A sidewalk in Prince George not properly plowed, is no place for a person in a wheel chair, especially in January or February when we can have temperatures below -30 degree’s.

There are miles and miles of sidewalks, and they are not looked after very well during the winter months. Will the City get better at this? Do they have the money to keep on top of this situation for a few people who wish to get about during the Winter months? I kind of doubt it.

It would be far cheaper to provide these people with some sort of transportation pass,so that they can get around without endangering their lives.

The sidewalks are, for people in wheel chairs I would imagine are crap. A good example, but by far not the only one is from Carney to the Dairy Queen on fifth, completely crap, not to worry about what the season is. I suppose this is why these kamikazes use the roads and go against the traffic. Actually I think the Kamikazes (electric wheelchair users should be licensed.

It’s not like they use the sidewalks that are good anyways so why would the city spend money on something nobody uses? And i agree, license the scooter users.

The City of Edmonton has any interesting way of dealing with the snow and sidewalk issue….keeps the taxes down too.

This quote is from the Edmonton website:

“Snow that remains on sidewalks is hazardous for everyone, but especially for people with limited mobility who may be severely injured from a fall on ice or snow. Uncleared walkways also make it difficult for people who deliver services in our city – mail carriers, meter readers, delivery drivers, firefighters, and paramedics. That is why the Community Standards Bylaw requires that you clean the public walks around your property down to the pavement within 48 hours of a snowfall.

Property owners are also responsible for clearing snow from every walk and driveway on or beside a property with buildings normally occupied by people, including derelict buildings.

When you remove snow promptly after a snowfall, you play an important role in keeping our city moving safely in difficult weather. Be your neighbourhood’s urban hero and make it great, within 48.”

Anotherside, that is all well and good, but useless and does not cover the sidewalks that don’t have a “neighbour.” And is this just a by-law that sounds good, but is not enforced. I doubt its enforced or enforceable.

The heck with basic infrastructure like sidewalks what do we need these for when we can have a 40 million dollar PAC.

to heck with monies put out for maintenance on infrastructure I need this for my worldly excursions abroad my sweet shari!!!!!

The sidewalk situation in this town, or any town for that matter should be very simple.

1. What it the total km of sidewalks we have.

2. set a standard for usable sidewalks for the most stringent use which would be for elderly people, people with strollers and wheeled grocery buggies as well as people in medichairs and wheelchairs.

3. Identify the total length of sidewalks which do not meet those minimum standards.

4. provide the total length of usable sidewalks

5. determine whether the rest are going to be maintained.

6. because poorly maintained sidewalks a re a lawsuit waiting to happen, those sections which will no longer be maintained are taken out of inventory and returned to their original state until we can afford them.

Let us stop pretending that we have something that we really do not have.

The same, btw, goes for bicycle lanes. Decide which are bicycle lanes and put up no parking signs and mark the pavement with bicycles only symbols including a direction arrow since there are enough cyclists that ride facing the traffic rather than with the traffic.

I’ve posted many a time about our roads, sidewalks are worse than any of our roads have been.

Case in point there is an apartment building full of retired citizens who have paid their fair share of taxes to the city as long as they have been here.

Directly in front of this property is a city “sidewalk” formed from asphalt and in absolutely terrible condition. You thing pot holes are bad on the street, well you should get a look at the sidewalk!

It’s absolutely shameful that the city would have something like this.

I would welcome Mr. Meisner and the 250 team to investigate this. If thay do I hope they can find a way to contact me via the email I used to register on this site.

The yuppie walk up Tyner gets snowed plowed the bushes trimmed quite regular.

Exploration Place museum washroom can be accessed by a wheelchair. That makes four.

Theater North West has a wheel chair accessible washroom, upto five.

Quit building sidewalks with back slopes on them. Backslopes make sidewalks uncomfortable to walk on, dangerous when slippery and almost impossible for wheelchairs. City have you civil engineers ever wondered why you see wheelchairs, runners and walkers on the road instead of the side walk.

Clearly, the answer is a sidewalk tax. You must pay to use the sidewalk.

Simply stay home until spring, sidewalks in Prince George were only constructed for summertime leisurely strolls. If the new PAC is built it can be used in all 4 Seasons. Does this not make total sense?

That is thinking out of the box moose

Trying to think how it could work, maybe a levy to all the households without insured vehicles for each person in the household over a certain age…

Maybe they would just have to go with sidewalk frontage on your property, but that isn’t user pay…I am sure they can come up with a plan that twists the knife a bit down at city hall

seamutt: I agree with you and they are STILL building them like this! “Oh, its for drainage.” That’s funny, because in Vancouver where there is a lot more rain than we get here, they are level! The crown of most streets is not even as much as they put into sidewalks, and that is for drainage too!

Why they maintain this standard is beyond me. We should take whoever set those standards or rather those who maintain them and make them walk a few miles on them, in the winter too when they are very icy.

Electric wheelchairs licenced. I always think that is funny considering no licencing required for bicycles or age limit for riding on roads.

The sidewalk infrastructure in PG is atrocious. Look at the Hart where there is a number of old folk community associations along the Hart and yet no sidewalks near any of them lol. Or no foot access to the Hart by sidewalk, we force them to walk on a busy highway with no shoulders and no street lighting. Its hopeless it seems and we can’t even maintain the sidewalks we do have.

Meanwhile I heard on the CBC this morning the mayor explaining that she needs to travel to China because that is how economic opportunities are created for PG.

Nope I disagree with licensing ‘electric’ scooters. No way no reason to. It would be just a tax grab and a needless regulatory hindrance on peoples freedom.

If a scooter gets run over 99% of the time its the scooter that pays the cost for the collision. Let those that need them live life.

Be careful what you wish for. Properly cleared and maintained sidewalks over the 6 months of winter will not be cheap.

I heard on the radio this morning that the budget for sidewalk clearing is $150K /yr. That is a mere pittance compared to what it would cost to do a full and complete job. And that money has to come from somewhere.

Vernon is another place that gives fines for snow on the sidewalks. The store owners are also out shoveling the snow in front and for the the stores that have side streets (like the Northern) their neighbours clear the frontage for them while they clear their side street.

Their is a tatoo place on 3rd Ave that makes sure that not only the sidewalk is cleared but the curb where the City leaves piles is also dug out. Because of his example the other business also clear the sidewalk.

I was downtown a few years ago and was trying to walk through the deep snow and when I went into a store and asked why they did not clear in front they told me that they paid enough taxes and it was the City’s job. I ask would it not be helpful to the shoppers to have clear sidewalks and I was told to complain to the City.
Store owner – is now our mayor.

“… heard on the radio this morning that the budget for sidewalk clearing is $150K /yr.”

That is not for clearing! It is for sidewalk maintenance and construction of new sidewalks. A couple of years ago the budget was $0.00 or in plain English: Nada!

@PG: If I misheard it, I stand corrected.

If there is no money budgeted, where is the money coming from when I do see those sidewalk bulldozers? Probably out of the general snow clearing budget I would guess.

graymare…I love that story!

as someone that walks and runs all year round on our sidewalks, with kids, without kids, with stroller, without stroller, i’ll give my observations. I actually think the city does a decent job of keeping sidewalks along the main roads clear after snowfalls, particularly ospika, 5th, 15th, westwood, massey. there are many areas in pg where the sidewalks mysteriously disappear.

case in point, walking along winnipeg towards parkwood place, by the overpass. if you are on the parkwood side, you reach the steps to get up to the staples parking lot. if you are unable to get up the stairs (wheelchair, stroller, physical issues), you’re out of luck. the sidewalk ends, unless you count the 14 inch curb that continues until the intersection. I’ve almost been hit by car mirrors trying to traverse this. no, you have to cross winnipeg, without a crosswalk, and continue on the other side of the road. or there is the sidewalk along massey by the skate park. power poles placed in the middle of the sidewalk!? who planned this?

as for the angled sidewalks in this city, i understand the reason in theory, but in my 3-plus decades of winters and springtimes in this city, I don’t think I’ve ever seen them work the way they were intended to. there is no less ice on the angled sidewalks than on flat sidewalks. I think it’s safe to assume that sidewalks are used more frequently in the snow-free months, but every sidewalk in this city was designed with an obvious flaw in order to be more easily used in the winter months. i run in the bike lanes for every snow-free month of the year because these sidewalks hurt my ankles. strollers are more difficult to push than they should be as they always pull towards the road. I can’t even imagine what it’s like to move around in a wheelchair, in the winter no less!

only 3 or 4 public washrooms in the city accessible by wheelchair? we should be ashamed. absolutely ashamed. imagine if it was your grandmother or grandfather, mother or father, in that wheelchair. it’s not alright and it is a big deal.

In the suburbs where we live the sidewalks get cleared the day after it snowed, always before the snow get cleared.

I do not know how well they are cleared and I do not know how often the sidewalk gets covered again, either partially or completely from street plowing.

I do not know what it is like downtown during or right after a snowfall.

As far as public washrooms go, we really have none in the downtown. One has to rely on stores that allow you access.

I was amazed to see the number of public washrooms in Washington as well as the ease of accessing washrooms in virtually every store. There is a law that requires stores to have washrooms that are accessible and available to the public.

Pine Centre Mall, Superstore, Walmart, have accessible washrooms.

Spruceland, Parkwood, Hart, CH shopping plaza the box store groupings … and on and on it goes, have no public accessible washrooms as store groupings.

This is not only a PG problem, but a Canada wide problem as far as I can tell. Simply a different culture.

Sidewalks in this City are generally an afterthought. We have few pedestrians. We have fewer people who ride bicycles. After all, they are a minority by far, a special interest group.

We all know on this site how much we care about minority special interest groups. In this case, the City is a reflection of the people who post here.

From the Citys website on snow clearing.

7.Sidewalks will be plowed in the downtown core and along major arterials when accumulated snowfall exceeds 50mm. The majority of this work will be undertaken by Night Shift to avoid pedestrian traffic. The downtown core is defined for purposes of this work as the area bordered by First Avenue and Fifteenth Avenues and Vancouver and Queensway Streets. Sidewalks in areas of schools and seniors group housing will be plowed where possible. Sidewalks in all other locations will be plowed as work schedules permit and if snow storage is available. Walkways will normally not be opened.

11. At bus stop locations, a boulevard area will be plowed for the convenience of bus passengers.

So there you have it. Prince George is a Winter City, and it would be almost impossible to keep all sidewalks clear for use by wheelchairs on a regular basis.

I don’t see any simple solution to this problem.

I know Vancouver doesn’t get much snow but they have an announcement carried on CBC site today about fines for businesses and residences that don’t clear sidewalks — I am sure the fine is enforceable as Vancouver has figured out how to collect parking fines (unlike PG);-)

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/british-columbia/vancouver-rolls-out-big-fines-for-uncleared-sidewalks-1.2449003?cmp=rss

Gus, if you spent some time outside of the suburbs, you would realize there are far more pedestrians in this city than you think.

on the issue of licences for the electric wheelchairs – I am pretty sure there would be a logjam of lawyers wanting to file a class action lawsuit under the Human Rights Act …

“Few pedestrians”! You serious?

Lots of pedestrians in this town. i am one. and there are many many more around. There are several issues here. One is way sidealks are built. The side slopes are ridiculous and I have slid down them, sidewise onto the roads when it is icy.Flat ice bad enough but slanted ice is way worse. Our asphalt sidewalks are crumbling before our eyes and if you think the roads are bad with potholes, the sidewalks are worse. Lack of curb cuts. For example, a cut at one end of a block but not at the other. Bad planning? Nobody cares? I don’t know the problem but its huge. Lack of sidewalks on main routes, such as by Parkwood or around Superstore/Costco area rarely go there because its so dangerous. Drivers who park on sidewalks.

The other problem is of course winter. Obviously hard to plow every sidealk instantly, just like with the raods. We know that the day of the snow or a day or so afterwards it will be hard to get around. But snow/ice on sidewalks a week later, on main routes? Lots of people try to get around this way and can’t even get to the bus stops becuz of the bad sidewalks. Imagine being unable to get groceries, much less to work or a medical appointment? Thats how ppl live in our winters. Its’ not ok.

Washrooms another issue. There are lots labeled accessible and some actually meet building code but code doesn’t mean functional. Haevy doors so that even able bodied cant open easily. Small stalls eg at library, civic centre hasa decent one but lock it when no functions is on. People have to plan trips around their bathroom use.

PG needs to do better. Much better.

The side slopes do nothing to rid the ice in winter and everything to make it more difficult to walk them. Regardless of season, pushing a stroller on those things can be downright painful. mikmaq described my experiences as a non-driving mother to a t. In PG you have to know the sidewalk tricks. You have to know which ones just mysteriously end with no warning, you have to know when the sloped curbs just disappear, you have to know which places have the telephone poles blocking your way. This is especially important in a wheelchair. You pretty much need a map showing all the possible hazards.

The clearing of bus stops always makes me laugh because so often you can’t actually safely walk to the stop as the sidewalk isn’t cleared. You basically need a ride to the bus stop to get there safely. Ha. And the neighbourhood routes? My old stop was never cleared once in the time I lived there (6.5 years). They did clear one further down the street but then they plowed onto the sidewalk so you couldn’t get there. It’s just a mess.

What I will never understand is how they plow the sidewalks and later in the day they plow the road and cover the sidewalk again. Not sure its like that everywhere but that’s how it is around my area.

i agree moose, this happens every time we get a big snowfall! we’ll get a dump and I’ll see the little sidewalk plows up and down ospika within a very reasonable amount of time. ‘perfect, great job guys’, i’ll say. within a day, and sometimes within hours, city plow trucks will completely cover the sidewalks. and when the plows cover the sidewalks, it’s usually worse than having 10cm or so of snow that’s fallen gently. instead, the sidewalks are covered in bowling ball sized chunks of hard snow and ice.

lhl, my wife is also a non-driving mom, so she feels your pain!

Screw the sidewalks, who cares about that anyways? I’d like to see Austin road plowed properly so that both lanes are usable. Its a fairly high traffic road eh

what? clean sidewalks of snow? that’s not in the budget! we need to buy property! if you want sidewalks maintained we need to implement another tax or levy! that’s this administration in a nutshell…forget infrastructure and services, we have to develop downtown and buy up property at a loss…no money for snow removal of any kind. plus the Canada Games are coming, gotta save cash for that because that will benefit the taxpayer (somehow).