Haldi Road OCP Amendment Passes
Monday, March 4, 2013 @ 11:59 PM
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Prince George Council chambers were packed as Council dealt with a public hearing aimed at amending the OCP to allow for the development of a recovery centre for women.
Prince George, B.C. –Council for the City of Prince George has voted in favour of altering the Official community plan which clears the way for the development of a Recovery Centre for Women in the former Haldi Road elementary school.
The final vote was 8 for and 1 against, and the decision followed 4 and a half hours of presentations from people in the community.
Councillor Skakun said he could not support the OCP amendment saying the City already learned from the court case (which it lost) that this was not a good fit, and he doesn’t believe anything has changed .
Councillor Garth Frizzell said he wanted to hear what his colleagues had to say before making a decision.
Councillor Cameron Stolz says the challenge is, there is no crystal ball, but he will base his decision on the land use. He says ultimately his decision would be made on if the proposal "matches what we’re trying to do in Prince George". He noted people on both sides went on "at length" making presentations which had nothing to do about land use. He added that unless someone came up with something to change his mind, he was inclined to support the amendment to the OCP.
Councillor Frank Everitt says he heard a great deal of concerns about roads, and from the pictures shown to Council, "There is a heck of a lot we need to do about the roads in that area." Straying from the land use issue, Everitt says Councillors have to make decisions about things that will be good for the whole community, not just one neighbourhood.
Councillor Lyn Hall presented a list of things he would like to see added on to the project, including clearing the lagoons, capping and welding the wells, a good neighbour agreement, "These are all things everyone was passionate about tonight."
Councillor Albert Koehler admits it is very difficult to speak to the land use only. "it is my feeling that in the end it comes down to this treatment centre." He asked if the proposal was for a child treatment centre would there be such an outcry? "What is in the best interests of Prince George? That is what’s guiding me."
Councillor Murry Krause said he has heard other arguments about other projects that were just as hotly contested, "Research has shown that when the dust has settled, there is no impact on values of the surrounding properties."
Councillor Dave Wilbur says it is a land use question and for that we have to reflect on the Official Community Plan. He says he is of the view, the OCP is a living document which focuses on all our futures. "I guess the question I am faced with is, is there room in that vision for a women’s recovery centre in a transitional rural area, and in my opinion there is." He supported the OCP change.
Mayor Green said "There’s no question the process is not right for people who are not happy with it." She said "It is ultimately in our hands and it is not an easy decision to make." "It is a difficult thing, I know people will leave here unhappy."
The evening started with Mayor Shari Green setting the rules for the public hearing on the proposed amendments to the Official Community Plan and rezoning application, which would impact the Haldi Road neighbourhood. Mayor Green said everyone who wanted to make an oral submission would be permitted to do so, but they would only have 5 minutes to make their initial submission.
That rule meant many of the presentations had to be stopped in mid stream, to allow all who wanted to speak to have the opportunity to do so. The presenters were then invited back to complete their presentation after everyone else had had an opportunity to speak.
At issue is an OCP amendment that could impact all neighbourhoods in the City, but is aimed at clearing the way for the development of a recovery centre for women. The centre would have as many as 25 women in treatment in a residential setting. The site in question is the former Haldi Road Elementary school which is smack dab in the middle of a rural residential neighbourhood.
The rules were preceded by Legislative Services Manager Walter Babicz outlining that the Supreme Court had previously ruled that 5 minutes was “a reasonable amount of time”, he added that the time limit was not meant to stifle anyone’s input rather to allow the opportunity for everyone who wants to address the matter to be allowed to do so.
The proponents say the site will not have any negative impacts on the neighbourhood as the women will already be substance free “This centre will teach them how to live substance free” says Dr. Michelle Suter, Chair of the Board for the Recovery Centre.
One by one, opponents stepped forward to state their case against the OCP amendments, and one by one their presentations were stopped before completion because of the time limit.
The first of the opponents to speak was Laura Jagodnik, she asked if she could have the time from someone sitting in the gallery, and was advised “That would be out of order” said the Mayor. The Mayor said Jagodnik would be allowed to continue her power point presentation, after everyone else has had a chance to speak.
Jagodnik says there are still concerns about water consumption, the sewage lagoons as well as issues about security. She pointed out the practices in other communities where there are on-going discussions between recovery centres, the community and the neighbourhood.
“You have a problem” said Lawyer Roy Stewart who says there are inconsistencies in the Official Community plan, and that makes it impossible for any rezoning application to be consistent with the OCP. “You propose to put an institutional user, into an area where there is rural residential use.” He says the residents have presented petitions which carry a simple message “What the Haldi Road residents are asking you, is simply to adhere to their wishes” says Stewart who added that should Council approve the OCP amendments, there will likely be legal action to overturn the ruling.
“This proposal is an attempt to drive a square peg into a round hole” said resident Terry Mann. He noted there are no sidewalks, or bike lanes on Haldi Road, and the road is used by walkers, horse riders, dog walkers, bicyclists. He says traffic will increase as there are water haulers, health care specialists, grocery delivery and visitors.
One by one, residents stepped forward to state their case against the proposed OCP amendments. Tracy Kettles presented a map which details all the properties in the area, and the response of the residents to the OCP amendments. In the map below, pink areas (78%) indicated they opposed the OCP amendment, Yellow areas were residents who were neutral on the matter (11%), the Green areas are undeveloped green space. Blue represents residents who support the amendments (4%) and white areas represent those whose position is not known because canvassers were not able to contact them (7%).
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The estimated water demand for the facility doesn’t match up with what is used in other care homes that are occupied 24/7 says Jan Sevin. She notes the application says there will be about 400 litres per person per day, while the City’s own website claims average daily per person use of water in this City is 530 litres, and the Province claims the average daily use in the province is 490 litres per person. She noted senior care homes estimate daily per person water use at 910 litres.
Those in favour of the centre, included Elizabeth McRitchie “To say not in my back yard is a very difficult situation” she says there needs to be some healing as there has been a great deal of animosity over the possible establishment of the Haldi Road site. Charles Scott stepped forward to say that when asked by friends if there would be any negative land use issues associated with the establishment of the centre. He says he did some research and was not able to find any evidence that such a facility would have any negative neighbourhood impacts.
Comments
So why even try to fight anything? Eventually the bullies will win.
Those Councillors who voted in favour of altering the OCP had their minds made up before any presentation was made.
They merely went through the motion of listening, and then voted. This was obvious by their comments prior to the vote.
So in essence all the presentations were a waste of time. Not one presentation had any effect on these Councillors or the Mayor. So as stated above. Why bother???
I strongly urge the residents of Haldi Road to now take this issue to the Courts. This is not the time to stop the battle.
From what I’m reading in this article, many of our esteemed councillors have concerns about the infrastructure surrounding the land but feel comfortable about supporting the OCP. Then, in spite of insisting that they are entirely separate issues, they endorse the Recovery Centre as an appropriate use of that land. After granting concerned citizens what basically amounts to four and a half hours of lip service, is it any wonder why people choose not to vote or attend council meetings? I wonder how many times this Council needs to be taken to court before the matter is settled. I wonder how much this is costing us taxpayers. I wonder how certain people seem to have Council bending over backwards to make their plans reality while others are spurned. I wonder how long the group backing the Recovery Centre can wait before they sue the City for lost profits. I wonder.
I’m very pleased with the decision & support City Council.
Awesome. Now we can move forward and stop wasting time and energy on this issue. Hope council learned some valuable lessons here.
So then its settled? re elect Mayor Green next yet lol. It almost seems like there are alot of ‘yes’ men in council, and one person in council who all the rest don’t seem to like.
I am willing to bet if they did this on the other side of the hiway down the road 2-3km at the other elementary school people would not like it as well.
Almost like its a bad idea to start with having these types of things in rural areas.
Its also funny how if what 95% ish of the people living in the area who pay city taxes (for what?) arn’t happy about it but have no say it seems in what happenes to them.
If I lived there I for sure would not want that ‘center’ in my neighborhood, and I am willing to bet most people in any neighbourhood in Prince George, be it city/rural/suburb would not want it near where they live. I sure hope Haldi area people takes them to court and win.
Palopu: The residents of Haldi went through this so that there is a better chance of succeeding in the courts. So did the Council.
Every Councillor had their minds made up before this meeting. They are justing going through the motions.
So in reading the story and listening to the news it sounds like the presenters kind of dropped the ball. There seemed to be alot of support from non-Haldi residents concerned about the changes to the OCP but it sounds like the presenters went back to the same old NIMBY arguements about water and security…
Amm I wrong, or is that just the way the media is presenting it?
Yup, you’re wrong. Haldi presenters were in fine form. Northern Recovery Presenters had nothing to say about land use. The presentations for haldi were to the point, factual and very much about land use. You should’ve been there. Counsel kept talking like it was already passed and what consolation prizes they might possibly toss the haldi neighbourhood then would quickly correct themselves and add ” well if it is in fact passed,,,”. Very telling. It was predetermined and outside the presenter’s power to change.
Green and her boyz need to realize there is a new kid in town. His name is the Supreme Court of British Columbia and he don’t take kindly to bullies. I am happy to give money to haldi’s legal battle. This City Council is making PG the laughing stock of the province at good citizens’ expense.
Thanks Take Action – good to know :)
What did everyone think was going to happen? PG needs a womens recovery center. This is as good a location as any. They tried to put it in, got stopped because of the OCP, so they change thed OCP. Why would you be surprised that they had already made up their minds? In Councils’ eyes this was a done deal months ago.
Before getting upset about it, think of these two questions 1) does PG need a womens recovery center? 2) What area other area of town is somewhat remote (can’t have the addicts downtown, but, not too far that screws up servicing), has a building already and will affect a relatively small percentage of the population? Yeah, it sucks for Haldi residents, I would be pissed off too, but, as far as whole city goes, it is a pretty good fit.
Our Council is completely useless I feel for the Haldi Road resisdence that just lost thousands of dollars in property value so that the mayor can pocket her share in pushing this through.
Where can I donate to fight this apalling abuse of Government authority?
Its about time that those people who constantly state that Prince George needs a womens recovery centre gave us some facts.
Firstly. The last proposal for the proponents talked about a 90 day program. So 90 days at 30 people equals 120 people per year. In addition the cost of this centre (apparently it will be high end) would be in the range of $20,000.00 per month.
Are we to believe that there are 120 people waiting to attend this centre at $20,000.00 per month. Highly unlikely. In fact it is highly unlikely that there are 120 women in Prince George waiting for treatment at even a much cheaper cost.
So where are these women??? Lets get some facts,. I would suggest to you that this centre will accommodate women from all over the Province, and at any given moment, the majority of people in the centre will be from areas other than Prince George.
Sooooooo. Are we changing the OCP, changing the rural status of Haldi Road for a treatment centre for women from all over the Province??? If so, then this is a Provincial responsibility, and certainly not the responsibility of the City, or the Haldi road residents.
So unless people have some specific numbers in regards to who will use this facility and where they will come from, I suggest that they don’t know what they are talking about.
Have a nice day.
First off, I can’t believe I’m posting here because I am fairly certain I am conversing with a select 5-6 people. But I just need to respond to Palopu. You want to know the facts, then how about you do some research and educate yourself. Go to google and type “canada women addiction statistics”. You can find some credible academic sources.
Where do “these women” come from? Stable homes. Broken homes. Privilege and wealth and extreme poverty. Yes – treatment centers for people should be a Federal/Provincial financial responsibility. But until we actually elect a government that cares enough about vulnerable women and children to put funding into creating change, more social issues are going to fall to communities and individuals. At least Prince George has people who can buy a building and support a treatment center. I say we revisit this issue 2 years after Haldi center is up and running by canvassing those Haldi citizens who are so afraid of the scary addicted women. I predict people in the neighborhood won’t even know there is a treatment center in their area.
The contact for the Haldi Group is;
haldiroad64@gmail.com
Probably a grant from Northern Health or the Provincial Government…….
“You want to know the facts, then how about you do some research and educate yourself”
When a business wishes to start up and needs to have support from banks, financial supporters, etc. they have to do a business plan.
It was stated that no business plan has been shown to anyone. That is okay because neither City Hall nor the neighbourhood requires one. It would just be nice if some woukd get an idea of what it might look like to back up claims made.
No one else can do a business plan. They are not exactly done on the back of a napkin, unless of course Brian Fehr and Dan Maclaren are not the only people who claim they were promised something by government …… oops, did I say Brian Fehr???
what was this meeting for? city council has no interest in listening to the taxpayer, this was a farce. I hope the residents of Haldi Road sues again.
What will happen if court action delays this beyond Queen Green’s reign…could a new council and mayor look at the facts and put a stop to this nonsense and bullying of the Haldi neighborhood? After all, once the Haldi group wins in court again…a new council could start off by righting some of the wrongs and Prince George would stop looking like the Bully Centre of Canada!!
Starting to look pretty bad for Prince George, first we have the reputation of Crime Centre of Canada and now we are headed for Bully Centre of Canada….not something our Queen Green should be proud of.
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