Stupid is-stupid does. And where is Cool Hand Luke anyway.

If pay parking was such a great idea, why isn’t every mall in North America charging for parking?

Meanwhile city tax payers have already decided who will get voted in next election.

Great idea icicle!

It’s not about revitalization because that isn’t happening. Or if it is it sure is taking a long time. Just have a look at that little plaque at the Plaza 400. It lists a bunch of people committed to the revitalization of Pg with a big ole 1985 stamped on it. Well ….. Well?

Maybe downtown Pg will be revitalized after the big jets start landing.

Great idea icicle!

It’s not about revitalization because that isn’t happening. Or if it is it sure is taking a long time. Just have a look at that little plaque at the Plaza 400. It lists a bunch of people committed to the revitalization of Pg with a big ole 1985 stamped on it. Well ….. Well?

Maybe downtown Pg will be revitalized after the big jets start landing.

Oops double post!

if these meters are like we encountered at Granville Island last week, forget them. They are so complicated to figure out, it would take an engineer to operate them. Come on councillors, shake your head. The public doesn’t want them; the merchants don’t want them.

Give it to Impark for five years, get a cut from them and all is cool. No operation costs, just revenue.

Should there be a parking fee downtown, yes, but not in the form that the city is thinking. Give it to a private business to manage.

I have no problems paying for a annual parking pass for $100/vehicle for up to two hours in one spot. I am sure there will be at least 500 people that will take up that. That alone raises 50k.

“Hamper the revitalization of downtown…..” It is to laugh. Might set it back twenty or more years to where it is now. Downtown revitalization is a dead horse only to be flogged during any and all municipal elections. It gives the vested interests a will to live and something to do every four years.

Building the pyramids took a while. Come to my grave and tell me D R is complete. That’s how much I care.

I suggest the installation of pay parking in the block surrounding the mayor’s cheesy little store. We can call it a test run. See how it impacts business in the area. Sherri should be all for it, being a progressive civic politician….

Mayor McCheese? Ha ha ha .

Cherry, the Mayor is supporting pay parking in downtown including around her store. Not sure what your point is.

You dont give a heart transplant to a dead person.. you cant infuse life into a dead downtown.. adding pay parking will just push more people away from shopping there.

Would be nice if mayor and council could be able to follow their decisions to see the real impact of them.

Downtown is hurting.. has been for decades.. businesses are closing.. so the city loses tax dollars… they then bring in pay parking.. less shop there.. less businesses can stay open.. more close.. less taxes.. so to make up for this taxation loss they add it to citizens.. who have less to spend.. so dont go downtown as they dont want to waste money to pay to park… and the ball keeps rolling and our taxes go up and up..

As many will recall, the City had pay parking for years before they removed the meters. Taking the meters out and making parking ‘free’ did nothing for the downtown.

The issue is far bigger than pay parking, although it has become the hot button issue of the day. Once established, people will forget about it and move onto the next crisis.

If a dollar is too much of a hardship for the privilege of parking downtown, you probably couldn’t afford to drive down there to begin with.

JohnnyBelt,

I don’t understand your statement that “taking the meters out … did nothing for the downtown.”

It’s made a huge difference. There are a lot more people downtown now than before the meters were taken out. Vacancy rates have dropped, rents have gone up and assessed values have almost doubled. That means that the downtown contributes almost twice as much property taxes now as before the meters were removed.

The merchants said their sales went up 20% almost immediately after the meters were removed.

How can you say it did nothing?

Not much for the subtleties, are you Johnnybelt?
Parking in downtown PG is not a privilege for patrons, it’s a hardship. Likely your car will be vandalized, you’ll definitely be accosted by someone requiring change, a smoke etc… Not paying for parking in such a crappy little downtown, should be a perk, an incentive for patronizing businesses unfortunate enough to have made the decision to locate in the downtown core.

Get used to it cherry … He’s not the brightest bulb in the pack. Kinda like a forty watt in a pack of sixty’s.

More personal attacks, with little other substance. Nothing new for this site.

Icicle: “The merchants said their sales went up 20% almost immediately after the meters were removed.”

Thanks for not engaging in personal attacks, but sorry, but I have to call BS on that one. Was there any supporting documentation, or is that claim anecdotal?

cherry: “Parking in downtown PG is not a privilege for patrons, it’s a hardship. Likely your car will be vandalized, you’ll definitely be accosted by someone requiring change, a smoke etc… Not paying for parking in such a crappy little downtown, should be a perk, an incentive for patronizing businesses unfortunate enough to have made the decision to locate in the downtown core.”

If the downtown is such an undesirable place to begin with, pay parking won’t make much difference now, will it? Let’s stop with the overdramatic BS which seems to want to make mountains out of every molehill.

I have to go with the DBIA on this one JB. How can anyone in their right mind not acknowledge the considered opinions of the downtown business owners themselves on the potential impact paid parking would have on their businesses?

These people are the owners of those businesses, these people travel to the downtown every day, they work there everyday, they know how many customers walk through their doors every day.

If they say paid parking will hurt their business and will set improvement of the downtown back, then I have to listen to them over some arm chair critic posting on this site who indicates the contrary.

Sorry JB, I side with the DBIA just because they would know more about the potential impacts of paid parking than you! And if you even think about arguing this point, then I have to agree with bonneville. Stop embarrassing yourself.

“they have been talking “Downtown Revitalization” since I came to PG in the early 70’s…I think it is still the same mess …or maybe even worse…”

They have been … and they have done something about it ….. and they are obviously all the wrong things:

1. Plaza 400 – failure because no shopping went in thus not an activity generator. (50% taxpayer $)

2. Court House – failure because not an activity generator. (100% taxpayer $)

3. Cultural Centre – Library, followed by Civic Centre, then Art Gallery …. the commercial that was in the original program as well as parking facilities not built ….. causing it to not be an activity generator. (100% taxpayer dollars)

4. Latest is RCMP PAC …. will not generate squat (100% taxpayer $)

The continuing saga of public money not followed by private money ….. no city growth … end of reason why revitalization has not worked …

JohnnyBelt,
You want facts. I get that. It’s unlikely that we’ll get the tax returns for each business downtown and there is no reason not to believe the DBIA on this point. Why would they lie about this? Why would ‘all’ the businesses lie about this?

With respect to assessed values though, there is no question. This is public information and it’s easy to check. The assessed values have close to doubled since the meters were removed.

You stated that the removal of the meters has done nothing, but you have not provided any facts to support this. The responsibility should be on you to support your statement. If you don’t the conclusion is that you don’t know what you are talking about.

So there JB …. Icicle has you by the you know what’s ….. remember you were trying to pin that lack of factual information at my feet …. now it is your turn, the expert on how to comment without facts ….

Icicle: “It’s unlikely that we’ll get the tax returns for each business downtown and there is no reason not to believe the DBIA on this point. Why would they lie about this? Why would ‘all’ the businesses lie about this?”

Because they want ‘free’ parking to continue. The DBIA shot themselves in the foot by not addressing those abusing the system. Now that the City is reinstituting pay parking, the DBIA is up in arms. Either the DBIA is ineffective, apathetic, or just incompetent. I can’t decide which.

Pawn shops should be exempt from pay parking out front. Obviously you are pawning a possession of yours (or someone else’s if you are so inclined), and because of that you obviously will be short of funds to plug the meter. Parking meters in front of a homeless shelter? I would call that “irony”.

Just leave it as it is now! Add another question to the municipal ballot (in addition to the fluoridation referendum question) which simply asks:

“Are you in favour of spending a minimum of 1.4 million dollars to re-instate parking in the downtown?”

That would be democracy in action with respect for those who would foot the bill-namely us!

JohnnyBelt,
You said the reason that they are all lying is that they want free parking to continue. Why would they lie about the parking if it didn’t make any difference to them? Of course it makes a difference to them.

Yet, you’ve also said that it doesn’t make any difference to them.

So which is it? You seem to be making points against yourself and I’m still having trouble finding any points you’ve made.

Icicle: “You said the reason that they are all lying is that they want free parking to continue. Why would they lie about the parking if it didn’t make any difference to them? Of course it makes a difference to them.

Yet, you’ve also said that it doesn’t make any difference to them.”

??? Ok then.

JB: “The DBIA shot themselves in the foot by not addressing those abusing the system.”

I have posted before that it is the DBIA’s problem and they should address it. I still stick to that.

However, the parking occurs on public property, and the City carries one of the solutions which is that they own the public off street parking as well. Those spaces can be a part of the solution as one can see from other communities who have aced the same “problem”.

The DBIA, by itself, does not carry any clout. They would if they partner with the City to implement a program of education, incentives to park of street, fines, removal of illegally parked vehicles, etc. The DBIA can do the first of those. They cannot take the law in their own hands with respect to the last three.

You are asking the impossible.

Of course, I am asking the impossible as well. This City, at this time, is not interested in working with the DBIA or any other group in this City. They are it! They are the authority! They love having that authority!

We have to face it, virtually every action this administration and this Council takes is authoritarian. The new RCMP building and the money they took from us to sink into that is the new symbolism of that authoritarian reality.

Gus,

I watched the video of Rod Holmes making his presentation to council. He said that most of the offenders have a City off-street parking pass displayed in their car.

So I walked by early in the morning before the stores opened to check it out. He was right. The passes are numbered. That means that the City knows who the offenders are.

I call them offenders, but they aren’t in the strict sense of the word. At best they ‘offend’ some City Councillors who have been too blinded by the greed of some possible revenue to read the City bylaws.

The bylaws say that these workers that park on-street are abiding by the bylaws. Good luck asking the DBIA to enforce anything–there’s nothing to enforce.

Exactly how do you educate a Federal Government employee anyways? The Federal Government isn’t even a member of the DBIA and how does the action of a government employee affect their job or the Federal Government? Why would they care how many on-street stalls are available for shoppers?

Assuming you could get the government on side, are they actually going to discipline a union employee for something that happens outside of work and isn’t illegal? I imagine the union would file a grievance.

If there is a parking problem, it’s the DBIA’s role to lobby the City to first change the bylaws.

I don’t see that there is a parking problem though. There’s always several spots open. I think the DBIA’s role right now is to prevent the return to pay parking. I’d argue that a petition with 3000 signatures is not easy to get–the DBIA has done a good job in this respect.

To sign this petition, you had to drive downtown, parallel park at the DBIA office, during a time when the DBIA office was open. People had to work to sign this petition. It had to have been important for these people to sign this.