Well, you don’t live here either Mr. O’Neil and don’t have to pay the taxes here and haven’t availed yourself of any of the services that the City provides and don’t have to factor into your rhetoric the very real coming crisis of crumbling infrastructure.

I realize you’re being quoted and this might not be the full tenor of your message, but what you’ve been quoted as saying is not helpful either.

Just saying no to the opportunities that have been presented is not very productive. No offense, but unions don’t have a great track record at “making things better,” and are not in charge at the City.

Unions don’t have a good track record of making things better? I would just like to take this opportunity to thank unions for medical benefits, pensions, holidays, sick benefits,safety committees, etc. etc. Get the bigger picture!

Barry O’Neill is just another loud mouthed labour leader, just one of many like Jim Sinclair that we are blessed with here in BC. I wonder how much these clowns are paid each year?

I am always amused at those that fail to recognize that these people are not concerned about the general public, let alone their own union members These guys are only concerned about one thing and that is maintaining their membership numbers so that they can continuye to extract union dures from the members. “Big Labour” is no better and no different that the “Big Business” that they constantly criticize!

Barry’s only purpose for being here is to try to maintain the “status quo”. That’s it, and anyone who thinks otherwise is sadly mistaken!!

Go back to the lower mainland Barry, and please stay there!!

We have some serious problems in Prince George when it comes to debt, City staff, policing, crime, etc; etc;

If it wasnt for the Unions you can rest assured that there would be a blood letting at City Hall. If it wasnt for Management the Union workers would do a lot less than they are doing now.

The problem is the Union staff, the Management, the Police are all paid for by taxpayers. When they negotiate with each other, it is almost a foregone conclusion that the taxpayer will get it in the ear.

How can we solve these problems, with an Acting City Manager, and New Mayor, who seems to have her own agenda, and a number of Councillors who are not sure what they should be doing??

No matter what kinds of contortions they go through when they are finished we the taxpayers get another increase, and we get the age old adage. **If we hadnt negotiated as hard as we did, you would have had a much biggar increase**

The system is, and has been broken for many years. The City and all City workers are feeding off the taxpayers, and have very little if any concern about their ability to pay, or how much it costs.

All City workers, managers, staff, firemen, and Police are well paid, have good benefits, and top of the line equipment, and offices, etc; and they are all still looking for more. This has to stop.

We need a 10% reduction in every department across the board, with a view to look at a further reduction if necessary in a few years time. In addition we need a five year freeze on wages and benefits. Its just that simple.

If we carry on this way, we are going to go broke. (Beleive me)

The tax payers of Prince George do not have an endless supply of money to support ongoing increases to Government workers.

How many City employee’s, managers, or staff, are willing to fall on their swords for the greater good??

I would say none.

Oops, forgot to mention that Barry is quoted above as saying “the Core services review conducted by people brought in from the outside cannot possibly address the real issues facing a community “They don’t know what’s happening in this community, they haven’t lived here for even one week.”

Gee, Barry I didn’t realize that you lived here in Prince George! Wait a minute! You don’t live here!!

So, how can you possibly know what’s happening in this community if you haven’t lived here for even one week??

What a clown!!

Well said Polepu!!

From comments made on this site right after the Core Review was released, nobody was impressed with the results. Now that a dastardly union big shot has spoken out against the review, it’s seen as an opportunity to rail against unions.
I was in favour of the Core Review in spite of the enormous price tag because I thought it was actually going to give an accurate picture of the costs associated with running a city.
I thought it would take each department and break it into easily understandable parts. What the department is responsible for, how large is the budget, how many employees, how much equipment, upkeep and costs, short and long term, for that equipment. Was the budget alloted realistic, or constantly over or under? What criteria were management bonuses paid out on? What suggestions to streamline the process to save money, manpower or equipment?
Most of this information should be part of the everyday bookkeeping for each department, and if not, why not. At some point we all have to at least try to balance our cheque book or bank account.
So instead of shrugging our shoulders and throwing up our hands, blaming the unions, management or powers that be, how about we figure out what we need to know so then we can figure out how to fix it. Can common sense really be so under-rated that we don’t believe in it anymore?

Palopu: “How can we solve these problems, with an Acting City Manager, and New Mayor, who seems to have her own agenda, and a number of Councillors who are not sure what they should be doing??”

Well said, you usually make sensible arguments and I often agree with many of them.

Also agree that a 10% savings across departments could have been achieved without the ridiculous JOKE of a core services review and without the “stands with fist” iron lady tactics of this round of bargaining. The CSR is all about contracting out work and greasing big business. Have been some very thoughtful posts from others on this site in related streams.

Further, I will agree with you that the city needs to save money and you have pointed out several mega projects on this site over time, that have been a huge waste of tax dollars, overkill, pipe dreams and purely special interest targeted, on crap we do not really need, with absolutely no proven ROI.

If council would place their attention to those big line items, I will buy into the argument that we are broke and that this is all about saving money for taxpayers, until then, I call BS.

At least funding a decent workforce does have a proven ROI in our community. It should not be one of the first and most vigorous places to cut, cut, cut.

Hey Hart guy, pretty good at the name calling, unless you were at the meeting tonight and witnessed the tone and sincerity of words from O’Neil, please refrain from comment. Either way, I usually skip over your rhetoric anyway.

Banner: Now THAT is a good post.

bcnorth, sorry that I wasn’t able to attend tonight’s meeting. I had some very prior commitments that were very important (had to take out the garbage, pay a few bills on line and couldn’t miss Jeopardy).

I’m so glad that you were able to witness the tone and sincerity of Mr. O’Neill’s words. I’m sure that he was preaching to the converted. Funny this is, where was he during the Core Review process and why does he show up now? Wouldn’t have anything to do with his union members going through contract negotiations with the City now, would it?? Of course not, silly me, what was I thinking?

Just what I figured, a lot of chest thumping and cheerleading from Mr. O’Neill, but no alternatives. Glad I took a pass… union rallies aren’t my thing anyway.

the Funny thing here is … that Hart Guy is Spouting off like he knows everystep that Barry Oneill takes. What makes Hart Guy think that he doesnt know this city? does he know the Man ..His family etc… I do .. he has connections to this city .. So with that I say Unless you have something truthfull to say … dont say anything ….But that is typical of his usual posts.. ignorance

About the Core service review … do yourselves a favour … get a copy of it … Then get a Copy of Toronto Ontarios lateset Core Review … you will notice alot of similarities … in fact they are written pretty much word for word … oh .. and the City of PG payed exactly the same amount as did Toronto.
If nothing else the Taxpayers of this Town should be outraged at the blatent waste of money … that the core review was. for nothing

Hart Guy “Wouldn’t have anything to do with his union members going through contract negotiations with the City now, would it??”

uhm, duh.

Johnnybelt, it’s OK you missed it; doesn’t stop some from blathering on about something they did not see, hear or witness. Nothing surprising there.

bowzone_mikey and bcnorth250, I am so glad that you read my comments! Would hate to think that I’m offering my two bits for nothing!

bowzone_mkey, you state that Barry O’Neill has connections to the city. Isn’t that what I already said….his union members are currently going through contract negotiations with the City!

I’m in ageement that the Core Review could end up being a big waste of money, but at the same time, I’m smart enough (even if you don’t think I am) to realize that we can’t keep doing what we have been doing. It’s time to stop the wasteful spending, it’s time to look at cost savings at all levels and in all departments and it’s time to reign in the ever escalating wages and benefits received by municipal workers paid for in part by many tax payers and small business owners who do not enjoy these wages and benefits but have no choice but the pay the bill for those that do! It’s not rocket science!

By the way, I do not want the City to get rid of the Pine Valley Golf Course, even though I don’t use it. Nor do I want the City to close or privatize the pool downtown, even though I don’t use it!

See fellas, in spite of what you might think of me, I can and do try to see both sides of an issue. Thanks for reading!! :-)

i am no fan of big union bosses that drop in and share their view of the world but I don’t quite agree with palopu’s simplistic view of the world either.

The notion that 10% can be cut in each department without impacting services is a silly thought that is built on the same foundation of smoke that makes up most magic shows. It sounds good but in reality you can’t defy logic, physics or gravity. Cutting services is the only way to cut taxes.

So I say close at least two of the city’s arenas, one of the pools and cut IPG’s budget by 50%. I bet that would save at least a few million. Heck I bet I could work for KPMG with those innovative ways to reduce taxes.

Do you guys that sit there and whine about taxes and city employees making to much money ever think how much they spend in the city? What business do you own or where do you work because I would like to come in and tell you to lay off staff or cut your wages so you can lower your prices on the products because they are to expensive.

We’re all barking up the wrong tree. We need to stop the hemorage of our tax dollars from being spent by City Hall. With building dykes, expensive RCMP facilities, Prince George Hotel fiascle, Heating downtown by digging up the streets of the city to heat buildings that will soon be condemed. There are other projects, but my menory doesn’t serve me so well. On top of it all there is a common beliefe that somed of our top executives are extortring money to make friends and influence others.

out of curiosity, how is the central heating system working? does anyone know.

Ben, we need you to do some snooping.

Bentley: “Do you guys that sit there and whine about taxes and city employees making to much money ever think how much they spend in the city?”

The BCNorth line of logic. By that reasoning, the City’s economic problems could be solved by hiring more City employees. But wait, how do City employees get paid again?

We never hear much more than a whimper from all the whiners and criers when their cost of living skyrockets putting more of their families money into the pockets of business.

Then when families try to negotiate a fair agreement with business to try and keep up, the whiners and criers crawl out of the wood like pine beetles.

“In addition we need a five year freeze on wages and benefits. Its just that simple.”

Sure, if the same goes for price increases across the board.

Manpower levels at the city, I’m assuming the demographics are the same as private industry, can be lowered through attrition. As workers retire they are not replaced. No one gets sacked. We can however look to some management/administration position within city hall and ask if we are getting value for our money. Managers should be putting people to work. 1 manager running a dept. of 4 employees seems a little silly. Good job if you can get it though.

Also, if I were mired in debt but owned several empty pieces of real estate, I’d be looking to liquidate. Now. Is anyone interested in the real estate? Not sure. Even if means taking a loss, wouldn’t it be better than sitting empty, producing nothing while accruing interest?

Johnny: “The BCNorth line of logic. By that reasoning, the City’s economic problems could be solved by hiring more City employees. But wait, how do City employees get paid again?”

Yeah, that’s the WHOLE extent of my whole argument *eyeroll*.

I didn’t say it was the whole point, but you have made that argument before (regarding how much money City workers put into the economy).

Here’s some more wisdom from Mr. O’Neill from the Citizen website:

“Part of being a union member is understanding that certain things have to go on in order for the enterprise to be successful,” he said, noting O’Neill raised good points about city employees being members of the community, not just people who are collecting a paycheque. “They care about the job that they do, they’re supervised by supervisors who check up on them if they’re not doing the job and should check up on them if they’re not doing the job. That’s how you make the place successful.”

Does anyone have any idea the difference in cost between the new cop shop and a regular office building? Why was the old one allowed to deteriorate?

How much is the trendy experiment costing us for a couple of city employees to play with hybrid and electric cars on taxpayers money?

Anyhow just other examples on wasteful spending.

We could well afford to pay our city employees and the teachers if we just had an economically prudent mayor and council. The money our mayor has spent on trips to China, building an expensive police facility, installing heat for downtown and the PG Hotel fiascle are projects of her fantacy not ones that we can afford.

Surefire, we already pay our city employees and teachers quite well, although teacher’s pay is not under the control of our municipal council. How about if our mayor and council were more economically prudent and the tax saving were passed along to all of us taxpayers in the form of LOWER taxes. I don’t think that it’s the city’s responsibility to be economically prudent so that municipal employees can get paid more, rather I think they have a duty, one that currently isn’t being very well met, a duty to be ecomonically prudent so that you and I and all other taxpayers aren’t constantly being hit with tax increases every year!!

Surefire, we already pay our city employees and teachers quite well, although teacher’s pay is not under the control of our municipal council. How about if our mayor and council were more economically prudent and the tax saving were passed along to all of us taxpayers in the form of LOWER taxes. I don’t think that it’s the city’s responsibility to be economically prudent so that municipal employees can get paid more, rather I think they have a duty, one that currently isn’t being very well met, a duty to be ecomonically prudent so that you and I and all other taxpayers aren’t constantly being hit with tax increases every year!!

Buying a hotel and helping the owner out of the hole was a big mistake. As long as he owned the hotel, he had to pay taxes, same thing for Norgate Auto Body downtown. The city buys them and relieves the owner of a financial burden, then tosses it to the taxpayers. Were these people good friends of city upper crust? Damn right! Core review people didn’t even know where the money was going and couldn’t care less. 300 grand was the goal and the prize for doing exactly what they have done for other cities. They could have written it up in one minute on the computer.