Prosperity Decision All Wrong
As a young man I spent a good deal of time flying over Canada’s north moving goods to various mines in northern Saskatchewan, and the North West Territories.
One of the things that I found most interesting was just how little a foot print a mine would make on the landscape. We flew with maps and an eye to the ground, which made it doubly important that you knew where you were heading. If you weren’t right on the money it was pretty easy to fly right on by the mines that were opening up and extracting Uranium and other minerals in the north.
It may be a rather unusual way of backing into an opinion piece, but I wanted to lay some ground work on just how little a foot print a mine leaves. Prosperity was to be such a mine and I pride myself in saying while I respect the environment, this mine was not about to break up a huge portion of the BC landscape as some would suggest.
As a matter of fact, Prosperity would have had a much smaller impact on the environment than a logging operation. Because the Pine beetle was left unchecked in that region, the areas logged look like a barren landscape. Yet we haven’t stood up and shook our fists in the air.
Prosperity was set to deliver 550 full time jobs to an area that very soon is going to feel the effects of the loss of that timber that I refer to. The mills have already announced the impending cut backs.
No one would suggest that a mine be allowed to open and operate with little to no regard for the environment, but when was the last time you heard of a major complaint in the operation of the Gibraltar mine, owned and operated by the same company?
If the federal cabinet does not step in and do something about this then we have no one to blame but the governing power. Dick Harris who happens to be the Conservative MP for the region, has broken ranks to show his displeasure, perhaps driven in large measure by the fact he has toured the area and understands just how little an impact the mine will have. That combined with the jobs in an area facing a weak economy would seem to be reason enough to have listened to his pleadings.
The decision was a bad one, plain and simple.
I’m Meisner and that’s one man’s opinion.
Comments
It doesn’t matter what you can “see”, what matters is what the science is telling us. Flying over some mines or walking around the bush near a mine in no way shape or form makes someone qualified to evaluate the environmental impacts for such a development. Let’s be honest here Ben and let the people who understand the science behind it do their jobs.
I’m not comparing the two, but I’m sure Chernobyl looks wonderful flying over it.
Anthrax in my drinking water still looks sparkly clear too, Ben! Your flyover analogy is a bad one Im afraid.
I agree with Ben 100%
“Wow” is about all I can say. Let’s not let science get in the way of an opinion.
Really compareing a logged area that will grow back to a lake that will be drained and filled with tailings
There is a history with mine proposal dating back to 1995 and the creation of Chilko Lake Park and the Carlboo Land Use Plan. Turning down this project is all politics as the Government and the review panel skipped over the economic benefits and past agreements.
Someone buy some Prosperity stocks?
Think not but remember the CCLUP agreement very well along with adding 12% of the area as new provincial parks to reach agreement on forestry and Mining activity in the region. Seems others forget I didn’t.
Well said Ben. I agree totally!!!!
Totally agree. Canada is a resource producer. A country with resource production has a higher standard of living. We want jobs for us, jobs for our kids, universal healthcare, old folks homes when we get old, pubs to sit in when we need a few, infrastructure to make everything in our lives a possibility. That mine offered a huge push to a region that needs one.
Agree with this. It takes a short time to approve a massive cutblock yet years to maybe approve a minesite with alot stricter enviromental regulations.
These bloody mines (and other big projects) operate on the premise of maximum profit, minimum cost. So at any given moment they are trying to save money at the expense of the environment, etc; at the expense of people in the affected areas.
Can they not for once just spend a few extra millions and do the job properly. This to me would be the most reasonable and logical way to go, and everybody wins.
An example would be the Kemess mine that was turned down. The proposal now is to truck the tailings to the old mine site and use that facility, rather than contaminate another Lake. This is the type of solutions we need.
Spend a few more dollars, and make a little less profit over the long term, and everyone wins.
I for one am sick and tired of multi million (billion) dollar mining corporations crying the blues about a few paltry dollars, when we all know they are making mega millions in profits.
Contaminating (killing, sacrificing) a lake was just a plainly stupid idea.
There must be some very valid reasons why the proposed Prosperity gold/copper mine latest remake was rejected. What are they?
The pine beetle infestation was allowed to progress at its natural pace. The environmental ‘damage’ is a natural consequence. Given enough time these now seemingly barren stretches of land will have new vegetation appear naturally. If we want to speed this process up we will have to do some very extensive replanting.
Effluent from a mine is another matter altogether. It must be handled in such a manner that it is harmless to the environment.
The company already indicated that it is going back to the drawing board.
Good!
Has the mine actually come out and said these would be 550 local jobs. For all anyone knows these could be jobs given to people from other parts of the country or from another country for that matter. If there is a shortage of skilled labour for this mine in the area, is the mine willing to help pay to retrain the people who are losing jobs in the forest sector? It seems a company can splash job numbers around without any details and people assume this means these jobs are for them. I would hazard a guess (based on the current trends) and say that the vast majority of these jobs are going to be fly in jobs from other areas and most of the money these workers make will go with them when they go out. If mines want to open and work in an area they should have to employ a minimum amount of local people, local being within a 100 mile radius say.
All resource projects have some degree of impact to the environment. The real issue and uncertanty is the sliding bar of how much risk/impacts society is willing to tollerate in order to trade for utility. I dont think its a question of “if” these projects go forward its more of a “when” as commodiites especially metals become more scarce as Asia wants a slice of the standard of living we have here.
Ben compares logging to mining.. If logging development did acid rock and metal leaching predictions (which is what the prosperity decison was based on.) then alot of logging would not be allowed either.. Ive been down logging roads where the ARD is puking into rivers. If a mining company did that they would be hung..
I too agree with Ben! 455 well-paying jobs-what a payroll! The decision should be reversed immediately! I see no reason to elaborate further.
For the record,I’m PRO mine, I just thought the analogy Ben used to make his case was ridiculous. Not even apples to oranges but apples to monkey feces…sawdust versus cyanide leaching.
So the ugly yet completely harmless hives that cover 75% of a patient’s body are bad…yet the small dime-sized malignant tumor on their liver (which will kill them in 12 months) is okay because Ben can’t see it doing a flyover.
Gotcha.
I think the point Ben was trying to make is that the footprint of these kinds of projects is less than most anti-industry types perceive.
Bang on Ben. First, the latest proposal DOES NOT entail draining the lake. Second, the idea that this mine would employee a herd of foreign workers is ludicrous. Third, Palpou, the latest proposal would have cost the company substantially more than a “few paltry dollars”.
Gilbralter has and continues to have a massive economic impact on the local economy. The world didn’t end with it’s development. As Ben said, the environment must be respected, but this company has spent tens of millions putting this proposal together knowing that destroying the area is a non starter.
Sad day for the interior. All the bleating about child poverty,poorly paid teachers, yada, yada….needs economic activity to pay for it.
Have to agree with Ben, would have been a pinprick in the vast landscape. Without mining where would all our stuff come from, some third world country with little or no envirimental standards.
Just what is the science behind this cancellation? The lake with its muddy tasting fish was to be protected in this recent application. More information is required.
Beetle kill had more to do with forest practices than anything else.
Oh yes Dick Harris is annoyed with the result. But Dick comes from another school. Aparently the Federals have given approval too Suncore in Albeta to destroy an entire wetland to dig for more oil.
And hey Pal your on the money.
Cheers
dow I don’t think 500 jobs will end child poverty in BC or do anything for teachers! With the temp foreign workers coming in to fill so-called skilled jobs why not invest in training people that live in BC for jobs that already exist in BC? why do we get all upset about a few potential jobs when we apparently have lots of jobs but lack the people with the skills to fill them.
How true Boudicca. They knew about the job losses in forestry were coming. Why not start freeing up some money now for training. We don’t need any more job fairs. Check the local paper in Prince George and I don’t see a lot of ads looking for welders,mechs, pipefitters etc. There never was a shortage of workers that they are talking about. One thing for sure they will be looking for cheap labour and will look to foreign workers.
oldman: “Check the local paper in Prince George and I don’t see a lot of ads looking for welders,mechs, pipefitters etc. “
First of all, very few companies rely on newspaper listings to find people nowadays. There are companies competing for skilled trades in the oil and gas industry. Good people are nearly impossible to find. There are plenty of jobs available if you have the skills, but you have to be willing to move. Or fly in/fly out.
This one project alone won’t end child poverty or whatever the latest progressive flavor of the day is. The point is that resource taxes and income taxes are necessary to fund all government programs. You don’t pay teachers with buttons.
I also am tired of the job training angle. When does a worker take some responsibility to train for their own career. If I wanted to make 150k as a welder, I don’t expect the government to hold my hand to get the ticket.
Time for workers to grow a pair and take responsibility for their destiny.
“I think the point Ben was trying to make is that the footprint of these kinds of projects is less than most anti-industry types perceive” .. first of all, how does someone who is against this mine suddenly become “anti-industry”? Secondly, I am sure most of them are very capable of understanding Bens words and do not need people like you to spell it out in your own chosen words. By the way, I am neither for nor against the mine, I believe if it can be done responsibly then let it go ahead, otherwise look at other options.
Retired02 go to Google earth and check the oil sands footprint. Then go to Edmonton, Toronto, metro Vancouver and check those footprints.
I also am tired of the job training angle. When does a worker take some responsibility to train for their own career. If I wanted to make 150k as a welder, I don’t expect the government to hold my hand to get the ticket.
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Its not just seleting your career when it comes to training in a trade. It involes the emplyer as well. They have to have entered into a program to train the apprentices and that involves money that it appears emplyers are not willing to provide.
The government talks about all these traing oppertunities but its just so much hot air. Employers are needed to commit to these programs. What they need to do is find those employers first.
Cheers
People still read the newspaper to look for work? Wow… Who knew?
The environmentalists and the people who are opposed to any industrial activity on principle will be celebrating this decision, but it will have an effect on mining in the bigger picture, which remains to be seen.
It will be harder to attract any sort of investment when there is a general uncertainty for proposals going forward. We all want our healthcare, education, and infrastructure, but that money has to come from somewhere. Too bad many don’t understand this.
Yes JohnnyBelt and there might come a day when you don’t have enough money to by a clean glass of water.
Most people care about the environment; however, the limits of good sense are always pushed to the extreme and usually surrounded by hypocrisy.
Does anybody care about the familyâs looking for work to feed young families?
Does anybody care that in the next few years where we will be losing countless jobs in our forestry industry? We know that more mills are going to be shut down because we do not have enough fiber to supply them…that probably doesnât matter for the many retired or people that have solid jobs that will not be effected by a major down turn in the economy.
Mining produces good and high paying jobs and is required for people to have the simplest of living requirements; food, water, power, transportation would not be available if it was not for products produced by mining (just to mention a few)…Could you live without these?
oldman: “Yes JohnnyBelt and there might come a day when you don’t have enough money to by a clean glass of water.”
There won’t be any jobs, so nobody will be buying anything. So what was your point again?
Hey oldman, are you still working or are you one of those retired people who suddenly became a neo-environmenalist after working one of those ‘dirty resource sector jobs’ their whole lives? There seems to be a lot of those types around lately.
Most people have no idea how much our standard of living most take for granted is because of the resource sectors, mining, oil and gas, and forestry.
“It will be harder to attract any sort of investment when there is a general uncertainty for proposals going forward. We all want our healthcare, education, and infrastructure, but that money has to come from somewhere. Too bad many don’t understand this”
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Have you considered that perhaps this particular application was simply a poor proposal?
Have you considered the fact that some companies understand due diligence and do a better job of mitigating risks than others?
Have you considered that perhaps we should encourage investment from the latter group and discourage investment from the former?
The problem NMG, is that the general public doesn’t know a good proposal from a bad one. If the general public had a degree of intelligence and objectivity about such things, then we could do as you say and encourage ‘good’ proposals. But unfortunately, there is a growing segment of the population where no proposal will ever be good enough.
How can it be good science when it neglected the till liner? Ben is spot on. Want to see grizzly bears? Best place in the province in PRC in tumbler ridge. Mines create jobs, and they create wildlife as guns are restricted on site.
The biggest big horn sheep in the world live in the old Cadomin mine site in Alberta. This decision is a real delight for the uneducated, industry hating enviros with their chicken little outlook. It was a good plan, saved the slough some call fish lake, and it should be approved immediately to ensure the jobs are there when the mills start shutting shifts. It’s right around the corner folks.
“It will be harder to attract any sort of investment when there is a general uncertainty for proposals going forward. We all want our healthcare, education, and infrastructure, but that money has to come from somewhere. Too bad many don’t understand this.” .. Gee, isn’t that what all you guys were saying would happen if the NDP got in, guess we didn’t have to count on them to cause this afterall.
“There won’t be any jobs, so nobody will be buying anything. So what was your point again?” .. Geez, talk about fear mongering, I see hypocrisy is still alive and well in all those people who “claim” to be the only ones who know the “real” truth about our economy and how it must be run.
“Most people have no idea how much our standard of living most take for granted is because of the resource sectors, mining, oil and gas, and forestry.” .. Here we go with the “I know more than you, therefore you’re opinion is wrong” spiel that is getting old.
“The problem NMG, is that the general public doesn’t know a good proposal from a bad one.” .. what a sanctimonious, pretentious ass you are. You should really learn to think before speaking sometime.
Huh, JB’s idea of a functioning economy dwarfs yours.
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