Do you think we could convince the liberals to put the wood innovation design centre money into our roads, sewer and water systems instead?

I’d rather have running water and some decent roads than building that I still can’t figure out what we’re going to use it for…

I hope the people here in BC have long memories and recall just how poorly the NDP managed our province back in the 90’s. I’m not saying the Libs are any better but I don’t think either party is the answer for us….

Not much left out there though….

Merc, I agree, not a whole lot of options out there, and lets face it, the only poll that’s any good is election day.
I too, remeember the mess the NDP was, and in my opinion, still is.

The history of the NDP? Not that bad when you compare what these guys have done. Seems after two terms in office they all forget why their elected and start actions that fail to address the real issues people want addressed. To day we have major economic activity but still poor? why? billions in tax breaks to corps, oil&gas and banks. If we pay they should also,900 million alone for oil and gas infrastructure when commodity markets are so high, sure they will take it if government offers but do they really need it no would they build and drill anyway yes. Its not about the tax or millions in hand outs its about the market price for product.

I was there as well and I admit that they made mistakes. IMO They were cutting their teeth so it comes as no surprise that they will make mistakes. Those mistakes were more to benifit the constituents than big buisness. They didn’t sell BC railwhich would have benifited BC enormously. They didn’t introduce the HST that helped the bottom line of buisnesses that already had the benifits of their workers. The HST took any savings that the average workers would have. The list goes on and on about the times BCers had to pay for the mistakes the Liberals perpotrated on us either to further them selves or their friends. The kind of mistakes that could only be purposefull. What I am saying here is the NDP is likely the party that will become our next government. Give them a chance and if you feel inclined a hand to do a great job for BC..

NDP ruled BC for just over 3 years from 1972 to 1975. Barrett was a good politician, the kind we don’t have these days in the NDP.

The NDP had a second go from 1991 to 2001 starting with Harcourt, a popular Vancouver Mayor, the same as Campbell. Dix is not of the calibre of Barrett or even wishy washy Harcourt. I see no outstanding NDPers.

They may be lucky enough to ride on the coatails of the senior governments again as they did in their 1991-2001 period .. Chretien’s Liberals and the USA’s Clinton. A time of relatively rapid growth.

Ruling at a time like that is relatively easy. Stand around with the others and things will fall out of everyone’s pockets and we can pick some of that extra up.

On the other hand, turning an economy around from one market place to another, well, that is another matter and I do not think Dix is up to that.

As with every politician, we have to get him to tell us what he is going to do for change. Likely he will not show his plan, if he has one, until it is too late and we have handed over power to another gutless wonder. We are good at that. As they say, a sucker is born every minute. :-)

But ….. maybe we can get Dix to send some money to the municipal governments in BC to fix their crumbling infrastructure.

While I despise the Liberals with every fibre of my being, the NDP are far from a good alternative choice. Dix obviously has had questionable ethics issues in the past, but maybe (just maybe), he’s learned.

What bothers me the most is that Moe Sihota is the NDP Party President. How on earth does this unethical dirt bag stay in politics and get back to that high a level?

This alone makes me seriously wonder what is going on in the NDP and what their agenda is. They should be in no way associated with somebody who carries that kind of scandal stink attached to them.

My god people! give it up on how bad the NDP were in the 90’s,…do you want this current (corrupt) Government to run forever!!

We actually have the makings of an interesting election. However we should firstly try and see what is actually taking place.

1. The Liberals have been making good news announcements all over the Province for the past 6 Months, including the latest announcement on this goofy holiday in February.

2. They have also now passed the legislation that reverts the HST back to the PST with all the attendent exemptions. In addition they have upgraded the PST to make it more user friendly to business.

3. The teachers situation is in a cooling off period that should take it to the end of August.

So what does this mean. In my opinion it means an election in July or August this year. Christy has nothing to gain by waiting till the last possible day to call an election. She needs to go now, get rid of all the **deadwood** ie; Coleman, Hansen, Falcon, Abbott, etc; These guys are not exactly her friends.

In addition she has the Conservatives to contend with, however that is not exactly a bad thing. Those people who are pissed off at the Liberals, can vote for the Consevatives, and this will save them the need to vote for the NDP. So we will actually have a three way split on the vote.

A three way split works good for Christy because it means that the Conservatives could pull votes from the NDP, and the Liberals, and therefore it will take a smaller number of votes to get elected. This is especially good in a summer election because a lot of people will be on holidays, or otherwise engaged. Furthermore if the Liberals and Conservatives win enough seats they can build another coalition Government, and the status quo continues. I suspect that there will be a greater number of Independents running in this election, which will split the vote even further.

There are no benefits to be derived from waiting for an election. The time to go is now.

It’s a done deal, it doesn’t matter when they have the election. The only question is, after the NDP comes to power, how many terms will it take for people to figure out how bad they are?

As with every politician, we have to get him to tell us what he is going to do for change. Likely he will not show his plan
=============================================
Well; gus your wrong again. You give us this big speil as usual but I was at a recent NDP fund raiser and Dix laid out his platform to us. So get some facts before you put your mouth into grear.

And why would Dix give money to the incompetant clowns we have at City Hall. Its time they learned how to manage and not depend on senior levels of government to get them out of the shit.

And comparing the 90″s that the NDP was the government with the present performance of the liberals is just plain ignorance. And as for Moe Sihota he has more brains in his left toe then Clark has in her head.

Cheers

“Dix laid out his platform to us”

Lucky you ….. did not realize you are running … he needs to share it with people like Ogasawara so that the candidates have something meaningful to say. …. then again, the NDP is riding on the “anyone but liberals sentiment”, which the NDP also faced.

It’s the nature of politics ….. at least in BC it seems to be more than in most other provinces.

At the moment the question is n ot whether the NDP will get in, but howp long they will be in for.

Reminds me of PG. The question was not whether Green will get in. The question is how long will she be in for. ;-)

From the Devil’s Dictionary:

Politics = A strife of interests masquerading as a contest of principles. The conduct of public affairs for private advantage.

I always thought that summed it up nicely.

I love people with mood swings …. ;-)

So how much will the NDP raise taxes? Right now we have one of the lowest tax rates in Canada but probably not for long…:(

I love people with mood swings …. ;-)

We Know that you are inlove with yoursel Gus. Dont bore us with the details.And its a fact htat I dont Love “Know It Alls”.

Your first question was that Dix should clue us un what he stands for and now you want to know what Ogasawara has to say. As usual your going around in circles trying to impress us with your great knowlegde

Its easy to find out what the NDP stands for just attend one of their meetings and find out. The election mode has not started yet. And all else failing try the internet for more in formation,
Cheers

Will Christy Clarke be visiting the Slave labour factories in China! I think not! She’ll only see what they show her. Their Communist.
You think NDP and union’s are bad for B.C.? Then lets make the union’s change!
Those people in China are losing farm land for Factories and need our resources to keep on supplying the world with CHEAP PRODUCTS! The next time your child is cuddling that brand new stuffed animal, try and think how many Chinese people’s hands that were lost in the cutter’s of that clothe. NO COMPENSATION, NO SPECIAL FUND RAISING, NO INSURANCE! No faces, just gone. Who care’s the owner of that factory has an endless body. We will give them resource that they so need so we can consume CHEAP LABOUR MADE PRODUCTS. Don’t forget their Government side’s with the business owner, sound familiar. The only one that win’s is that 1,ONE owner of that factory. That factory worker, well he has no name, there’s plenty where he came from. NO HUMANITY. “China Rises”
No one says that the NDP are going to save us, but we NEED CHANGE. We need to work out a solution that puts our home grown people, including immigrants. Legislation Law that our British Columbian’s work 1st and companies need to prove before a panel that they cannot find anyone in B.C. to do the job, there for out source that job. People can make a Government change, we need a Government that ask’s it’s people, NOT a dictatorship. 12 years is too long for one Government. I have seen the effect on my own kids and I don’t like it. That is my opinion, you have your free.

Dave Barrett was a lousy Premier. Worst we’d ever had until Gordon Campbell came along. Mike Harcourt was almost equally hopeless. Glenn Clark a little better. Dan Miller didn’t want the job, but he did a good job while he was Premier. Ujjal Dosanjh was a bit of a disappointment, but like he used to always say, it was, “At the end of the day…” For him and his Party. The biggest mistake the NDP ever made was not electing Corky Evans as their leader. He could have taken them from being a group that represents a ‘part’ of the electorate to one that represents the vast majority of it. I wouldn’t expect too much from Adrian Dix, but anything would be an improvement on the current BC Liberals.

Bye, bye Bell, Bond and that other guy!

Hello higher taxes, more debt , more under- worked civil servants!!

“The only question is, after the NDP comes to power, how many terms will it take for people to figure out how bad they are?”

90 days or less, going by past performance!

Wow! Paranoia & Fear Mongering reign supreme on this site. All you have to do is go online and check out the governments own numbers and you will find that the NDP out performed the Liberals everywhere. Oh! Except for the worst child poverty numbers 8 years in a row. Oh yeah – and the largest cost overruns anywhere on this planet by the Libs.

Dave Barrett never had it so good, as when he was Premier, he bought a new sports coat, a nice new pair of shoes,got a haircut every month, and put on 40lbs and strutted his stuff.

It was the best job he ever had. He also had a sense of humour. Dont think he did much as Premier.

Dave Barrett’s government in 3 years created

1. Labour Relations Board
2. question period
3. full Hansard transcripts of legislative proceedings
4. Agricultural Land Reserve
5. Insurance Corporation of British Columbia

So far, no government has undone those.

The controversial action was to change the

accounting system which caused the real spending of previous government to become visible.

No one would want that, would they? Sure death …… ;-)

Hammy wrote:

we need “Legislation Law that our British Columbian’s work 1st and companies need to prove before a panel that they cannot find anyone in B.C. to do the job, there for out source that job…”

It seems it has not hit home yet that we are facing a serious battle of not having enough people to work to make things, maintain things, serve things, transport things, advertise things, and, most importantly buy things, sell things, export things, etc. It is the only way we know how to distribute any wealth that we may have or create in the future.

Here is an interesting table of population changes in Canada in 10 year increments.

The year … the population .. the change over the previous 10 years.

18512,415,000—
18613,174,00031.40%
18713,689,00016.20%
18814,325,00017.20%
18914,833,00011.70%
19015,371,00011.10%
19117,207,00034.20%
19218,788,00021.90%
193110,377,00018.10%
194111,507,00010.90%
195114,009,00021.70%
196118,238,00030.20%
197121,962,00020.40%
198124,820,00013.00%
199128,031,00012.90%
200131,021,00010.70%
201133,476,0007.90%

We have been slowing down ever since 1971. In fact, we are now at one third the level of increase in population since 1971.

We were a country which relied on growth driven primarily by an increase in population and the resulting increase in commerce that took place internally.

We are a country with vast spaces unheard of in many parts of the world. As we transition from a country that will rely more and more on human resources rather than natural resources, I think that we will have to increase those human resources within our borders, bit the number and the level of ingenuity to improve our human resource based competitive skills.

When hiring, we need more than just a warm body, we need a person who is capable of working smarter. We have machinery to help us work harder.

Gus, Dave Barrett’s government was one continuous set of disasters after another.

The WAC Bennett Social Credit government was defeated because they did not effectively control the inflation that ramped up as the mega projects of the 1960’s ramped down. Bennett sought to hold the lid on public sector wage increases (to 5% and 6%), without any means of simultaneously limiting any further rise in prices. So his mob were out, and Barrett’s crowd got in.

And rather than try to control inflation, they fed it with reckless abandon. Barrett raised his own salary as Premier to more than what the Prime Minister of Canada was making! And that of all the MLAs, too.

No longer were they to be “of the people”, where most of them who weren’t in Cabinet had to hold another job in the community to make ends meet, they were to become full-time professional ‘politicians’. A class apart. Just what we need in a ‘democracy’.

BC Hydro rates? Barrett doubled them! so much for low cost public power to support BC industrial development.

ICBC? It’s nickname then was ‘Mutual of Moscow’, and for good reason. It was run as inefficiently as the Soviet Union ran their infamous Five Year Plans. They had buildings rented all over BC to store the huge backlog of wrecks they couldn’t properly assess, and made settlements on them pretty much as the owner demanded to make it look like they were an improvement over private insurance. And then tried to cover their losses by using their monopoly powers to force auto body repair shops to kow tow to a completely inadequate rate structure to do repairs.

Agricultural Land Reserve? It drove up the prices of all lands that weren’t included in it ~ and the taxes we had to come up with every year to still say we owned them. It froze developments on so-called ‘agricultural’ reserve properties that had so little soil on them even a real good farmer would have trouble getting a pot crop off them. A “Soils Preservation Act” would have been far more effective and in keeping with modern reality.

They bloated the Civil Service. With people they didn’t need, and had really nothing to do. Except make a nuisance of themselves bothering those of us who were trying our best to make a living.

They were an absolute disaster ~ and when we turfed them 3 years after electing them even “Fat Little Dave” lost his seat, and had to run again in a “safe-seat” (Vancouver East) by-election to continue as Opposition Leader.

He did learn (a bit) from his mistakes, because later on he was effective as a Federal MP. But as Premier? In my view he held the title as the worst until Gordon Campbell pulled off the seemingly impossible and totally upstaged him.

Always baffles me how years after people leave politics in disgrace, the media finds them to be the voice of reason.

Comment Posted by: gus on May 15 2012 5:40 PM :~ “The controversial action was to change the accounting system which caused the real spending of previous government to become visible.”
——————————————-
It always WAS visible. What WAC Bennett did was truly brilliant, though completely lost on the NDP, whose understanding of finance could best be described as juvenile. Still. (Because Karl Marx never did understand that every money system is CREDITARY, and socialists still don’t. It interferes with their fundamental philosophy ~ that the poor are poor because the rich are rich. )

The NDP’s thinking was like that kid who believed just because there’s still cheques in the chequebook, there must still be money in the bank account. And when it’s all spent, there’ll never be any more unless they can take it off someone who they think has too much of it.

By transforming the previous direct debt obligations of the Province into contingent liabilities through having various Crown Corporations or Authorities assume those debts, and incur any further ones in their own name, WAC Bennett enabled those entities to properly account for money they raised for specific purposes.

Instead of the previous inane system of running everything off a government Budget, which is always supposed to be ‘balanced’, even though that means there’s a distortion when including long-term Capital expenditures (that are supposed to be fully paid for in one year, the one in which they were incurred, even though the things they were spent on last for years and years into the future).

What Bennett did allowed these entities to use modern double entry accrual accounting and EXPENSE those Capital Costs over the life expectancy of the Asset created or acquired. They could then service their own debts, much in the manner that any private company could. The NDP couldn’t fathom that. But they found the Provincial coffers in pretty good shape when they assumed office, in spite of the growth of ‘contingent liabilities’ all the time Bennett was Premier.

mf: “Always baffles me how years after people leave politics in disgrace, the media finds them to be the voice of reason.”

Bill Vanderzalm anyone?

No, Johnny, Bill Vander Zalm was the exception to that. He did British Columbians a far greater service leading the fight against the HST than saving us from getting the NDP as government five years sooner than we did.

Bill is no saint. He acted in self interest. The HST didn’t benefit his business… and he took everyone along for the ride.

Getting back to the topic of how to vote in the next election; the voter being between a rock and a hard place.

IMO it is not the question of which of the two parties has been worse or better at any given time and this is a complete distraction from where we go and how to get there.

The key question as voters is do we continue to promote a top down dictatorship or a bottom up democracy?

Is the party stripe/premier/dictator (who the party delegates selects) more important than the qualifications of the MLA who is voted for in your riding? If the party who you align with (because you believe in the pre election promises) has a baffoon representing your riding, do you vote for them anyways? Does it serve any of us when a party selects a baffoon premier just because they are a slick personality who can baffle people or tell a straight faced lie and then smile? Do you vote out your otherwise competant MLA because you don’t like the premier or the party? Do we as voters just continue to promote a system where it doesn’t matter if our MLA is competant or not? but must sell their soul to a party/premier who with the party spin doctors advice tells them how and what gets done??

Looking forward with the understanding that what has happened doesn’t work (to achieve the great potential of this province) means changing the system with our votes rather than flippant alignments to one party or the other. The question becomes what needs to change the left to right swings that have a disasterous effect to our province as a whole?

We need to stop voting for parties and start voting for ethical and qualified MLAs who represent each of our regions rather than a king or queen who is preoccupied with promoting/defending the party castle in spite of us.

I’m beginning a slow clap for you, foresight. Palopu has given a similar speech.

However, the reality is that the majority of people vote for parties, not independants. Or more specifically, they vote parties in and out of power. Even someone like Sherri Ogasawara will likely be elected simply because she is NDP and is running on the ‘anybody but the Liberals’ platform. Not saying it’s right, but it’s the reality.

The HST didn’t benefit a lot of businesses, Johnny. Including mine. And not just because some of the things we sell that weren’t subject to PST before became taxable under HST. But because it took a greater chunk of what had been every BC shopper’s disposable income away from them.

I agree that Bill Vander Zalm is no saint. But he did save us from getting the NDP’s hapless Bob Skelly as our Premier in 1986.

Something that none of the other then contenders for the BC Socred leadership could likely ever have done. Not after Bill Bennett followed the advice of his high priced, imported handlers, (like Norman Spector and David Emerson), and brought in an ill-conceived ‘austerity’ program. That really ‘saved’ us nothing, and set the stage for many of the conflicts that have bitterly divided this Province for years.

And Vander Zalm did us all a great service in leading the fight against the HST ~ a tax that is so morally wrong, that no amount of additional revenue brought in to prop up a financially incompetent regime, just because they’re NOT the NDP, could ever justify it.

What kind of a government sets out to tax its citizens’ spending from BORROWINGS, as well as from earnings? Thereby putting them further still in hock, just to continue to live?

The fact that the average citizen is now $ 1.53 in debt for every dollar he has of disposable income is a disgrace that any responsible government should be trying to address, and eliminate. Not find a way to tap into as a revenue source.