“The CFIB says the main reasons for overspending are salaries and benefits to city workers…”

Didn’t really need a report to point out the obvious did we?

More crap from the mavens for privatization of publicly owned infrastructure.

Its been pretty obvious for some time that the salaries and benefits at the City are out of control.

We need to seriously consider a freeze as suggested above, plus we need to downsize through attrition etc;

Whats the chances of that happening.????

Whats the chances of that happening.????

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As long as CUPE is backing the Mayor and most of council I’d have to say “zero”.

The only person on council that would have the cojones to even suggest looking at staffing levels in all areas of the city would be Albert Koehler. The rest of them including our mayor have their heads so far up the CUPE leader’s backsides that you would be able to distinguish where one starts and the other one ends!
Perhaps as Palopu suggested a hiring and wage freeze needs to be implemented in all areas. Of course when you have the local Superintendent of the RCMP coming to the table asking for an increase of $1.4M to the policing budget that is something that will add significantly to the perceived increase in spending relative to growth and inflation!

@ Hahaha, more crap?

A quick glance at the City’s website shows positions currently available for part time “Aquatics Cashiers”!

Starting pay? $24.74 per hour! THAT’S $24.74 PER HOUR, FOR A CASHIER!!

PLUS, 12% in lieu of benefits!

@ Hahaha, if you want to talk “crap”, I’d suggest that it’s absolute crap that we, the taxpayers, are paying someone $24.74 per hour to be a cashier at our swimming pools!

$24.74 per hour for a cashier? And you don’t see the problem with this, Hahaha?

again to Hahaha!

Last week’s local newspaper showed a position available with the City, the position was a “Fire Administration Clerk”, providing reception and clerical support! Reception and Clerical support!

The starting pay?

$26.73 per hour! PLUS a comprehensive benefits and pension plan!

I am sure that if more people were made aware, fully aware of the full details of what our municipal staff are being paid, there would be thousands upon thousands upon thousand of outraged taxpayers, outraged over the largess laid upon our few hundred City employees!

These salaries that I have shown are JUST the ENTRY level rates of pay! Just imagine what we are paying for more senior staff members and for management!

Oh shut up about your “taxpayers”. I’m sick of that tired argument. The cashier that makes 24.74 an hour is a taxpayer too. In fact, I hazard a guess that the cashier probably pays more taxes than you do as a businessperson since, as an hourly employee, he or she doesn’t have half the deductions and/or exemptions that you do as a businessperson.

I’m sick of you small-minded conservatives thinking that every average working person making a living wage and benefits should have their standard of living cut while people like you buy another quad, Cadillac, 4000 square foot vacation home or add another 100,000 or more to an already stuffed bank account.

Freezing wages until private sector catches up? A person can make more in the private sector than in the public. Salaries for management maybe…protective services is 40% of the budget, wow. I saw two ambulances, and a fire truck show up to call yesterday, fire truck drove away before i drove away…im not saying fire fighters and ambulances are not needed, but come on axman and hart guy, its not the dudes on tools and their “benefits” that are breaking the budget here. And down sizing by attrition Palopu???? Ive heard a department that went from 14 trades people in the 80s/90s to 5 now, attrition for workers HAS taken place. More office staff attrition has not.

All CFIB measure shows is that the feds are divesting themselves of some responsibilities and the Province does the same to the Municipalities.

Cities are at the bottom of the hill which is where all the chit ends up.

That is what this is telling use. Nothing more.

The question is, when are UBCM and the federal equivalent going to be effective enough to turn the tide around??n the same.

Lazy reporting by CFIB!!! They get an F.

Hahaha, you state “I’m sick of you small-minded conservatives thinking that every average working person making a living wage and benefits should have their standard of living cut while people like you buy another quad, Cadillac, 4000 square foot vacation home or add another 100,000 or more to an already stuffed bank account.”

Hahaha, you obviously need to get off of your butt and go talk to many, many small business owner! Go talk to the owner of your local flower shop, or your barber shop, or your automotive repair shop, or your sporting goods/hunting shop, or your corner convenience store, or your Men’s or Ladies clothing store, or your favourite restaurant!

Go ask them how many hours a day, a week or a month they work? Ask them how much they can afford to pay their staff! Ask them how much they pay each and every year for municipal or provincial licences! Ask them how much they pay in municipal taxes! Ask them when the last time that they took a vacation was, and how long the vacation was while you are at it!

Hahaha, you haven’t get a clue, do you!

These small business owners, for the large part, are your neighbours! They live in an average home, drive an average car, and work hard each and every day in the hopes that they can earn an average wage!

Your suggestion that all business people buy another quad, Cadillac, 4000 square foot vacation home or add another 100,000 or more to an already stuffed bank account is laughable, just like your user name! Most small business owners would love to be able to generate enough business to pay themselves the hourly wage that we are paying aquatic cashiers!

Some business owners do very well, some do alright! Others worry about making payroll at the end of the month, let alone saving for in an already stuffed bank account!

Go ask around, Hahaha! I dare you!

By the way, as a small business owner, I do ok! What exactly is it that you do, Hahaha?

Yes we know some of you hate unions…but

They are paying the guy from the university..whats his name. $150,000 + or more a year with full benefits and a good pension.. and what have you heard from him..NOT A THING.. at least the cashier does something..

P Val, some of us have no use for unions and see them as nothing more than parasites!

With that being said, I have on several occasions stated that in my opinion, we need a complete review and rationalization of all public sector salaries, Federally, Provincially and Municipally, from the very top to the very bottom! I’m not picking favourites, let’s review all positions!

Now in your post, you state that they are paying the guy from the university .. what’s his name, $150,000+ or more a year with full benefits and a good pension.

Maybe what’s his name is worth $150,000 per year and maybe he isn’t. However, for comparison’s sake, I know several people that work at the pulp mills, and they are making $100,000 or more per year, with full benefits and a good pension! Good for them, but they put in their 40 hours a week and go home with no responsibilities whatsoever. What’s his name from the University probably works a lot more hours and has a lot more responsibility, but I’m sure that you will correct me if I am wrong on this assumption!

Posted on Wednesday, November 4, 2015 @ 11:52 AM by Hahaha with a score of 1

Oh shut up about your “taxpayers”. I’m sick of that tired argument. The cashier that makes 24.74 an hour is a taxpayer too.

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But he or she certainly doesn’t pay 24.74 an hour in taxes. Which is the amount of tax dollars needed to pay his or her wage.

Hahaha ask me. When I was a buisness owner I made a significant amount more that I do now working for wages. The reason was less taxes. The best thing was the ability to legally write off immense amount of deduction. It was great I made more money than i do now and I paid wayyyyyy less taxes…..needed a life change and accepted the change of income so no sad story here just reality.

Hart Guy… well the big difference is the guy working in the mill has to show up to get paid..who knows what goes on in city hall..

How do you know what hours “whats his name works” ?

I havent heard anything from him yet.. so maybe he doesnt so anything but sit in his office and plays candy crush..

Did what’s his name from the University actually go to work for the City??? If so the transition was very quiet. Hmmmmm. Perhaps he wants to keep a low profile.

unlisted wrote:-” When I was a buisness owner I made a significant amount more that I do now working for wages. The reason was less taxes. The best thing was the ability to legally write off immense amount of deduction. It was great I made more money than i do now and I paid wayyyyyy less taxes…..needed a life change and accepted the change of income so no sad story here just reality. ”
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You need an accountant that can explain the facts of life to you. From what you’ve written above, it sounds to me, (and I’m not an accountant, but I do, as a small business owner, have some knowledge of the subject), like you were “living off your depreciation”, as the saying goes. In other words, your business was becoming a hollowed out shell as you let it run down by not spending back into it each year at least as much as much as your annual depreciation.

“what’s his name from the University” was at Talktober events. Since you were not there, Palopu, you did not see him and could not talk to him. :-)

P Val, for some reason, when you mentioned “the guy from the university”, for some reason I thought you were referring to the President, Daniel Weeks! Obviously you were referring to Rob Van something or other, not Daniel Weeks!

So, now that my brain has kicked in (scary, eh?), I am certainly in agreement with your earlier comments!

As I’ve said before, over and over again, it’s time for a complete review and rationalization of our Public Service Sector, Federally, Provincially and Municipally, from the very top to the very bottom!!

There are many things one can deduct as a small business expense which are also personal perks

1. Reasonable number of trips to conventions, trade shows, and special continuing educational opportunities.
2. A vehicle
3. Office space in a house
4. Club memberships,
5. Annual meetings with “shareholders” (the inner circle family members)
6. Tools for business operations – computers, cameras, cell phones, etc.

Just a sampling

It goes without saying that one can only use such expenses if there is enough money being made in a business that one can afford them. In other words, when all the accounting is done, does the business have enough net income before taxes to reduce the net income before taxes. If one has to go further and further into debt by accessing the business line of credit in order to afford those “perks”, one is, of course, not handling the business finances properly.

Maintenance of business assets, whether they are hard or soft assets are, of course, a prerequisite to operating a business which has the best chance of survival.

You are forgetting how sole proprietorships and partnerships work. In any business a vehicle is not a “perk” unless you have a creative bookkeeper, you still have to record your personal mileage and business mileage. You still have to declare a taxable benefit on your personal taxes unless you are a sole proprietorship in which case your taxes are your businesses taxes. You can have a second vehicle for personal use but that negates the reason for your blog above. Office space in a house becomes personal income to which you have to pay taxes personally if you are not a sole proprietorship – in which case the businesses taxes are your taxes again. Club memberships are a taxable benefit. Meetings with shareholders are a corporate or partnership and in such most case would not have a home office but rather a rented space elsewhere, most meetings are stressful and not considered a “perk”.

Most people do not start a small business to get “perks”, it is much easier to work for someone else. Starting a small business or proprietorship has a lot of expenses which people have no clue about such as liability insurance and bookkeeping expenses, remittances, WCB rates, etc, all of which have to be covered even before you start to pay yourself and any employees. Yes you do have to pay WCB for personal income from your sole proprietorship business even though you cannot claim except for medical expense in the event of an injury (which in turn raises your rates), which BCMed already covers in case I might add if you are keeping notes.

Working for others I can still deduct my pickup and PPE and any equipment I used on the job. Are these personal “perks” as well? Check out the T2200, did that for years before becoming a sole proprietorship – which by the way is how most such businesses come into being. If you need to shield your assets you start a numbered or named company but the up front costs are more.

Thanks for that, Slinky. That’s not ALL that gopg2015 is forgetting. He talks about the business having a “line of credit”, which many businesses need to have for operating purposes. But to maintain that line of credit the business has to be profitable, for it’s from a division of profit that the principal portion of the loans advanced will be repaid.

Small businesses are generally NOT in the same unique position governments and the occasional large business are in ~ where they just get to make the interest payments, while still being able to access needed credit in periods when they can’t take in enough to repay their borrowings.

And in a small business you can’t have it BOTH ways ~ either you’re going to have to try to report profits that are large enough to support your future credit needs from your banker, or you go the other way and try to minimise them to reduce income taxes. Which WILL affect your ability to borrow needed funds when they are needed.

I posted a website that lists all BC public service sector salaries once before on this site. Healthcare, ICBC, Ferries….you name it! I am not going to post the link again as I do not want any more people to blow a fuse.

Nobody (nobody!) in the public service needs to be paid 487,000 dollars plus benefits per year, year after year!

All this is the result of a pecking order syndrome: If the public sector worker gets paid a certain amount, the supervisor’s prestige demands that he/she gets paid more than him/her. Then the manager must get more than the supervisor, the department head MUST get more than the manager, the CEO must get more than the assistant CEO, the minister must get more than the deputy – and so forth!

However, since the taxpayer has no power to object it all boils down to the idea how the maximum amount of feathers can be extracted from the golden goose with the minimum amount of squawking!

Good posts, Hart Guy and Palopu!

My wife also had a small business. It couldn’t afford a vehicle so she provided hers and charged mileage to the company. She paid for all her training and safety courses before starting the company. She (and I) provided all the furnishings and small reno out of our pocket for her to start. We provided the computer and software for her to start. She made about 2000 per month for a number of years and had time to spare to volunteer as PAC chair at our children’s school.

Not all small businesses have buckets of money raining down on them from heaven.