So many questions:
1. Will this professional development take place during existing PD days for teachers or will it be added – don’t they already take part in PD on the existing PD days?
2. Will there be extra money to pay for this or will it come out of the pockets of the teachers? Other educators in university and colleges get funds to cover fees for workshops, etc.
3. Who will set the standard of what constitutes acceptable PD efforts? This might be quite contentious if the government asserts the authority and controls the nature of the PD effort.
4. Will this lead to a whole other layer of bureaucracy as yet more administrators are required to “manage” the extra PD
5. What measures will be put in place to assess the effectiveness of this effort? How will anyone know if it actually works?

It is far more likely that this is a punitive action to make life difficult for teachers who have already been through a lot of grief with this government. How much consultation has there been to this point? My guess is that there won’t be much consultation afterwards either.

All those trips to China are paying off for the cons . Fresh ideas from the Far East . All they need now is camps for teachers re-education .

Krusty, many others, myself included are required to meet annual professional development targets. We do so, on our own time and at our own expense!

Our teachers should do the same, on their time and at their expense! I pay for my own professional development. I sure as heck don’t think that I should pay for BCTF members! What makes them so special?

The BCTF constantly bleats that it’s “all about the kid’s!” and that “it’s for the kids!”. The BCTF should support any program that improves the quality of education that our kids receive. If Bill 11 does this, or even if it has the potential to do this, the BCTF should be the first in line to support it!

I suspect that as usual, the BCTF will be the last to support anything that makes waves and rocks their little boat!

I work with a bunch of engineers… they all get money from the company to pay for upgarding their skill, they do it while at work and get paid for it..and raise once they successfully complete the upgrade.. teachers should get the same thing.. but the good thing for teachers in BC is if a teacher isnt qualified they can always get a job in a private school..

If we really want what is best for our kids and their future should we not do everything to get the best teachers ? Helping them develop etc can only be seen as a good thing for the students.

poor little hart guy.. guess you work for the wrong company or in the wrong field.

P Val, in the corporate world, if the company wants to pay for the training and the shareholders are ok with it, then go for it!

In the public sector, we the taxpayers don’t get a choice to approve or disapprove, we just get the bill!

Are you intelligent enough to see the difference?

By the way, we already pay for teachers to upgrade their so called skills! Many teachers have gone on to obtain their Masters Degree, which automatically bumps them to a higher pay scale. They get a Masters and then they get more pay. Why should we pay for them to get more pay?? If you want more pay, then you should be prepared to pay the costs required to obtain the higher pay!! Where is their investment in their increased salary?

P Val, re your comment: “but the good thing for teachers in BC is if a teacher isnt qualified they can always get a job in a private school..”

You can’t be serious, right?? You are suggesting that public schools are full of qualified teachers while private schools are full of unqualified teachers! I’m sure that there are many, many private school teachers that might have a few choice words for you on that comment!

P Val, you, I and many others have occasionally made a rather silly or even dumb comments on this site! Congratulations, you currently are in 1st place!

Oh and by the way, I’m self-employed. I pay pay pay and it offends me that people like you think that I should pay even more!

Umm val its upgradeing, not upguarding. I agree with hart Guy. Some of the best schools are the private ones. I suppose you think we made 90 million dollars at the winter games also.lol while we gave free food to most the people. Up to 1600 free meals an hr. Yup lots of profit there.
Oh and some free tuition help up to $2500. for athletes. Payed by the taxpayers of PG of course. Im wondering, where is the $90 million?

My understanding is that this is about Pro-D days. The Ministry is concerned that some Pro-D days are spent fooling around and that others are spent on educational activities that may not be up to snuff. So they want to set standards for what it is appropriate for teachers to do on Pro-D days.

Come on PVal try to be a little more honest in what you say.

“but the good thing for teachers in BC is if a teacher isnt qualified they can always get a job in a private school.. ”

In fact – most private schools have to hire – well, just read it below.

They are divided into four funding levels: Group 1 schools employ B.C.-certified teachers, have educational programs consistent with ministerial orders and provide programs that meet the learning outcomes of the B.C. curriculum. They receive 50 per cent of the local school district’s per-student operating grant.

As for PD, I’m self employed, so I have to pay my own, I have to do 20 hours that can be verified, 20 hours that they take my word for it. On average it costs me out of pocket about $4,000.00 a year, because many courses aren’t available in PG so I have travel expenses to Vancouver.

But if the teacher’s get it covered – that’s not uncommon for employers to pay it. Likely it’s something they negotiated – in which case, likely something else they didn’t get.

I think the gist of what the province is trying to do, is make sure the PD the teacher’s do is relevant to what they teach.

They are divided into four funding levels: Group 1 schools employ B.C.-certified teachers, have educational programs consistent with ministerial orders and provide programs that meet the learning outcomes of the B.C. curriculum. They receive 50 per cent of the local school district’s per-student operating grant.

Group 2 schools meet the same requirements as Group 1 schools but are typically university preparatory schools with higher per-student operating costs. They receive a smaller subsidy of 35 per cent.

Groups 3 schools, which are not required to meet the Group 1 requirements, and Group 4 schools, which cater mainly to non-provincial students, receive no funding.

ski51.. its make things easier when you cut and paste the entire thing..rather than just what you want..

Group 3 schools dont have to meet the Group 1 requirements.. which one is.. BC certified teacher.. So in fact..you need to learn to read more better :)

By the way, we already pay for teachers to upgrade their so called skills! By that statement there Hart guy you haven proven your hate for teachers… so where would you be without them? I am guessing you had to go to school, and am guessing they had teachers.. must have been hell hating them all for you through all of grade school…not sure if you made into high school or not..or even made it through grade school…

You can’t be serious, right?? You are suggesting that public schools are full of qualified teachers (yes I am serious..its part of the hiring process)many, many private school teachers that might have a few choice words for you on that comment! Read Group 3 under the private schools.. teachers dont have to be BC certified to teach…

Hart guy.. just guessing but why do I think you are one of those people whos kids are perfect..they never got into trouble at school..they just got blamed for everything..blah blah blah..have heard it all before.

That was way to easy…lol

P Val

If all the teachers in the public school system are fully qualified why are they so dead set against any standardized testing or anything that looks at their performace or how well(or poorly)their students do.

A close eye is kept on student grades in the private schools and help is offered to substandard teachers and those who do not take the necessary steps to improve are not brought back.

Public system not following suit is another case of a union protecting those who do not deserve to stand at the front af a class. Too bad it is the kids that have to suffer as a result.

That being said there are a lot of good teachers in the public system. More a case of one bad apple….

P Val, you’re still #1 in my books, haha!

In case you missed out on what #1 I am talking about, reread my earlier post ;-)!

And in case you are wondering, I believe that there are good parents and there are not so good parents. There are also good children and there are also not so good children.

One of my issues with teachers is that while there are, and I have had, some very good teachers, there are also some that are absolutely useless and who should have been turfed a long time ago! The BCTF would rather protect them than admit that they are in the wrong profession! You seem to be ok with that! Perhaps you are one of those union workers whose best ability seems to be their ability to look busy while actually doing as little as possible! Shudder the thought!!

sparrow it’s like everywhere.. You have great teachers, good teachers, average teachers and not so good ones.. But that is everywhere in every job and or profession.. There are a few doctors I wouldn’t let take my temperature worrying they would take my eye out,, but others would have no problem if they had to hack me open to fix something.. But do we only mention the bad doctors when talking about them like we do with teachers..of course not.. why, not sure.

P Val – that’s why I used the word “most” Most private schools use BC Certified Teachers – so your comment that an unqualified teacher can always get a job at a private school – is confusing – I guess, they can always get a job at a Tier 3 or 4 private school – is that what you meant to say, because you left the impression that every private school would hire an unqualified teacher, and that’s why I took exception too.

I’ve always been curious about something – and I ask this without malice – what is it that people have against private schools – other than, they get half or less than the money that public schools get. (except for special needs, they get the same funding). It’s got to be about more than just money.

Do you see education like health care – one system for all. This has always perplexed me, because teacher’s by nature tend to be liberal arts, and liberals generally believe in choices, and private schools give choices to religious people to dig into their own pockets, and provide them their kids with a choice to go to a school where their faith isn’t mocked. And I have witnessed kid’s faith being mocked by pubic school teachers. Fact is, if a teacher did to a gay kid what they’ll do to a religious kid, they’d be fired – even BCTF wouldn’t try to save them.

The difference is that a truly incompetent doctor will face a peer review group that will assess if he/she can continue to practice medicine and suspend or revoke license if necessary. Thinning the weak from the herd if you will.

The bctf on the other hand will surround and protect the lame teachers.

The way I’ve looked at this new legislation is they are trying to put some accountability and structure into the concept of Pro-D days to ensure the money being spent is delivering equivalent value to the education system and most importantly the students. For arguments sake take 5 Pro-D days per school year x 41,000 teachers x $300/day average wages. Comes out to $61.5 million in wages alone paid to teachers on Pro-D days never mind whatever other costs are involved in providing the teachers the means to partake in whatever workshops, meetings etc they partake in on the Pro-D days. That’s of course assuming all 41,000 spend those days doing something that truly does enhance their skillsets as teachers. Does everybody participate fully? Do some take it as a day off? Do something for half the day then head home or off to the golf course? Bottom line if the system has to spend that sort of money I’m quite OK with them wanting to ensure they really are getting value back.

So there are 9 ppl making comments above. All have made errors of fact, but will keep on the red neck path. Just think 9 ppl out of the masses up north. Keep on spinning. The rest of us ignore you.

Sparrow are you really comparing physicians and teachers competency? Really….is that a fair comparison… Ones a teacher and one is making life saving decisions. There are many incompetent physicians practicing and that’s one of the reasons the hospital is over capacity. Far too many people are in hospital beds waiting for tests that can be done on outpatient basis. But because the physicians are so compitent as you suggest they leave the patients in the beds so they can continue to see them 1-2x a day so they can charge the system for their service. Too easy to blame the teaches at every opportunity. If the government is going to make the teachers attend workshops on pro D days there will be a cost and again the students will suffer.

re: hammer24 — For arguments sake take 5 Pro-D days per school year x 41,000 teachers x $300/day average wages. Comes out to $61.5 million in wages alone paid to teachers on Pro-D days

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

That is not a valid argument. Pro-d days were added to the school calendar in 1972. They were added to the calendar at the request of teachers with no change in pay to their contracts. Before 1972, there were 6 less days in the school year. So are these really paid days?

The other issue I have in regards to some of the other comments here is that professional associations do have to maintain and upgrade; however, the BCTF is not a professional association. And, if they were, they would police themselves as a professional association. The government is simply trying to shove this down teachers throats as another stick it to them. Some time in the 80’s the government forced the BCTF to choose trade union or profession. The teachers made their choice, and the government shouldn’t have both sides of the argument whenever they want it.

In my experience 95-99% of professional development is excellent. However, I have seen some teachers getting their boating licences, learning how to do oil changes for their car, and participating in yoga (not to teach it, but for their own”wellness”). I feel that if the BCTF didn’t spend so much time protecting their worst, the government wouldn’t have any leg to stand on going after them on this one.

a bit off topic – heard teachers salary is based on 9 hours of work per day. Teachers roaring into the parking lot at 8:30am as student are entering the school and leaving by 3:00 empty handed? paid or unpaid lunch break

P-Val You need to remember Hart guy figures he could do it better than Iker of the BCTF. He can do better than any teacher in the province and has it all figured out. I love to read his post for the free entertainment on how twisted some people can be. Some teacher I swear failed him and this is his way of getting even. Get over the failure hart guy. You’re all grown up now

Oh 8, you are hurting my feelings, NOT!

I think that just about anybody can do better than Iker! The problem is that any teacher with any shred of “smarts” wouldn’t lower themselves to take on the position of the head of the BCTF. Iker is the typical Union Leader, someone who wouldn’t have a job it he didn’t have a Union protecting him. These positions usually attract the biggest loser!

Need some proof? Who ran against Iker in the last election? Nobody!!

8, if you had paid attention in previous posts, you would know that I have family members who are teachers, I have very good friends who are teachers and I have many acquaintances who also happen to be teachers! During both my both my public school education and my post-secondary education, I had some excellent teachers, some average teaches and yes, some pretty lousy teachers.

I’m of the opinion that lousy teachers need to be urged out of the profession. 8, perhaps you think that lousy teachers should stay in the system, perhaps you had a few of them. Your comments suggest that you might have, haha!

“Some teacher I swear failed him and this is his way of getting even.” Nice sentence structure!!

Smooth you are once again taking BCTF propaganda from your union and spreading it to the world

1972 there were 199 school days with 192 being in session with pupils

2014 there were 189 school days with 182 being instructional days

Somewhere there was a loss of 10 instructional days so is this really a valid argument?

To add to your “experience” on pro-d days here is an article from the Sun from 2011:

http://blogs.vancouversun.com/2011/09/29/37487/

Hart Guy:
“It’s time to stop this unfettered growth in Government! It’s time to reduce the size of Government and the scope of the services that we demand. ”

Just wondering why you wouldn’t be railing against this latest gov’t move Hart Guy.

This gov’t just can’t seem to stop attacking teachers. This latest effort seems to be a great distraction to the current cuts boards are having to make.

1972/73 was the first year for pro-d days in the calendar., hence your numbers. The 10 missing days was part of bill89 that cut days to save money. . I am not sure but I assume until I’m pointed in the right direction that minutes were added to the remaining days to make up for it.

The proposal to make spring break 2 weeks saves around half a million per year in PG size districts.

I read an interesting thought from a retired Principal. He feels that the government desires constant educational unrest to drive parents/students towards private school. With a 6 year contract, they need to be creative in keeping the unrest alive.

Not sure if I can figure where those extra teaching days come from Smooth. I went to school prior to that 72/73 era you’re talking of. The school year began the day after Labour Day and ended in the last week of June, anywhere from June 25th to as late as June 29th. Christmas vacation ran about the same as it does now and if memory serves me right “spring break” was Easter break and it was no more than 5 days around Easter time. Pro-D days didn’t exist but it seems to me there was an equivalent but it only came about maybe once every 2 or 3 yejust ars. I remember it being a big deal for the kids when one happened. I don’t see how it’s possible to have 6 more teaching days now versus then unless classes are operating prior to Labour Day or into July.

karrman, I don’t view this as an attack on teachers.

We pay our teachers very well and we spend a lot of money on our education system, a lot but never enough according to some! When is enough, enough?

I view this as our Government trying to ensure that we are getting the best value out of the tax dollars that we spend on education.

Are Pro D days a good use of time and resources, or are they a waste of time and money? If you followed and read the article that slinky provided a link to in his comment above, you might find yourself asking the same questions!

I keep saying that it’s time to start rocking the boat when it comes to all levels of Government and the services that it provides. Nothing is sacred! I’m sure that the BCTF would disagree with me, haha!