thats nothing, wait till we see the costs to rip it all out and put in lights when they finally admit the roundabout was dumbest idea ever.

Another one of the Cities planning that will go very wrong. To expect large trucks to make turns like this is asssssssinine to say the very least. But whatever! It falls into place with all the other stupid ideas they have put into action.

When this roundabout is finished and open, it will be comedy at it's best!! I hope they install web cams, just for the entertainment! I everybody learns to drive it properly, it will be great. It is one of the best ways to move traffic at a busy intersection, if driven properly!

Everyone should go and practice at the Casino. Maybe that is the reason that John and Collin put that one in there, for practice for the new and improved one at the Cameron Street Bridge.

Have a great day everyone

Yes, it will be entertaining when a dumb driver gets squeezed out by a 100 foot long semi. Sure the little Honda legally had the right of way, but the 600hp semi pulling 80,000 lbs of goods wrong as he may have been, still is the king of the road.

Why didn't the truckers request this duing the planning process?

You guys are missing the point here;
The engineering screwed up.
If they did not consider the length of the trucks plus turning radius in order to negotiate the roundabout, then they simply messed up. The engineering firm should pay for the remedial work, not the taxpayers. (or was it engineered by city blokes?)
Also, I am one of the supporters of a roundabout for this intersection, and others to follow, I hope. Some people either cannot accept change, or do not understand the fundamentals of negotiating the roundabout, and their fear causes them to lash out against the unfamiliar concept.
metalman.

"Why didn't the truckers request this duing the planning process?"

Likely because they thought that the engineers knew how to do this. There is even a traffic engineer at City Hall, even though the actual desing was likely done by consultants.

The truckers likely looked at it as they were passing by the construction in progress, so they would not have seen it before that.

There are handbooks with standards for these sort of things. Perhaps everyone jsut wanted more elbow room to allow that little red miata some room to hide next to teh truck on the inside of the turn side.

The engineering firm can likely point to the standard as well as the preliminary drawings signed off by the City in their defense.

http://onlinepubs.trb.org/Onlinepubs/nchrp/nchrp_syn_264.pdf

from Mission Viejo
All roundabouts shall be designed to allow single passenger cars, pickups, SU trucks and city bus operation without the use of a truck apron. Larger trucks will require the use of a truck apron, especially on single lane roundabouts. A moving van, fire truck and/or WB 50 truck shall be used to check for the ability to navigate the roundabout using truck aprons but without striking any of the outside curbs, signs, utility structures or splitter islands.
http://cityofmissionviejo.org/viewdocument.aspx?id=5194

On top of that, of course, there is simulator software available for this type of design which makes it much easier for today's engineers.

http://www.transoftsolutions.com/ProductTmpl.aspx?product=AT

The truckers did request this during the planning process. At one of the planning meetings they asked for a comparision roundabout and when they were told that it was the same size as one in the lower mainland they stated it would be too tight and wrong for our winter weather. The engineers did state that they knew it would be tight and that when a truck was in the round about a car would not be able to be in it at the same time. At that time everyone in the room asked why waste the money on the roundabout and just leave the intersection as it was. The eningeer said the roundabout would be cheaper than putting in lights and we all asked why not use the lights they had. NO answer.

I can't wait until winter, the slope on the roundabout should account for a few accidents. Poorly planned poorly designed.
PG drivers still haven't figured out how to properly negotiate a merge, can't wait to see how they do with a traffic circle.

Did ICBC officials have any part in the planning process?

"PG drivers still haven't figured out how to properly negotiate a merge", a round about is one big continuous merge lane.

"when a truck was in the round about a car would not be able to be in it at the same time.", I thought the point of a round about was to have traffic moving?

I hope the truckers just say f@#$ it, and drive hard through this to prove how dumb this idea is.
Trouble is it will cost $$$$$$$$$$$$$$ to fix this brainiac's foible.

Better make sure (to all the engineers) that this thing will work flawlessly! Or YouTube will have a field day!

Doctors bury their mistakes but engineers can't and have to live with them!

Good Luck!

Cheers!

I understand that the City was told that the roudabout was to tight, however they had it built anyway. Then it was tested with a truck, and shown conclusively that it was to tight. They then tore it out and did it over again.

The roundabout might be cheaper than lights, but only because if you had lights on the North End of the Bridge all the Northbound traffic would be backed onto the bridge, and this would require additional work on the bridge itself to support the weight.

The main problem with this roundabout it that it is **small** and not specifically designed to handle the big super b trucks, or chips, diesel, gas, etc that will go through it on a regular basis. Three Super B Trains going East to the Pulp Mills will block off the exit and entrance to the bridge. Once its blocked you have a problem. because traffic om a roundabout always has the right of way. Traffic coming off the bridge going North could have trouble getting into the Roundabout during peak traffic periods.

The whole concept of this new bridge was to speed up traffic, and to handle all the increased traffic. (God knows where the increased traffic will come from)

To rush traffic across this bridge just to slow it down so it can enter a roundabout seems to be somewhat self defeating.

This whole bridge fiasco has been frought with problems from the get go. If it wasnt so expensive, and such a waste of taxpayers dollars, it would be hillareous.

It was built on a **shoe string** budget, with a **Mickey Mouse** mentality.

There are lights on the south side of the bridge so that there will be traffice backed up on the bridge from that light. I hoped they planned for weight for that light.

good idea city,it will work fine.only the people who can't figure out how to use it will have problems with it.

"this would require additional work on the bridge itself to support the weight."

?????? so you are trying to tell me that if there is a traffic backup because a chicken is crossing the road, the bridge would collapse? Unbelieveable!!!

It comes down to Engineers having no common sense. They get tunnel vision. Anyone else agree...

The roundabouts in Dawson Creek (middle of town) and FSJ (by the airport in an industrial part of town) seem to do the trick. The FSJ one is pretty big but the Dawson Creek one is pretty small.

It is beyond belief, if it is true what Pal states, that the super B trains etc. were not considered in the design of the r'about As for the bridge not rated for standing traffic....well I don't believe that, engineering of anything that takes a load always has what, 2X safety factor?
No, I think we could park a fleet of D-11 Cats on the bridge blade to multishank ripper, and still have a bridge.
metalman.

If you have lights on this bridge they would have to be on the North End. This would mean that all traffic going North would immediatly back up on the bridge, because there is no space North of the Bridge. Is the bridge designed to hold all this traffic at a standstill while the light is red???? I dont know but you can rest assured that there must be some reason for putting in the Roundabout.

The City has stated that the Roundabout was cheaper than a lighting system, which doesnt seem to make sense, however they also indicated that if they put in lights, they would have to put in additional work on the approach to the bridge and this would cost money. Maybe the additional work is related to approaches rather that weight restrictions, in any case the Roundabout was chosen over the lights because of cost.

If the Super B Tankers, and Chip Trucks, block traffic going North off the Bridge, then that traffic will back across the bridge and have the same effect as a light.

I think that the Roundabout will work fairly good during slow traffic periods, however during peak periods, it will certainly slow down traffic and cause some problems. If it is bad enough then some of the traffic that would normally use the bridge will go back to using 5th Avenue, and Carney, via the John Hart Bridge.

The bottleneck at the North End of the Bridge, and the loop, de loop at the South end, aggravated by the stop lights coming off River Road going UPHILL and West, plus the **go when you get a chance** left turn onto Carney off of first Avenue will make this whole process an excercise in futility.

Have a nice day.

Of course cost is no problem when we're building a castle for the RCMP?

Just because a truck can fit in the roundabout does not mean that things will go smoothly. Remember, everything is moving and you have people constantly merging in and out. EX. a guy in car wants out, a chip truck is heading straight through - guy in car must brake, bimbo smacking gum, talking on phone, drinking coffee and styling hair isn't paying attention and you have your first rear-ender, pardon the stereotypes.

Put an elephant in a hallway, sure it fits, then add a kindergarten class and ring the recess bell - that's what this roundabout will be, then it'll snow.