So where were they over the summer months? Unified hoildays?

“I don’t think anyone wants to sign off on a contract that doesn’t meet the rate of inflation”

I understand you don’t care about what your wage and benefit demands cost taxpayers. What makes you entitled to more than the other public unions have bargained and settled for? And how do you expect the government to cover the ‘me too’ clauses if you get twice what the other public unions settled for?

Are you still asking for a $5000 signing bonus? Good luck with that.

Our public sector workers generally enjoy a much more stable and consistent work environment, largely sheltered from the economic upturns and slowdowns. During our most recent, wide spread and long lasting recession beginning in 2008, many many people suffered through job and financial losses. Some lost their homes, others survived by using a line of credit and others by depleting saving and retirement funds!

Our teachers and I believe most other public sector workers were largely insulated from the effects of this recession!

Now we are hearing about teachers who are dipping into savings in order to pay their bills, teachers who are using lines of credit to pay their bills, and teachers who are in fear of losing their homes as they deal with the lack of a paycheque!

Welcome to the world that the rest of us face, some on almost a daily basis! I don’t recall our teachers shedding any tears for the rest of us during the recession, instead I seem to recall the BCTF consistently demanding more, more, more!

So, I’m supposed to shed tears for the BCTF and our teachers now because…….?

Oh so I guess the other public sector had 0 for the last 4 years and the government stripped there contract after they settled. Really guys you have no argument.

That’s the question I have too. What makes the teacher worth double the wage and benefit increase of all of the other public sector employees and how does that help the children?

Ps – the talk I’m hearing is the teachers are not near as unified as Iker would have us believe…

Lining up kids on a picket line…again? Poor taste BCTF.

Still no comment on here doesn’t get it. It’s coming from the government how true is there word. How many other sectors settled for 0 not one that I know of

I was under the impression that the signing bonus was the idea of the government side. Now, I see that the teachers are being slammed because they accepted this proposal from the government. Seems to me they are damned if they do and damned if they don’t to some right wingers.

Why do they deserve raises in real terms? Because they are citizens of BC providing a valuable service and should be compensated properly. why else? What a pity the government got involved. They should have left it to the people who are supposed to negotiate contracts, the BCPSEA. I suppose they couldn’t give up a chance to stick their fingers in the pot and stir. I do wonder, though, since Fassbender and Christy Clarke are making all the decisions, what we are paying the BCPSEA people for doing, because it appears to be just saying, “Yes sir, no sir, three bags full sir” as they parrot what government tells them to parrot. Why pay twice, once for Clarke and Fassbender and again for BCPSEA seat warmers?

buzzinga, I don’t understand your arguement – who are you saying is trying to settle for zero. From what I understand, the teachers are asking for double what other unions have negotiated. There is no mention of anyone getting zero anywhere. The standard is 2% a year – and a really good union will get 3% – that means the BCTF must be demanding between 4% and 6%. And a $5,000 signing bonus? That is a lot of money.

Where do you get zero from?

Just in: The teachers union has been offered the same increase which 150,000 other public service workers have already accepted, but no signing bonus, since the others did not get one. The Premier says there is 375 million on the table for class composition.

Expensive enough for the taxpayers.

http://vernonta.com/images/salarygraph.jpg

teacher haters..give that a look.. shows how huge of raises the teachers have had averging less than %1 a raise in the last 16 years… way behind other public sector employess..and stupidly wayyy behind clarks croonies.

Also JB.. the government offered them $1200.. the teachers countered with %5000… its called negotiating.. guess you cant grasp it.. so lets say they split it..Comes to $3100, the government gets about %60 ( my bonuses get hit at that rate ) of it so the teachers will see approx $1275… once you see how far behind they are in getting a raise to even keep up to inflation is not much.

Clark broke the law when she was education minister.. she keeps appealing the decisions against her government spending our tax dollars on lawyers fight this losing battle.. took 900 million out of ICBC coffers..where did that go ?? Wants to raise ICBC rates to cover what she took.. lovely.. Increasing Hydro costs to us.. even though running water through a turbine does not go up in price.. but hydro sure is.. whats happening with that money….??

Lots going in and no idea what they are doing with it.. certainly isnt going to Families first…

$375 Million for Classroom Composition. What she forgot to tell you is that is $75 Million each year for 5 years… 5 x $75 = $375. That’s the LIF fund that has short changed students since the unconstitutional Bill 22 was brought in. They took $350 Million/year out in supports for students and add back $75 Million/year. But then you all knew that didn’t you.

Zero % raises?? Teachers took 7 years of zero in the past 12 years.

As a taxpayer, I don’t want any deal which throws the government into a huge deficit to cover costs. That goes for the ‘me too’ clause for the other 150,000 public sector employees.

The goverment has tabled an offer for wages and benefits which is in line with what others have accepted, with an additional 375 million for the class size and composition issue. As PG says, that’s a rich enough deal, considering taxpayers are footing the bill.

Contrary to the beliefs of some like P Val, taxpayers are not a bottomless pit of money.

@ ammonra, you question “Why pay twice, once for Clarke and Fassbender and again for BCPSEA seat warmers?”

That comment makes me ask, why do we need the BCTF?? What a bunch of bloodsucking leaches living off of the avails of the union dues taken from teachers!

Perhaps we should disband the BCTF, let teachers keep what they are currently paying each month in Union dues and instead let them nominate a teacher from each district to speak on their behalf??

JB.. but its okay for the tax payers to cover the huge raises for clark and her croonies ? its okay for all the other public sectors to get raises but not teachers ? So its okay for us tax payers to pay for everyone else but teachers… interesting and derailed train of thought..

puff puff pass JB…lol

PVal, tax rate on income earned between 75,000 and 86,000 is 32.5% of which 10.5% goes to the province, so on 200 million signing bonus, they only get back a little over 20 million. It’s a common misconception that once you move into a higher tax bracket, that income in the lower brackets will be taxed at higher rates. Only the income in the higher bracket attracts tax at the higher rate, and the highest rate in BC is currently 45.8%. So, no, 60% tax on the bonus is not correct.

This idea of we got nothing for 3 years, that was a negotiated contract. It wasn’t zero. It included increased leave provisions. And, 2006 to 2010 teachers received 3.2% a year, plus they got a $4,000.00 signing bonus on that contract. Inflation 2006 – 1.67, 2007 – 2.38, 2008 – 1.16, 2009, 1.32, 2010 – 2.35. So, for 5 years teachers enjoyed a wage increase greater than inflation, and a signing bonus to boot. Perhaps that’s why they agreed to 3 years of zero, because they had received more than inflation for 5 years previous. Just a thought.

Information on teacher contracts found below.

http://www.vancouversun.com/business/Timeline+long+troubled+bargaining+history+teachers+provincial+government/9864912/story.html

ski51.. yes it is correct… I lose about %60 of my bonuses to taxes.. I live in BC.. so dont lie. I wish it was only %45.8 in your fantasy world but my pay stub shows the truth.

Even in your little math haven the teachers at %45.8 would only see 1650ish.. not much for not having a raise in 7 years. Minus how much the government is saving by shutting down hundreds of schools ( maintenance and janitors, heat power etc) minus all the teachers aids they have axed over the years.. The government is pocketing millions upon millions from these cuts.. any idea who is gaining from this.. just look at the wages for our provincial government and the huge jumps in wages they are getting.. but again I guess thats okay to you.. just as long as teachers dont see a dime.. after all..they are only teaching the kids who will be one day running the province……

PVal: “JB.. but its okay for the tax payers to cover the huge raises for clark and her croonies ?”

Um, no. But even still, are there 40,000+ ‘cronies’?

And again, why should the teachers get a bonus for going on strike and causing disruption?

P Val, I am a professional accountant. If you lost 60% of your bonus to taxes, chances are you got a larger tax refund, smaller tax bill that year, because the withholding taxes were incorrect. What does happen, is a bonus triggers larger than normal source deductions, because payroll software makes the assumption you will make that amount for the whole year, takes too much off, then it’ get’s returned when you file your tax return. From CRA website. Just google cra marginal tax rates and see for yourself. Keep in mind no matter what side of the dispute you’re on, knowing how the tax system really works is beneficial for you, because if you’ve believed wrong for years, you’ve probably passed up income you could’ve made, thinking you were paying more than than you really were.

Federal tax rates for 2014
15% on the first $43,953 of taxable income, +
22% on the next $43,954 of taxable income (on the portion of taxable income over $43,953 up to $87,907), +
26% on the next $48,363 of taxable income (on the portion of taxable income over $87,907 up to $136,270), +
29% of taxable income over $136,270.
10.5% on the next $11,141, +
12.29% on the next $18,504, +
14.7% on the next $45,142, +
16.8% on the amount over $150,000

Hart Guy says, “why do we need the BCTF?? … Perhaps we should disband the BCTF”.

The answer hart Guy is that YOU do not need, and obviously do not want, the BCTF. However, if you are not a public school teacher then it is not your choice and you have no say in it. The law says teachers have the right to choose their own representatives, and it doesn’t matter whether you like it or not. They have chosen their reps and obviously are behind them in what they are doing. If you disband the BCTF you will be violating Labour law just like Christy violated the constitution. That will cost the taxpayer a whole bunch more money when the government has to defend itself in the supreme court yet again. Your suggestion is therefore somewhat ridiculous coming from someone so hung up on the taxes they pay. As I have said before, think it through. Knee jerk reactions contribute nothing other than exposing prejudice.

“let them nominate a teacher from each district to speak on their behalf??”

Essentially, that is what they do now. They elect the BCTF Board and negotiating team in a democratic manner. I’m sorry if a democratic selection offends you.

JB.. if the teachers dont deserve a bonus then why was the government the first to put one on the table ?

ammonra, I am not suggesting that I or my Government disband the BCTF. I am suggesting that if I was a teacher and I looked at what I was getting for my hard earned union dues, I would be wondering why on earth I would want to continue contributing to such an archaic confrontational and unrealistic organization.

If democracy is your word of the day, why must a teacher join the union in the first place? So much for democracy!

P Val: “JB.. if the teachers dont deserve a bonus then why was the government the first to put one on the table ?”

Who knows? In most of the rest of the world, bonuses are given for good work, not for disruption.

Hart Guy: “ammonra, I am not suggesting that I or my Government disband the BCTF. I am suggesting that if I was a teacher and I looked at what I was getting for my hard earned union dues, I would be wondering why on earth I would want to continue contributing to such an archaic confrontational and unrealistic organization.”

Good point. I would also be asking what happened to all those union dues since the BCTF seems to be broke and unable to pay its own members strike pay.

JB so you bitch about the bonus then once it’s mentioned that crusty first offered it you now respond with..” Who knows ”

Laughably pathetic.. Ooops. Got ya. Lol

In your dreams, P Val… In your dreams.

For what it’s worth, the government shouldn’t have offered the bonus in the first place. Obviously, it’s undeserved.

Just want a equal raise to other public sectors..

Clark’s deputy ministers. %7.6 a year for 5 years
Vancouver police %2.9
Machinists and steelworkers %3.2
Postal workers %2.4
Burnaby cupe %2.0
Bc hydro. Bcit. %2.0

Teachers proposal %1.6. So what’s all the whining about more than other sectors.. Shouldn’t they all get at least %2.0 if they keep all public unions to the same.. But the teachers only want 1.6. So much for it being all about wages..

NEXT…

Do your numbers factor in the cost of benefits, P Val, or is that just wages?

No sure of the benefits Clark’s ministers got..but I am sure they would even make you puke.

There are not 40000 deputy ministers, P Val.

More than 1 is to many if they make 3 times one teacher does

Hart guy asks, “If democracy is your word of the day, why must a teacher join the union in the first place? ”

Because the majority of teachers voted to do so. That is the same democratic principle used in our general elections and explains why the Liberal government can reduce business taxes making individuals pay more and more hidden taxes (Hydro, ICBC, medical premiums, etc, etc, etc ad nauseum).

Out of one side of your mouth you say, “Perhaps we should disband the BCTF”, then out of the other side you say,” I am not suggesting that I or my Government disband the BCTF”. That boggles the mind!

Jonnybels ask, “what happened to all those union dues since the BCTF seems to be broke.”

It was spent defending the BCTF in the court challenges to Christy’s illegal ending of the teachers’ contract. You know, the ones where the court said the government had violated the constitution and tried its best to provoke a strike. Now they have succeeded, of course. What a surprise!

A majority on here says it’s all about wages.. Well at only %1.6 raise it is clearly not..

For those who think it still is please explain why with numerous other public sectors getting at least %2.0

We keep hearing what one sector gets so does the other..well that clearly isn’t true..

Guess it must be something else….