250 News - Your News, Your Views, Now

October 27, 2017 4:37 pm

Friday Free For All – July 14th

Friday, July 14, 2017 @ 12:00 AM

It is time to speak up on the issues that matter to you.

It’s time for the Friday Free For All.

You pick the topic,  but  as always obey our  three simple rules and respect the  others  even if you do not agree with their opinion.  Comments which  bully  others will be  at the very least edited,   possibly removed, and the  writer may lose their privileges.

Keep it clean

Keep it legal

No Bullying.


The folks who were complaining about the perceived lack of action on the part of First Nations on behalf of fire evacuees may be interested to know that both Nak’azdli and Takla bands held fundraisers this week.

Happy Bastille Day!

    Do you mean what Chief Joe Alphonse of Tl’etinqox said about RCMP dodging bullets? That’s not Anahim Lake, its Anaham reserve, the Chilcotin reserve near Alexis Creek. The reason he’s not in jail is because: (a) the RCMP understand that it wasn’t a real threat; (b) trying to arrest him would escalate rather than defuse the situation.

    Thanks Bill, a positive note.

So I’m just wondering….does anyone know what kind of coating or oil YRB was putting on our bridges last week? I’m just curious about the purpose.

    It’s an anti corrosive and it’s not an oil either as oils are slippery and that would be plain silly to put on a bridge over water

      smells like linseed oil to me. soaks in to the concrete, protection from winter salt.

Maybe they will build it in Lheidli T’enneh Memorial Park. Don’t worry though it would probably be built on an unused part on the west edge off of Ingledew Street.

Thanks to all PG who have stepped up and donated or helped the evacuees.. excellent work :)

Guess there a couple of people here who want to see if they can get this free for all section permanently turned off.

    If so, it’s probably due to folks like Eagleone, and the like, who think this is their personal forum. Their endless blatherings, are ridiculous.

      I have no trouble scrolling past posts like Eagleone’s. He is entitled to his opinion and as long as he is civil about it I don’t see him getting into trouble. The racists that seem to post a lot shouldn’t be tolerated.

      Hey, c’mon, don’t call them ridiculous, makes you sound like you know something. I read his posts and sometimes I learn from them.
      He isn’t racist, not negative, so mind your own.

      What racists? I have yet to see any comment here that could be interpreted as racist.

      Really, Dirtman? Then you must have a totally and completely different definition of racist than the rest of Canadian society. They stand out like a sore, suppurating thumb!

      I really doubt Elaine would leave racist comments here, so I think you imagination is running wild.

    Really? Who? And why?

      Their posts about First Nations people were deleted, so my original post has lost it’s context.

      My reply to another post was deleted but it wasn’t racist so probably because it lost context without the original post. I said: “Maybe they will build it in Lheidli T’enneh Memorial Park. Don’t worry though it would probably be built on an unused part on the west edge of the park on Ingledew Street.” It was referring to a native court. I believe the park should go back to the descendants of the original inhabitants. I don’t believe a simple name change is near enough. (:

Hi Opinion 250

Please loose the annoying rotating adds on the home page. Ya I know it’s revenue but that stuff went out in the 80’s

    It’s called revenue.

      And it’s why it’s free for us to use.

      It’s called an adblocker. I haven’t seen an ad on this site for years. I’m not an impulse shopper so I would never click on them but they are an eyesore.

      I see some ads at the top but they don’t interfere with the posts at all, so I hardly even notice them. Is that what the complaint is about?

    Browse with Google Chrome and use an Ad Block Extension. Works perfectly.

      Or use Widows 10.

      You use Widows x 10 old timer? You must spend half your pension on Viagra pills:D

I am curious to hear what, if any, experience you have had volunteering or assisting in any way with the fire crisis in the area, along with the negatives and positives. I have been volunteering at CNC.

It’s nice to see so many people happy to arrive in PG for a change, but what a shame that we still don’t have a great municipal campground to host our guests at so the word could spread and they would know they have a place to stay when ever they wanted to return next time as a tourist.

    The private campgrounds are having a rough enough time keeping their heads above water with all the people boondocking at the casino and walmart. The last thing they need is competing with a campground that is backed up by the public purse where break even would be a win. Sanidumps are free with purchase of fuel at a number of local stations and I’m sure most would waive any fee for people currently under evacuation.

    Those residing from Williams Lake north already come to town for shopping at Costco etc mainly day trips. For recreational activities a drive south for them would be a much more likely scenario as the Okanangan has a lot more to offer tourists.

In the last week I have seen both the good and bad side of PG

First the good

People opened their hearts and homes to the evacuees
The city was very well prepared to handle the influx of evacuees unlike Kamloops which apparently was quite disjointed if anything the biggest complaint was the lack of signage designating and showing where the entrance to CNC was
I can’t volunteer due to work but I’ve done my best to help by offering a place for a family to stay and I’ve taken where I could families with kids out for meals and no commitment to which those that I’ve taken have been appreciative
Citizens have been going to the evacuation centres and offering hugs and food and help with pets which for many evacuees it’s overwhelming to say the least

The bad

Several residents of PG are upset that they are inconvenienced because the evacuees have taken over or are offered free admission to venues which apparently has angered a few people and I’ve actually seen 2 people complain to city hall that they are upset the evacuees are getting preferential treatment. I wonder if those 2 were some of our resident nay Sayers on this site
Thefts and scammers are preying on the evacuees which in my opinion is deplorable these people need to be sorry to use an American euphemism “But these scammers and thieves need to be shot”

Overall I believe so far it’s been a positive experience for the evacuees but understandablely many are worried and stressed and want to go home and by and far most citizens I’ve seen in PG have done their very best to help out and make the evacuees feel at home

    For those that complain, all I can say is “Get Stuffed!”
    Open your hearts and minds, volunteer, do some good for others, makes yuh proud.

    Some people are real pieces of work. A little inconvenience and patience is a small price to pay to show a little compassion to those affected by these fires….

I agree with your comments Dearth. On the whole, the people are very appreciative and sometimes overwhelmed at the support they are receiving, and as a volunteer, I just try to make them feel welcome and let them know that we know that if we were in the same situation, we know they would do the same for us.

Every day it seems, there are improvements to communication, requests and services and the officials have done an AMAZING job in organizing all of it! Having so many evacuees suddenly arrive, many unfamiliar with the City, or unable to get around that well, has been so confusing and stressful for all of them.

We can only hope and pray that weather and fire conditions imoprove!

The only negative comment I’ve personally heard is from someone who has been taking a course at CNC and suddenly finds herself hard put to park because the parking lot is occupied by evacuees and unable to write an exam at the scheduled time because the room is taken and so forth. She isn’t opposed to taking care of the evacuees but she wished that it could be done in a way that wasn’t so disruptive for CNC students such as herself.

I’m a little disappointed that nobody is joining me in celebrating Bastille Day.

    “Happy Bastille Day” to you too, Bill. It’s a great day!

      Thanks Grizzly2!

    So does Bastille Day celebrate the storming of the Bastille? If so, it’s not something that should be celebrated.

      You think the French Revolution was a bad idea?

      It was an incredibly bad idea. I’ve read a somewhat detailed history of that event. It was one of the most horrific acts of barbarism in all history, way too much to detail here, but if you like I can describe what went down at the Bastille.

      So you think the continuation of an out of touch monarchy and elites that didn’t care that people were starving in the streets was a better idea than the French Revolution?

      No, but the revolution was absolutely unnecessary. People were hungry because of the global cooling known to historians as the Little Ice Age when crop failures were common. Much of Europe adopted the potato as a staple food rather than grain which helped them survive, but the French resisted it. The king had no control over the climate but he did everything he could to promote the spud, to no avail. The queen regularly brought throngs of poor in to eat. They were very popular amongst the people, but rabble rousers turned the public against them and instituted one of the most barbaric episodes in world history. The people were much worse off than they had been under the monarchy.

Anyone who is upset, mad, or inconvenienced please look up the word Empathy. And just be thankful it’s no you evacuating.

People have lost everything and some is complaint about parking doesn’t get much more selfish me thinks.

    P Val, For once I absolutely agree with you. These people are facing what very well may be the hardest and most stressful time in their lives. I think they deserve our help, compassion and empathy.
    The majority of us placed in the same situation would be frightened and would welcome any assistance provided to us.
    In times of crisis it’s important to be there for eachother and offer support in any form. That may include having to give up a parking spot for a few days to someone who’s possibly had their life long home burn down.

Just curious why they used CNC as the registration point. Wouldn’t CN center have been a better place, lots more parking and a large buildings for housing and registering people. Is it because it may cut into someones revenue? The place looks empty half of the time.

    Good point. Maybe they figured that CNC would be easier for people who don’t know PG to find since it is right off the highway?

    My guess is it’s easy to find and somewhat centralized whereas the Multiplex is off the beaten path and it’s not centralized

    Well maybe because CNC has a gym and a restaurant, centrally located.. etc..

    CNC has a cafeteria, washrooms, accommodation space, parking space, all in one spot.

    Right now, the ‘Circus/midway’ is set up at CN parking lot. CNC is easy for out of town folks to find.

It’s been a tough week for the climate change deniers and the climate change refugees . This week the largest iceberg ever , broke off Antarctica with twice the volume Lake Erie and our province is on fire .

    First question: What climate change deniers? I keep hearing that phrase but so far haven’t heard of anyone who actually denies that climate changes, unless you’re referring to the global warming alarmists who seem to deny that climate ever changed before.

    Second question: What climate change refugees? I’ve heard predictions of hundreds of millions of such people who were supposed to be flocking to higher ground or cooler climates by now, but there aren’t any.

    Third question: What exactly is your point about natural occurrences like ice movement or forest fires?

      It’s been more than 12 hours Ataloss, and I’m still waiting for a response.

    Ataloss, I don’t know anyone who denies the climate is changing, what they don’t believe is the BS that’s being fed to us.
    Climate engineering, solar radiation management are ongoing programs changing the climate of the world. Severe and bizarre weather events, floods, tornadoes, large hail storms, massive fires all lead back to engineered weather programs and the patents for these programs. The aluminum, barium and strontium act like a desiccant, taking humidity out of the atmosphere. We’ve had a cool wet spring and now suddenly things are completely dry. The cold front the meteorologists are saying is moving across the area. A cold front? In the summer? Used to be called a low, but they have to account for the nucleated cool down and drop in temperatures. This is costing the taxpayers of our province/country billions of dollars in damaged infrastructure. A document “Owning the Weather 2025” – look it up. The information is out there – look it up. Better than that, use your own reasoning and ability to think critically. Look up! Are these the clouds, skies that you saw as a kid, or even as little as 3 years ago? The silvery white skies behind the actual clouds you can see in the sky. Look at the temperatures in India, and Sudan. This is on the record. “There would be winners and losers in climate engineering programs. One of the drawbacks to climate engineering is the droughts that would occur in Asia and Africa”
    ht tp://www.geoengineeringwatch.org/climate-engineering-dangerous-proposal-or-lethal-reality/

Thanks to all the firefighters throughout the province for doing thier very best in fighting the dragons. Unbelievable lowlifes that actually can steal from those not able to protect their homes. Hope they all get caught by the RCMP

CNC has waaay more parking space, a cafeteria, gym, resident housing if needed, plus is easier access from the highway for RV’s etc. The childcare space is also being utilized, I believe. Just a better location all around for this situation I think.

The awesome, unstoppable revolutionary electric-car revolution that doesn’t actually exist

The real story being missed is just how pathetic things look right now for electric cars


So far, because nobody’s really driving these miracle machines, said mania has been limited to breathless news reports about how the electric-vehicle revolution is about to rock our world. EVs comprise just two-tenths of a per cent of all passenger vehicles in North America, despite the media’s endless hype and efforts of green-obsessed governments to cover much of the price tag, like Ontario’s $14,000 rebate for Tesla buyers. In Europe, where virtue-signalling urban environmentalism is the coolest, they’re not feeling the vehicular electricity much more: EVs account for barely one per cent of personal vehicles in France, the U.K. and Germany. When Hong Kong cancelled Tesla rebates in April, sales fell to zero.

ht tp://business.financialpost.com/opinion/kevin-libin-the-awesome-unstoppable-revolutionary-electric-car-revolution-doesnt-actually-exist/wcm/2a1f30a4-88f1-47c2-aba4-8b619c0129f0

    Why does it make you happy if an alternative energy vehicle technology fails? What is it to you to want to see electric cars fail to take hold? Do you own a gas station, an oil well or company? An auto repair shop?

    Exactly why is it that fossil fuel luddites like yourself endlessly giggle and hope that an alternative to gas vehicles fails?

      What makes you think that the failure of electric cars would make me happy? I don’t hope that an alternative to gas vehicles fails, I actually don’t care. The point is, contrary to their cheerleaders, electrics are not an alternative to gasoline vehicles and I just point that out.

      I also get upset because governments are wasting so much taxpayer money to prop up a non-viable product.

      There is no evidence that electric vehicles are unviable, and governments have subsidized plenty of supposedly “unviable” technologies (space exploration anyone) from which a plethora of tech has made its way into everyday life.

      Plenty of materials we take for granted would have never saw the light of day without government subsidy. There is no way private business would have invested the dosh for space flight. It took government to spur that.

      Electric vehicles have come a long way in just a few short years precisely because government is willing to subsidize the development costs of new technologies in battery development and material science for these vehicles.

      Also, what makes me think you would enjoy seeing e-vehicles fail? Your constant posting of negative news regarding e-vehicles is what tells me you would enjoy seeing them fail. Frankly, you remind me of certain people I have seen in a hobby that I engage in: home theatre. These types hate 3D television. They are ecstatic that manufacturers are dropping 3D support on TVs and take great pleasure in rubbing it into others who enjoy 3D content and are now facing the certainty that their collections 3D films will become unwatchable once older 3D Capable sets die.

      No, I’d be quite happy to see electric vehicles succeed. On their own. But they can’t. So governments shouldn’t be propping them up with my money. And space exploration is no comparison, apples to oranges. The people here who gush over electric vehicles are ignoring reality, as the FP article clearly demonstrates.

      Here’s a thought – how about you actually read it before commenting.

The Financial Post is not exactly a good reference point on climate change. I think it would be more like a trump forecast. It would provide good information for the none believers

    You mean money talks and BS walks? Good point.
    But, we are warming up, even the Inuit who have always been able to get their caribou, things are changing. Now we’ve got moose taking a dip in the Arctic Ocean. I think our loss of moose locally is that they’re going further north for feed, due to foliage spraying so the trees will grow, and plants that never grew north of Germansen are growing.

    But the Financial Post is a very good source for information on economics, which is what this article is about.

Funny little opinion pieces by fossil fuel lobby don’t destroy facts . June sales of EVs in Germany were up 177 % . They have also gone through the roof in China . Sales in canada are dismal compared to the rest of the world but this is also changing . For the real story see . Insideevs.com . The sales numbers tell the truth . The fossils can’t afford to tell the truth . But by all means invest in fossils . Buy some KML .T and you too can own a future stranded asset . They’re cheap and getting cheaper .

    Keep buying those EV’s and solar panels..The mining industry loves it..!

      I just came back from visiting my cousin in New Mexico who gets almost all of his power from solar panels. Just a wee bit of fuel now and then when it is overcast for several days and the batteries run down. Granted, Prince George is tougher than New Mexico for solar power, but solar power really does work.

    Did you know if one person owns an electric car and another person buys one, then sales just went up 100%. That figure means nothing.

    “Granted, Prince George is tougher than New Mexico for solar power, but solar power really does work.” .. I don’t think many people deny that solar power works. Running a house off of solar panels is way different than claiming you can run cities and an entire grid in a climate like Canada with solar. Also trying to run an electric car in Canada in -30/-40 during the winter is laughable.

      That’s what I’m curious about as well. How does the current crop of EV’s stand up in extreme weather? Too hot and you need to run the AC. Too cold and you need the heat…

      Once those issues are worked out then EV’s will really take off….

      I know a guy who lives south of PG off the grid because the hydro lines were never extended to the end of his road, and paying Hydro to do it is prohibitively expensive. He runs his house on solar….most of the time. His heat is wood, his hot water is propane but his lights are solar…most of the time. When he wants to run the washing machine he fires up his diesel generator.

      So yes there’s a place for solar here, just not a very big place.

    Record sales for fossil powered vehicles too.

    Germany hits 1% of sales to the EV-Hybrid market, rock solid start to the year! 1% of that 1% are Tesla’s. Ssangyong sold as many electric cars as Tesla…

    In China too where they are having a stellar year for EVs just passed 1% in total EV-Hybrid sales. At this rate they will be at 20% sales by 2020 as projected! Tesla’s sales are only 4% of the Chinese electric car market – BAIC sells 22% of all Chinese plug in vehicles. Even the Zhidou sells more than 4 times as many cars as Tesla and theirs looks similar to the smart cars they used to sell here – and they just started selling cars two years ago. Of course the car only has a MSRP of 49,800 yuan (158,800 before 109,000 yuan in subsidies and a range of 120 km but…

If it becomes law, S.B.100 would put California on par with Hawaii, the only other state with a 100% renewable portfolio standard (RPS), the Sierra Club points out.

“While the federal government abandons its commitments to clean energy, California is showing that we will continue to drive the transition away from fossil fuels,” states Kathryn Phillips, director of Sierra Club California.

Citing the Hawaii House of Representatives, the Sierra Club says progress toward meeting Hawaii’s 100%-by-2045 RPS has already saved the state “over a quarter of a billion dollars by reducing reliance on more expensive fossil fuels.”

Phillips adds, “Now that S.B.100 has passed the Assembly Utilities and Energy Committee, it is critical to move it quickly to the floor and the governor’s desk.”

The Sierra Club says eight California cities have already committed to transition to 100% clean energy; Santa Barbara recently became the 37th U.S. city to adopt this goal

    Move to California I say.

      I say , don’t expect that the states are going to be a market for BCs electricity exports in the future .

    Eventually reality will catch up to them.

Just check out Germany on how to help save the environment… they outlawed garbage dumps in 2005ish. Huge solar panels …etc.

As per usual they are extremely efficient, they have even designed an very environmentally friendly house that uses about. 10th of the energy to build it and a extremely efficient / friendly building…

    Germany is having real problems because of their fanatical obsession with environment. Renewables have pushed up the price of electricity to the point that 300,000 households get their power shut off for non payment every year and industry is having trouble competing.

    In a ridiculous panic after Fukushima, they shut down their nuclear reactors to avoid a similar situation – damage due to tidal wave, even though no such wave could ever have reached one of them. As a result they ended up importing nuclear generated power from France and they’re planning more coal generators to fill the shortfall.

    Because of their obsession with saving water, everything is so low-flow that there isn’t enough water in the sewers to properly move the waste material, so municipalities have to frequently flush them with copious amounts of water.

    Obsessed also with recycling, they go to considerable effort to sort out anything that can conceivably be re-used, but for much of it there simply is no market and it goes from re-cycling facilities to the waste facilities.

    Yeah, let’s follow their example. NOT!

      Dirtman:”Germany is having real problems because of their fanatical obsession with environment. ”

      Germany’s area is about one third that of the province of B.C.! If you had all that industry (vital for sheer survival) and 88 million people squeezed into that small area you would be fanatically obsessed about the environment as well!

      Have you ever been to Germany and to some of the other countries it has borders with? They too add to the environmental pollution! It is very easy to condemn from here, from the second largest country on Earth!

      As a matter of fact, I have been to Germany, home of my ancestors, and a beautiful country it is. Not all that crowded because such a high percentage of it is habitable, unlike BC. If crowding was a problem, wind and solar are the wrong way to go, they take up a lot of space. And they wouldn’t be bringing in millions of immigrants.

      Their problems come from that fanatical obsession – sewers that won’t work properly because of lack of water flow, when they have plenty of water, wasting time and effort to sort out recyclables that end up in the waste facility anyway. None of that has to do with shortage of space.

      Dirtman,you are wrong! It is amazing that Germany has enough water for all the 88 million who live there, plus all the industry! I went there many times, have never seen any garbage dumps or rusting cars piled up beside the highways! They have always been recycling, being ahead of us here at least half a century! If they were not fanatically obsessed with keeping the environment as clean as possible they would have suffocated under mountains of stinking landfills and garbage heaps! I have no idea why you are using the wrong country to pick on.

      Oh nonsense! Germany is not an arid country. If they were not fanatical they would be practical, and no they wouldn’t be suffocating under mountains of stinking landfills and garbage heaps.

      Why am I picking on Germany? Because they have gone so extreme when it comes to environment, sucked in by the Greens.

Just read about 5 CSIS employees suing for 35 million for racism, homophobia, etc…

People are blaming Trudeau for this.. classic con crap.

    Hey, the buck stops at the top, and he’s it.
    Trudeau will go down in history as saying, on behalf of every Canadian that he’s sorry to Kadr the terrorist killer who took a life and an eye, then pays him what, $10,000,000?
    Before that he was blessing a Dictator, or have we all forgotten.
    He disgusts me.

Coal would be a good play now

ht tps://wattsupwiththat.com/2017/07/03/forget-paris-1600-new-coal-power-plants-built-around-the-world/

    Because coal is so clean burning…lol… the mining alone is horrible..

    Trump is the main driver of coal,…. why is that..because it’s big industry and that’s all trump worries about..

    90% of the worlds scientists say there is global warming..and trump goes with the 10% who says it’s not happening..

    Now with the USA all for polluting the other countries are probably saying… well if the states do it so can we..

      Pval so Trump is behind coal development all over the world, amazing man.

      4 out of 5 doctors said smoking was good for you.

      97% of the studies say atrazine is a harmful endocrine disrupter, and the Canadian govt quietly approves its continued use with the 3% industry funded studies.

      Who funds those scientists? “Science” tends to land on the side that’s paying for it

      He is feeding the “coal mining” fire but not agreeing the Paris accord..

      All I said was others where following…never did i say he was behind world coal development.. nice try to spin though..

      So because Trump pulled out of the Paris Accord (which did nothing to lower emissions, only transfer wealth to the “developing” countries) governments all over the world are ramping up coal use. Tell me how that makes sense, especially since all the media said that because of Trump, the US was being left behind while the rest of the world goes on without them.

      100% of the worlds scientists say there is global warming. 0% say there isn’t. Trump pulled out of Paris because it imposed unfair costs on the US, committing them to pay $6 trillion to “developing” countries who were not required to cut emissions.

      The US isn’t “all for polluting”, they have rather strict pollution regulations. What country is big on pollution? That would be China, with air so filthy it’s the equivalent of smoking 4 packs a day, with water so toxic no life can live in it. Chinese corporations are building or planning to build more than 700 new coal plants at home and around the world, some in countries that today burn little or no coal. That was in the works long before Trump was elected and is still ongoing.

      China also has the highest CO2 emissions in the world, 30% of the total and climbing, while US emissions are below 1997 levels.

      So tell us again, just how Trump is responsible for all this.

      China was building 2 new coal plants a week last year. New regulations only allow then to build 1GW of coal plants per week instead of 3GW in the past. That is a site C made of coal every month on average

      140GW of new coal fired plant is still under construction in China as we speak and 70GW already approved

Here I thought electric cars where supposed to be good for the environment

ht tps://wattsupwiththat.com/2017/06/20/tesla-car-battery-production-releases-as-much-co2-as-8-years-of-gasoline-driving/

    What about the congressman who said locomotives where very dangerous.. traveling at a break neck speed of 15 mph.. of course that was in the 1829.. sounds like you now about EV and solar energy.

    How many automakers are starting to only make EV in a few years.. all the smart ones.. Volvo all cars electric by 2019, BMW and Mercedes putting more focus on EV and less on combustion engines..

    So the 3 car companies that are known for top standards in their vehicles say EV is the way to go.. but littl ole you in PG knows it all….

      Automakers are aiming for government cash to make them profits. By the way, Volvo didn’t say no gas powered cars, just that they would all have an electric component, which most of them already do even though the power is supplied by gas.

      False PVal

      Volvo pledges to have all cars electric OR hybrid starting in 2019

It ain’t about the environment . It’s about the economy . It’s about efficiency . It may or may not have occurred to you but it’s not just cars . But , of coarse it ain’t happening here so it can’t be happening at all . The electrification of tractors and farm machinery is under way as well . They are even more vulnerable to disruption than are cars are . The race is on . Deer and mahindra are in . When one moves from the PTO Rube Goldberg machine to direct electric drive you eliminate thousands of moving parts not to mention the gas burner at the head end . There’s talk that the hydrolic systems will also come to their end . And , one would be able to store more energy for later use than a car by a factor of ten ~ .

    If you’re still on the homestead and you have 7 minutes . Check out solar powered tractor model 12 at YouTube . That guy has been doing it for years . There’s even more , search “all electric tractors ” at YouTube . Amazing stuff coming our way .

      Neat little tractor, I can see that there’s a niche for it.

    If it was really about the economy, there would need to be no government subsidies. When there’s money to be made, corporations will jump at the chance. Until then, don’t pretend it’s anything more than the green religion.

      The subsities from governments are there because it’s good for governments , particularly local governments . The money not spent on fossil fuel stays in the local economy instead of going to Texas or holland . In fact the charging money also stays in BC . I’m sure that one day the ” light ” will come on even in our local governments . It’s really simple economics . Money staying in town good , money leaving town bad .

      Well that’s confusing. When I buy fossil fuel for my pickup right here in PG, it’s made from Canadian oil, refined in Canada but the money goes to Texas? or Holland?????

      Gee, and I always thought the gas bar made a profit, the gas tanker truck made a profit, the refinery made a profit, the drilling company made a profit and the government got more money from it in taxes than any of them. Plus all the employees got paid too.

      So where does Texas come into it? And Holland, that a real puzzler.

      Oh, and what’s good for governments is revenue. Income. Money. Which they get from fossil fuels. Governments get the biggest share of every dollar spent on them. Subsidies are the opposite of revenue.

      Shell or Exxon , dirtman . You choose . Or perhaps one of the other minor players . Or perhaps husky . Send that money to China . You guys really have no idea as to where the money goes , do you ? The fog of the fossils runs thick .

      Actually it’s you Ataloss, who has no idea of where the money goes every time you fill up your gas tank. See above.

When it comes to solar panels and the manufacturing of them being a bit of an environmental concern during construction.. but like every new technology there are and will be huge advancements to make them better cheaper etc.. just like everything else… what if a airplane technology and experimenting stopped.. we would all still be taking trains etc to travel.. personally I love to fly..glad they didn’t stop..

You can’t stop,progress…

    Airplane technology and experimentation was done by private industry because there was money to be made.

    The only money to be made from the current renewables comes from government subsidies.

    Not the same at all. If it’s viable, they wouldn’t need government money to do it.

    Do you fly on solar powered aircraft? No? You fly on FOSSIL FUELED aircraft??? How could you???

      You’re funny dirtman . Search ” list of electric aircraft ” at Wikipedia and be amazed .

      Did I say I was against combustion etc engines… nope, not once ever..

      Yeah I know. Ataloss, they have a few experimental solar electric planes. One even flew around the world. But they aren’t commercially viable and P Val doesn’t fly on them.

      No, can’t say you have, P Val. My mistake, as a general rule, those who are delusional about electric cars are.

      Get real. You actually believe Private industry drove the development of the airplane? LOL

      Absolutely. Government was involved to a certain extent when it came to military applications, but it was the private sector that were the innovators. For example, the WWII B52 bomber was a converted passenger plane.

      I think you meant the Ju52. This constant downplaying of the role of government in driving innovation is tiresome. Take your Ju52 example. Yes, it was used as civilian transport for a number of airlines, but you seem to overlook that many of those airlines were flag carriers owned by governments, so it was government money that drive development of the aircraft for civilian use.

      Also, government involvement in aircraft development wasn’t just “to a certain extent”. It was a major component via their war departments. WW1 is a good example. Aircraft development took a major leap forward because governments poured enormous amounts of money and resources into advancing aircraft design and manufacturing for war fighting.

      Like I said, for military. The turbo jet engine was conceived of by private individuals in both Germany and England, and government money went into making it real on both sides But the majority of the time, there was no war and aircraft technology and development grew because private industry was competing for a rapidly growing consumer demand. Boeing was never owned by government.

    Thats why site c is required, to back up undependable inefficient wind and solar also to backup the 65 billion in IPP contracts.

      It’s not required.

      Yes, it is.

    PVal here are the facts, after reading care to comment.

    Now let’s go to COP21’s second idea that all cars should be electric.3

    In the UK there are about 35 million cars (just over double the number of households).

    1 Horsepower is about 750 W

    So an average 100 HP car engine = 75 kW (marginally more than the average household boiler)

    This means we need, not just 1 TW extra electric power to charge up these vehicles, but more than 2 TW.

    That is 500 Drax-sized power stations or one million wind turbines.

    ht tps://wattsupwiththat.com/2016/01/23/if-the-uk-were-to-try-and-achieve-cop21-ideas-hold-on-to-your-hats/

We would need two more site c’s to charge up all them ev’s also a massive do-over of the grid.

Pval that was 97% of scientists not 90%. I know its hard to keep up with the warmers BS

ht tps://wattsupwiththat.com/2016/07/13/already-240-published-papers-in-2016-alone-show-the-97-climate-consensus-is-a-fantasy/

    No grid do over… just add charging stations… Britain has lots of EVs on the road..no change needed to their grid structure.

      ? UK has a total of 105,000 EV/Hybrids and 13,000 charging stations on a total registered fleet of over 31 million vehicles

      2016 had 2,692,786 million new vehicles sold in the UK of that 36,907 were electric/plug in hybrid models

      Just the facts

      PVal here are the facts, after reading care to comment.

      Now let’s go to COP21’s second idea that all cars should be electric.3

      In the UK there are about 35 million cars (just over double the number of households).

      1 Horsepower is about 750 W

      So an average 100 HP car engine = 75 kW (marginally more than the average household boiler)

      This means we need, not just 1 TW extra electric power to charge up these vehicles, but more than 2 TW.

      That is 500 Drax-sized power stations or one million wind turbines.

      ht tps://wattsupwiththat.com/2016/01/23/if-the-uk-were-to-try-and-achieve-cop21-ideas-hold-on-to-your-hats/

Very true, but if you see how they charge depending on time, engine size, zone etc in the U.K. EV sales will continue to grow.

About those there electric aircraft, Pval Ataloss care to comment?

ht tps://wattsupwiththat.com/2016/04/25/the-solar-plane-a-perfect-metaphor-for-what-is-wrong-with-renewables/

Gore the savor of planet earth for a price. An over view on how he gives a speech

ht tp://joannenova.com.au/2017/07/al-gore-2017-was-that-science-or-gratuitous-random-weather-porn-to-fuel-superstitious-belief/

It is so sad that our educators cannot see the scam they are teaching. Whatever happened to critical thinking? I guess it morphed into being told what to think and like obedient little gnomes all node their heads in collective agreement and wait for the next payday..

Unless someone has diffident information that gas station being built on Westgate is going to be a transport truck cardlock. Yep progressive thinking city of Prince George. Maybe they will install a charging station for the useless Nissan Lief after its used all its energy huffing and puffing up Peden hill.

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