Each Time You Peel Away a Layer of WIDC, New Questions Surface
Just what was proposed for the 400 block of George St, past home of the PG hotel, now slated for the WIDC building?
The big push behind the proposal to assemble the land and build a new downtown came from point man Dan McLaren.
If you look at the drawings presented to the NDI Trust in 2009 , ( sample shown at right) to secure a loan of up to $8.9 million dollars and supported by Dr Charles Jago , Edward Rebello, Bruce Sutherland – Chair of the NDI Trust Board at the time, Edward Hauset, Shari Green, Heather Oland- then of L&M Engineering, David McWalter – President of L&M Engineering you wouldn’t think that they had bought into the plan with the idea of a "quick flip" as suggested by Dan McLaren in a recent National Post article.
Brian Hutchinson of the National Post, writes, that in an interview, McLaren told him that "Commonwealth was stuck holding property that he had always intended for a quick flip."
McLaren wrote the fairness commissioner that,”we were duped into this deal”.
The original drawings that were presented to the board of NDI Trust suggest something different. The NDI Trust bought into the plan, before the WIDC project was formally approved by the Treasury Board ( how that could happen remains unanswered).
Even the plans themselves are suspect and one wonders who was doing the due diligence in looking at them? In one instance ( bottom right) the plan calls for the Performing Arts Canter to be part of the 400 block where the WIDC is to be built, but that changes in another page in the same presentation.
In Mid March of 2010, UNBC President George Iwama wrote a letter to then Mayor, Dan Rogers, setting out the terms under which UNBC would agree to expand into the downtown. Front and center is the condition that funding approval for the project has been received from the BC Treasury Board. Iwama wanted to know that UNBC had the money in hand before they committed to anything. In his letter, the conditions are specific: The City would have to donate not only the P.G. Hotel Lands, but the parking lots that border on 4th and 5th as well. There would have to be funding approval from the B.C. Treasusry Board, the University’s Board of Governors would have to approve both the business plan and the capital budget for the full project. The University was also doing an appraisal on the properties to see what the fair market value was. Don’t forget, someone pitched UNBC to buy the block for $12 million dollars, that’s about $3 million more than the approved amount of the loan, and well over and above the actual money handed out to Commonwealth Campuses.
Treasury Board Approval was also supposed to be required before NDI Trust loaned any money to Commonwealth Campuses, but none of the information provided to us would indicate Treasury Board approval was in place when the money was made available to Commonwealth Campuses. Why then was the loan granted?
As for the "quick flip" notion, if you look at all of the proposals and submissions, one hardly gets that feeling.
I’m Meisner, and that’s one man’s opinion
Comments
I am not too sure how long it takes people to understand that whether one is into flipping land, developing land, buying real estate, building buildings, finding where to locate various uses, and on and on it goes, everything is just a part of the normal planning process, sometimes behind closed doors and sometimes open for public scrutiny.
Until something is implemented/built, conditions change, minds change, etc.
Oh, did I say until something is built ….. LOL …
We have a classic case of that not even being the end of conditions and minds changing … the new Bingo Hall was not open for too long before the owner was looking to get rid of it … and he did.
In the minds of those who look for conspiracy theories – and we certainly have enough of those in this gossip-prone community (the Peyton Place of the Business World?) – such processes make for wonderful scandal material, both real and imaginary.
I find it interesting that soemone in the rest of the country would even pay attention to such petty stuff.
BTW, it gave Versa Design a lot of work digging up unexciting designs reflecting current fads from magazines and plopping them down onto what were supposed to be PG cityscapes.
I am sure it was fun while it lasted.
Rebello â¦. A developer who builds outside of downtown and I understood would not build a thing downtown unless financial incentives were provided to make it worthwhile.
At least these people gave it a good olde try, which is more than I can say for many people. Too bad they did not have the money to carry parts of it out. And, of course, they are the same as the rest of us, they do not have the magic potion to lull people into using the downtown for anything more than office work and servicing those workers while they are downtown. The fact that downtown is still the haven for office workers in PG may change one of these days as well. If some corporation were to come here to open up a regional or head office and want to build a âcampusâ office off Tyner, overlooking the city and the foothills of the Rockies, I am sure that the OCP would be changed in a flash as it virtually always has been.
OOOOps … did I give someone an idea …. LOL
All those empty lots should be turned into park space. Then one day we will have our own Central Park. Oh what the heck make it an off lease park too.
McLaren is in the business of playing with other peoples money in risk investments. If he was duped into this WIDC investement does that mean he dupes every client that comes through his door expecting to make a quick flip return on their money.
In the end i am sure this risk taken will eventually be well worth it. This property isn’t going to remain a sandlot where kids can play a good game of stick ball.
I agree with Gus. The best location for a new downtown urban environment is up at the University along Tyner boulevard looking out East over the bowl and the Rocky Mountains in the distance.
As for the WIDC, I think it should only go ahead as an engineering institute and if so should clearly be located at the existing university campus.
The only smart one in this whole thing seems to be George Iwama. He was not willing to dive into someones pipe dream or half baked scheme and asked for some guarantees before he even stuck a toe in.
I don’t think the university was a completely willing partner right from the beginning. Asking for the Cadillac model with treasury board funding in place was a good way to put a little distance, especially given the economic conditions.
Amazing what a little education does, actually think something through:)
I see that NDIT and Commonwealth Campus are in court in April to fight over the foreclosure.
It it not more aptly named Commonpoor Campus:D
McLaren says he was “duped” into this deal???
That’s a pretty dumb comment from someone whose company (Commonwealth) is actively encouraging people to let them “handle” their money for them to make investments.
Only a real fool would give their money to someone who admitted they were “duped” into a money deal that didn’t turn out…..
Ben is right…the more your peel the layers…the more “interesting” it gets….I am staying tuned on this channel for the long haul…I kinda think it will be well worth the attention.
Here’s an interesting arcticle describing Clark, Bell, Bond, Fehr, McLaren and the WIDC.
http://alexgtsakumis.com/2013/03/19/exclusive-breaking-news-pat-bell-accused-of-bid-rigging-wood-design-center-shirley-bond-demanding-government-funding-and-christy-clark-supporting-both-actions-dan-mclaren-and-brian-fehr-spe/
Haha……Alex Tsukumis has no clue about what really went down with McLaren and the WIDC. That’s made clear by his comments regarding McLaren, “Mr. McLaren, “a highly successful financier and insurance broker in the North, with unimpeachable integrity.” Alex is nothing more than an anti-liberal on his soap box. Take his dialog with a grain of salt.
Here is a much more interesting “article”
http://investnorthcentralbc.ca/major-projects-and-investment-opportunities/map-view/prince-george-2/wood-innovation-and-design-centre
Notice the estimated investment – $17-19M.
Then look at the pictured building.
Who puts together such drivel?
It takes an genius to pitch land assembly.
It takes an idiot to loan the money.
When it all goes bad, the genius joins the idiot ranks.
Mclaren needs to realize (and I’m sure he does) that with all investment, it’s a matter of risk/reward. If he kept all his money in his pocket, borrowed tax payer money to fund a flip that he could sell back to the taxpayer and make a healthy 3 million dollar “profit”, he has to accept some of the risk. THe fact that he brought in his Band of Merry Men to help cover the personal guarantees etc. required by the lender screams that he knew there is risk and by doing so, was wiling to share the risk as well as share the reward.
Plain and Simple.
If I had money in Commonwealth, I’d be over there faster than the customers of the “Bailey Building and Loan”.
This one directs to Derek Bates, the City Manager for more information
http://investnorthcentralbc.ca/community-profiles/prince-george/invest-in-prince-george
Those responsible for the content need to do their work!!!
Why NDIT agreed to hand over public funds to advance Dan MacLaren’s ‘ downtown pie in the sky dreamland’ is beyond me…..did Janine North and the NDIT committee (made up primarily of Northern Mayors and local elected officials)loan him this money based on pressures, promises and a prayer from MLAs Pat Bell and Shirly Bond? Did NDIT really believe the treasury board would agree to a 75 or 160 million WIDC investment(these figures keep changing)? The private sector’s investment in the glorious 10 storey 75 mil WIDC was never secured and Premier Clark had no business announcing the 75 Mil WIDC building in PG to be completed by the end of 2014 when her government didn’t have that amount approved by the treasury board, only 25 mil was agreed to by treasury, a clear misrepresentation of available public funds. Also IMHO NDIT’S loan to Dan MacLaren (a private for profit entrepreneur) also equates to misuse and poor judgement of investment of public funds. The saga continues……
If you take a close look at the building I think it is doable for 19M….does not have the high priced extras such as windows. The biggest expense would be the 10 million dollars in Popsicles in order to get enough sticks:)
Lets not forget another major player in this, Dan”for the love of god please build something ANYTHING in the downtown core” Rogers.
New idea for grades five and six science competition classes….build the best and strongest Wood Innovation and Design Centre….no bridge needed ;-)
After reading the write up on the website posted by Gus, investnorthcentralbc.ca, I must be living in a different Prince George than that detailed in the article.
People want something developed – such as one or more buildings or a portion of a downtown over many years.
I do not think anyone involved with this believed that the image presented above was intended to reflect PG in 2015, 2020, or even 2025 â it was a future projection which needed to go together with a future projection of city population. We have several versions of the population projections. And we all know we have several versions of current population.
So why would we get the image right if we know we have been unable to get the population base which such buildings would depend on for their economic survival right.
People who want the development will typically endorse a project or a company which has an opportunity to get to where they want the community to go. Of course council, the mayor, the local MLAs, the Premier and the man in the moon will endorse such things because they have been crossing their fingers fro a long time and many having been spinning wheels.
So a hot rodder assembles a pit crew and gets some commercial endorsements to put on the car and begins the race. Too bad, he flamed out from the looks of it and the little wooden soap box derby vehicle ends up as the winner?
Perhaps. I still do not see the guy with the checkered flag and the buxom gal in a skimpy bikini standing at the finish line.
Writing Tip of the Day
I didn’t have time to write a short letter, so I wrote a long one instead.
– Mark Twain (1835-1910)
In a book called “How to Buy Real Estate With No Money Down”, page one, chapter one, line one, it reads, “Find a bank manager with brain damage”.
blog/view/27864/1/widc+should+not+go+ahead+says+poll?
Some guy named “anotherside” should heed Mr.Twain’s advice
You are right Lonesome, it is a new day :)
“Whatsoever a man soweth, that shall he also reap” … Bible
I am not too sure whether women fit into that as well ….. ;-)
Since the mayor is an old friend of Brian Fehr according to a recent media release, it makes one wonder if the Haldi fiasco was promised….Will need to look into who else was a major campaign contributor to the council of the two property owners – Fehr and Woods… In such a small town a lot of people are close friends…….equalizing to conflict of interest?
Ride-on said “.Alex Tsukumis has no clue about what really went down with McLaren and the WIDC. That’s made clear by his comments regarding McLaren, “Mr. McLaren, “a highly successful financier and insurance broker in the North, with unimpeachable integrity.” Alex is nothing more than an anti-liberal on his soap box. Take his dialog with a grain of salt.”
Mr. Tsakumis reports word for word the two conversations he had with McLaren and Fehr. If what he records is an accurate report, then he clearly does know what he is talking about, and it does not bode well for Bell, Bond and Clarke.
As for him being anti-Liberal, well, so what. About half the provincial voters are anti-Liberal at the moment. His distaste for the Liberal Party does not mean that his information is incorrect. If that were the case, then every single negative comment made by anti-NDP types about the NDP would have to be assumed to be deliberate lies, now wouldn’t they? Are they? Pray do tell!
I don’t know whether Tsakumis’ information is completely valid, partially valid, misinterpreted or false, but it is compelling enough for me to pay attention and watch what happens. I will also say that the accusations agains the three MLAs are serious enough with enough substantiation behind them to warrant a full legal inquiry, either by the RCMP or in the form of a Judicial Inquiry. How can this not be done? Let’s get these two men (McLaren and Fehr) to testify under oath so we can get to the bottom of this sordid little affair.
When the election dusts settle in next May, the most possible scenario is an NDP government. I doubt that the new NDP government will retain the services of the heads of public institutions and boards involved in this UNBC WIDC scandal.
I can understand Dr Charles Jago being in the city for almost 2 decades play ball in this scandal, but I don’t understand how Dr George Iwama can do it in his very first year in this city.
Did anyone warn him of the dark corners of this city and the shadowy characters? Didn’t we warn him publicly in media not to follow in Dr Jago’s footsteps in UNBC and Prince George? Does he now regret sticking with his predecessor’s policies and *not* reversing the bad policies of them in UNBC?
What is he going to do now in the remaining time? Will he change course of the UNBC ship? Or is it too late …?
“What’s past is prologue.”
[William Shakespeare, The Tempest]
“I will also say that the accusations agains the three MLAs”
Accusations where made in the house by the NDP, when Bell challenged them to make the accusations outside the house the NDP tucked their collective tails between their legs and ran.
Interesting Seamutt, because immediately afterwards Bell made similar comments to Leonard Krog, who told Bell to take it outside himself. Bell tucked his tail between his legs and ran!
The accusations have been made outside the house by McLaren, Fehr and Tsakumis, so why is Bell now silent?
If you believe Tsakumis is unbiased in his ramblings then you probably also believe that BC flourished under the previous NDP government…
Goog link, hummer.
Cheers
The accusations have been made outside the house by McLaren, Fehr and Tsakumis, so why is Bell now silent?
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Interesting observation, ammonora.
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If you believe Tsakumis is unbiased in his ramblings then you probably also believe that BC flourished under the previous NDP government…
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Your right on intercepter. And for another thing there wasnt all the corruption and the mlies that the Liberal are responsible for.
cheers
So, OK, Tsakumis is biased as hell! Now, are his accusations true? Are his recordings of his conversations with Fehr and McLaren true?
That is the only valid point, surely.
ammonra: “So, OK, Tsakumis is biased as hell!”
That’s pretty much all you need to know. He panders to his audience well, or should I say, preaches to his choir.
By the same argument, then, all you really need to know about the anti-NDP supporters of the Liberals. They are biased as hell, so must be liars, preaching to their choir.
“Mr. Tsakumis reports word for word the two conversations he had with McLaren and Fehr.” …. LOL
“Let’s get these two men (McLaren and Fehr) to testify under oath so we can get to the bottom of this sordid little affair.”
That is what Pat Bell was trying to do by getting the NDP to make the accusations in public rather than in a place of what may as well be called diplomatic immunity.
NDP still tucked and ran. I am voting for change only. They are all a wast of skin.
If McLaren did testify would be him or his son.
Tsakumis starts off many of his articles on HIS site with EXCLUSIVEâ BREAKING NEWS.
It is his site. They are his writings. He is likely not syndicated. So it is EXCLUSIVE.
Kind of an overstatement as are the articles which typically follow.
A showman, at best.
Should be better known as a phoney.
From the phoney’s EXCLUSIVE article:
“First, I called Dan McLaren, the man whose company, Commonwealth Campus, was going to buy the land for WDIC and flip to Northern Development Initiative Trust, who, in turn, were going to flip to government.”
Does he really know how this was going to be done. Does he know that it was done for the Hotel site, which is all that is required for the building and that what he describes is not the process used. It is basically 1/4 of the block. Has NDIT ever owned any property?
No one is building a copy of the Sears Tower in Chicago.
Tsakumis looks like he is trying to create his own fox news. That is the way he gets his money, money
I would also like to know where he got his information about mclarens integrity. Did he talk to anyone? who were they? Does he know Mclaren? Did he go to school with him, have coffee, had a dinner. If you state something ,then you should then give us your source.
I would also like to know where he got his information about mclarens integrity. Did he talk to anyone? who were they? Does he know Mclaren? Did he go to school with him, have coffee, had a dinner. If you state something ,then you should then give us your source.
I would also like to know where he got his information about mclarens integrity. Did he talk to anyone? who were they? Does he know Mclaren? Did he go to school with him, have coffee, had a dinner. If you state something ,then you should then give us your source.
This is the first time in my life I have read that a person who describes someone as a person who has integrity was going to flip a piece of property.
The term “flipping” is a descriptive term for real estate schemes involving illegal conduct at worst and as a derogatory term for legal real estate investing strategies that are perceived to be unethical or socially destructive.
That someone can suggest that someone has integrity while he is describing how he is going to be flipping properties, especially to public bodies who are paying the excessive prices with taxpayer money, is beyond me.
But then we are talking about Tsakumis and McLaren.
In 2009 Councillor Green joined Dan MacLaren in a meeting with key BC Liberal ministers to lobby for a 30 year tax exemption for downtown projects….shows Green was a big supporter of Dan MacLaren’s Commonwealth projects back then….I hope a thorough investigation takes place and includes all the players
http://www.opinion250.com/blog/view/…/shari+green+wants+core+review
Sorry, hope this link works better http://www.opinion250.com/blog/view/…/Shari+green+core+review
DNHey – fatal error on link..thanks for trying but I’ll bumble my way through and look it up myself ;)
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