suggested purportedly admitted that they were the ones to suggest that they needed to have a special deal to be included in the 3 proponents. Then there is IPG, which purportedly needed all sorts of guarantees before they would loan the money. They did not get waht they were looking for, so the full amount was not made available.

To me, those are the key elements. Much of the rest is political rhetoric.

Notice that IPG seems to be out of this whole loop. Why? I thought they were supposed to be the ones who were promoting downtown and such developments.

I also do not see the City Manager mentioned, their real estate manager, Council and the closed session meetings dealing with the properties and their reason for wanting them.

A few less “herbs” sir and you might remember you have already posted that thought and it is not one that just popped into your head.

“How exactly will building a six story building for $25 million of taxpayers money improve downtown?”

“If a private developer proposed a $25 million development for downtown, I would be overjoyed.”

“Great , now we can have a useless building along with a useless runway.”

“Such an impressive building!”

“A box the same height as the Ramada, only $25 million taxpayer dollars?”

“If the private sector is not willing to build it, why should the public pay?”

“Let the private sector build on this site.”

“The $25 million to build it is only the start of the subsidies.”

Guess it is time to board up the university and CNC with the amount of government subsides those money pits lap up. Lay about students should pay the full cost of their education.

Yeah, that’s right, make people who are studying for their and our future pay full freight. Otherwise let the gravy train roll! Typical Lieberal attitude that is going to get Christ Clark and her cohorts turfed.

I’d love to see some Lieberal supporters defend this building with a financial analysis. They can’t and won’t because this is a pork barrel project pure and simple. It reflects the Lieberals cynical politics that have soured the majority of the population against them. Wait two months-the verdict will be in!

****Correction****
It is of course Christy Clark, all thoughts of Easter aside.