There is no such thing as “100% clean energy.” Stop talking and marching about it, if you want to divest your life of fossil fuel dependence, then do it. It is possible, with a lot of work and money, or you could just gather a few supplies, put them in a backpack and walk off into the bush and live off the land. It’s all about what you want and the trade-offs you’re willing to make.

Just kind of wondering how they got to and from there?

Dozens, wow. At least there was no riot as in Paris.

Kind of a chilly day for warming protest, any bicycles? Just look at all the petroleum based clothing used to keep warm, hypocritical or what.

http://wattsupwiththat.com/2015/11/29/ipcc-science-ipcc-government/

heres a good one, substitute Canada.

http://wattsupwiththat.com/2015/11/28/are-aussie-teachers-putting-green-indoctrination-ahead-of-education/

The way they’re all dressed it looks like a little global warming might be appreciated. Get a kick out of that “Ditch capitalism save the planet” sign. I wonder if that young lady has a clue about what capitalism really is? Probably not. So far as I’m aware, any society that uses tools, i.e. ‘things to make things with’, is a ‘capitalist’ society. I wonder how she’d fare in a world with no tools to provide her with food, clothing and shelter? Especially one that’s supposed to be a great deal cooler than the world as we know it?

By walking, riding a bike, riding in a motorized vehicle, etc, all done on a road paved with a fossil based asphalt or a concrete sidewalk made with cement manufactures with the heat from a fossil fuel.

They come from and go back to a residence likely heated by fossil fuels.

Who cares? they have little choice. They are marching to get more alternate energy sources in place.

Time you got some better argument acrider55 and the others who use such ridiculous arguments.

Its a human rights issue alright denying half the worlds population access to cheap power. Wonder if these people even think about 1.5 billion that have no electricity at all while enjoying their very comfortable existence derived from the petroleum industry. All hypocrites.

Don’t see anyone wearing furs that they sourced themselves. Oh most likely all vegans.

For those who deny that GHG contribute to global climate change.

“All truth passes through three stages.
First, it is ridiculed.
Second, it is violently opposed.
Third, it is accepted as being self-evident.”

Interesting! Reading today, from the article…

“Inconvenient timing: On eve of Paris Climate Conference, Spain’s Abengoa Solar goes bankrupt”.

Abengoa, one of Spain’s wealthiest companies is bankrupt.

Nine billion Euros in debt — that’s about $14 billion. 27,000 employees.

The largest bankruptcy in Spanish history.

And because Spain has amongst the highest power prices in Europe — about triple what we pay here in Canada — driven out a lot of manufacturing.

The unemployment rate is in Spain now? 22%. And that’s the lowest it’s been in years.

So, yeah, Spain. That’s you’re role model, especially for Ontario’s Kathleen Wynne — and now Alberta’s Rachel Notley…

Solar and Wind power both seem to need and receive a lot of subsidies, ongoing subsidies in order to survive. However, what with Notley’s recent announcement to shut down many of Alberta’s coal-fired electrical generating stations by 2030, how much do you want to bet that Alberta will very soon be considering, seriously considering the 4th dam on the Peace River, this one on the Alberta side of the border?

Oops, forgot to mention one very important point, Abengoa, one of Spain’s wealthiest companies also happens to have solar plants ALL AROUND THE WORLD!

That’s what I get for trying to post a comment while watching the Grey Cup!

Go Eskies Go!

heres some reading for those cold hypocrites.

Any care to refute, I’ll be waiting

http://wattsupwiththat.com/2015/11/29/aps-seth-borenstein-gets-something-right-but-only-the-date/

Who cares? The Chinese will take up the slack and supply the solar panel markets.

PrinceGeorge, the point is that Abengoa went belly up and that Abengoa builds and operates solar generating stations!

Who cares if the Chinese take up the slack SUPPLYING the solar panel market? The point is that those buying the panels in order to build a plant to generate and supply electricity can’t seem to make a profit doing so!

I’m really surprised that you missed that point! You must be watching the Grey Cup!

Seamutt can you post something other than blogs to back up your claims? Same stuff you have been posting here for years. Its not science based. Just some bloggers that deny climate change.

I wonder how long it will take before governments start taxing solar panels, and windmills, and all these other energy sources that are supposed to be so climate friendly? The reason I ask is what seems to have happened in some places where water meters were sold the public as being a way to ensure we were conserving this most precious resource.

You’ve seen the sales pitch, I’m sure. The one that relates the plight of thirsty people in the drought ridden areas of sub-Saharan Africa to our supposedly massive pre-water meter waste of water. Some places took the message to heart, apparently. When water meters were installed the people there decided they’d do their bit to reduce, re-use and re-cycle. They collected rainwater in cisterns from their house’s eaves-troughs for use in watering the garden, and washing the car, and other non-potable purposes. Only to find their governments taxing them on the size of their cisterns when the water meter revenues didn’t come in as planned because of their ‘conservation’ of piped water! If they can do that, you can rest assured that solar power won’t be ‘free’ for very long either, nor wind, nor other alternate energy sources.

Well first of all, the only way I can see any type of “tax” being imposed on solar or wind turbines is when you purchase them. And both of those can easily be made from parts sourced from other parts of the world off ebay or some other internet site. If you have an off grid system there is no way for the govt or municipality to monitor what you use.

That’s what people who have wells on their ‘own’ property from which they draw water might think, too. But already legislation is in the works that’s going to force them to have a water meter installed on their ‘own’ well, and pay the government a fee for the water drawn from it. And so it could well be with solar panels, which could easily be measured as to the amount of now ‘free’ sunshine they convert to electricity, and a charge made for its use. That could quite easily be done through the same process involved in property tax assessment.

This whole climate-change-caused-by-man scenario is far more about governments being able to relieve you from your money than it is to save the Earth from melting. They’re already running out of excuses why more taxation is necessary, (which it isn’t, if they did their books properly), at least reasonable ones that show further take is desirable. But if people can be duped that they’re “saving planet Earth” then the resistance to further taxation diminishes.

I wonder if any of the participants in this “Climate Walk” have read this article by Neil Reynolds:

“Please remain calm: The Earth will heal itself”

Not very likely, but they should! It’s pretty interesting! It contains a lot of info put forth by Stanford University physicist Professor Robert Laughlin who was the co-recipient of the 1998 Nobel Prize for physics.

“Brilliantly imagined, incisively expressed and vastly entertaining, Prof. Laughlin’s essay on climate change (What the Earth Knows) has been adapted from his forthcoming book on the future of fossil fuels. (His 2008 book, The Crime of Reason, documented pervasive government and corporate “sequestering” of scientific knowledge.)”

I especially like the final paragraph:

“The Earth regulates climate change in geologic time, Prof. Laughlin says, “without asking anyone’s permission or explaining itself.” If the Earth determines that Canada should freeze again, the best response would simply be to sell your Canadian real estate. The Earth moves on, Prof. Laughlin says. So should we.”

Here’s a link to the article mentioned above, from the Globe and Mail:

ht tp://www.theglobeandmail.com/globe-debate/please-remain-calm-the-earth-will-heal-itself/article1389062/

Funny thing is, the earth has been warmer and colder at various times, also much heavier in CO2 when there weren’t any people, or very few at least on earth to cause it. Science predicted years ago, that by now the sea levels would be way up, temperatures would be much higher than they are. We hear how much the Arctic ice is melting but what they won’t tell you is that at the other end of the earth, the Antarctic is building ice faster than ever before.
They have had to adjust their so called “climate models”, over and over again to reflect reality.

Its a natural cycle people! The oceans cannot heat up from the surface, the way they are heating up, other planets are heating up too. WE certainly didn’t cause that. The thing is, that people can’t think for themselves anymore and try to reason things out. They take what some scientists say as gospel truth, only to find out later that they were wrong or at least mistaken.
Take this one thing into consideration. Volcanoes put more pollutants and CO2 plus other gases into the atmosphere in a year, than people could in about a hundred years.
Figure it out.

@socredible

HAHA! I love your definition of capitalism…as defined as something that’s actually not capitalism. Maybe wanna look that up pal…

There is actually a case to be made between the slow response to climate change and our current capitalist system. But of course, I wouldn’t expect you to make the connection as you apparently have no idea what capitalism is…

Also, I love the comments regarding the marchers dependence on petroleum products. These climate marches around the globe are not anti-petroleum…they’re pro-transition and pro-change. I don’t think there’s any hypocrisy wanting to push for transition while still using petroleum products as that is by and large to only option available. After all, everyone there contributes to their communities and are understandably not wanting to be hermits. They can’t help but use petroleum products since they’re so ubiquitous in our society — marching for transition then becomes not hypocritical at all. TLDR: You’re not smart for suggesting these people are hypocrites.

phatdawg:- What are ‘tools’ if not ‘capital’? The economists of old are the ones who state that, are they not? “Land, Labor, and Capital” as being factors necessary for ‘production’ to take place. (To which a more important factor, “Knowledge”, should be added ~ for it’s not much use having ‘tools’ if one doesn’t know how to use them, or even land that can’t be productively used for the purpose intended). But lets not leave the economists as the only definers of ‘capital’. The accountants make use of the word too. ‘Capital’ Costs ~ ever hear of those? Plant and equipment ~ ‘tools’, in a larger sense, or a smaller one, that are “things to make things with”. But perhaps you want a more ‘financial’ definition of capitalism? Well, that’s easy, it’s a method of determining prices relative to costs. If you didn’t use that method, just how else could you accurately know that?

Further to the above, if you didn’t have a capitalist system, complete with the information derived from ‘profit’ and ‘loss’ in its financial aspect, how would producers know what to produce? Perhaps you’re as mis-guided as the young girl with the sign, and think some kind of a government bureaucracy should solely determine what should be produced, and how much each of us, as consumers, should be allowed to have of it? They tried that in Soviet Russia. It didn’t work very well. They made too many things people didn’t want, and too few that they did. And you needed all the apparatus of a dictatorship to keep people from bitching. And they still messed up their environment.

You’re a little too liberal/broad with your very much sophistic definition of capitalism.

Our current form of capitalism results in policies being made toward exponential growth — you cannot have infinite exponential growth in a finite system.

Tools, in the practical sense (and in whatever way you defined them), are necessary for any economic system to function. And I think it’s cute you painting a picture of what I endorse…because of course if I mention something bad about how we currently practice capitalism I must be a fan of communist Russia! And of government bureaucracy!

What the environmental movement aims for is a switch from profit first economic model to a more holistic one. One which takes other conditions and states of affairs into account.

And I do not believe companies dictating what ought to be produced is any better than your government bureaucracy. Much of the ‘demand’ in the marketplace is manufactured by profiteering corporations in our world. However, specifically, big oil is manufacturing our dependency on oil…stunting and sabotaging any alternative enterprises via lobbying and misinformation campaigns.

So, perhaps we’re missing each other semantically…however, taking into account how I define “capitalism” within the scope of socially reponsible system change, that sign is quite accurate.

Words of wisdom, however: I think you need to put down the theory kool-aid and start drinking some practicality juice.

These activists are wearing synthetic clothing, driving cars, and using asphalt roads that were all produced using fossil fuels.

But they are not hypocrites.

System change does not come from changes in individual behaviour. Some people drive electric cars, and others grow food on their own land. But many people can’t afford to do either. We live within an economic system where the real decisions are made by people with access to labour and capital. We are all living within a fossil fuel economy. Some of us have the hope and imagination to conceive of better alternatives. Wind power is already cheaper than coal.

There’s an interesting historic parallel to consider. Here I am quoting Rachel Flaherman:

“Would you have told Quaker abolitionists in 1850, “Abolition’s success as a moral response is limited – if not completely negated – so long as abolitionists continue to wear cotton clothing produced by slaves?” In 1840, almost all cotton in the US was harvested by slaves. Quaker abolitionists had no choice but to participate in the slavery-based textile market. And even if every abolitionist had personally sworn off cotton, it would hardly have bankrupted the gargantuan slavery enterprise (0). Instead, the abolitionists wisely sought a “broad and deep” (1) change: they wanted to change the way cotton was produced. They wanted cotton, but they wanted it harvested by paid labor. The analogy to fossil fuel divestment is direct: divestment activists want to use lights and cars that are powered by clean energy, not fossil fuels.” http://daily.swarthmore.edu/2014/11/24/op-ed-combatting-an-accusation-of-moral-hypocrisy/

Many people contract respiratory diseases or cancer as a result of exposure to air pollution created by burning fossil fuels. Rising sea levels are already threatening coastal populations and millions of people will be forced to move over the next few decades. These are two examples of how our use of fossil fuels is a major contributor to decreased life expectancy and quality of life.

You heat your home and drive your car just like the activists that you condemn. But unlike them, you have chosen to abdicate your political power. You are content to accept the status quo because climate change doesn’t affect you right now. And because this truth is uncomfortable, you try to attack and discredit anybody who reminds you of your own inaction. Thus you are complicit in the system.

So quit acting so sanctimonius.

I would like to see cleaner air. If we can accomplish that CO2 levels should go down as well. For those that feel strongly about climate change stop talking about it and show us how it’s done. Pool your resources and build windmills, buy a few solar panels while your at it.Sell your cars and use public transit. We’re all paying for it,somebody might as well use it. Walking down the street trying to educate others is as productive as posting it on Facebook.

Hey Ginters refute the information then, where’s your refute, Ginters you there, hello. You haven’t even read the links, how can you comment.

phatdawg, what do you think of big green. Did you know carbon trading is bigger than oil. Gore owns a carbon trading outfit and is making millions. Why do you think he makes Jimmy Swaggert type speeches and charges a hefty fee. Saving the world for a price. Suzuki running between his four houses. Now its winter he is maybe in his house in Australia.

Look around your house anything there not sourced from “big oil”

I am not defending “big oil” just get tired of the drama when the petroleum industry has given you your quality of life which billions only dream of.

Can you name me somewhere a system other than capitalism has been successful? Capitalism is the worst system, except for all the others.

hello UNBC how many are joining the carbon trail to Paris? Awfully quiet up there. Must be some going. If not sorry for bugging ya.

“The point is that those buying the panels in order to build a plant to generate and supply electricity can’t seem to make a profit doing so!”

They are just one plant.

Just think of all the automobile manufacturers that have gone belly up or have cut back and were taken over by others in some cases and restructured by new owners.

We still drive cars. We still buy cars. In fact, we still buy some of those cars that are now manufactured by new owners.

The same goes with virtually everything that is manufactured. You act as if the Spanish plant is the only one making solar panels. Making solar panels is not a license to print money. Neither is building cars, televisions, cell phones, etc.

Socredible.

In case you did not know it, farmers in other parts of the world are already charged for water they use. It is measured in acre feet. The reason is very simple, there is a finite source in many places and they need to restrict the use of water from aquifers that others need to access as well.

That is not the case with wind and solar. Farmers have used windpower for thousands of years. It is free fro the taking and no one is taking away a natural source of energy from others by putting up a windmill.

The same goes for solar panels or mass earth walls which capture the heat of the day and distribute it during the cold of the night.

You are simply not understanding the basic principles, and thus coming up with ridiculous notions.

Strange you do not mention that people can harness energy of the run of the river projects. They do not get taxed, but they can sell the power back to the government hydro utility. In fact, they can do the same with wind as well as solar energy they harness. If they make a net income from doing so, then that net income will be taxed.

“how would producers know what to produce?”

The same as always, one offers something for sale and if someone buys it, then make some more. If you think it will sell, but are not sure, you can also speculate that people will buy it.

If you make a mistake, then you go bankrupt. Businesses go bankrupt every day.

In fact, you might do alright with your business for several years, or even a century … then, over time, tastes change, lifestyles change, and the products or services are no longer desired. It is not that they are too expensive all the time because someone else provides the same for less, but because they are just not wanted.

Like horse drawn carriages …. ;-)

Scientists Discover Way to Harness Solar Power at Night

“Researchers from MIT and Harvard teamed up to develop new photoswitches that can harness the power of the Sun and release its energy day or night.

“Some molecules, known as photoswitches, can assume either of two different shapes, as if they had a hinge in the middle,” MIT researchers said in a press release. “Exposing them to sunlight causes them to absorb energy and jump from one configuration to the other, which is then stable for long periods of time.”

“And the best part is, while these molecules can efficiently produce “solar thermal fuel,” they don’t produce harmful greenhouse gases.

“It could change the game,” said co-author Jeffrey Grossman, an associate professor of materials science and engineering.”

natureworldnews.com/articles/6664/20140418/solar-power-may-work-after-dark-scientists-say.htm

————————————————————
Tech changes have always moved mankind beyond capacity not dreamt of before they happened and will likely continue to do so in the future.

It looks like a bunch of nice people using a sunny day off to get together and share there opinion. God forbid more people do the same…..we might end up with a community.

All these people probably wait 25 mins in the Tim Hortons drive through, idling away…

gopg2015

You lose all credibility when you think you can tax net income!

gopg2015:-“In case you did not know it, farmers in other parts of the world are already charged for water they use. It is measured in acre feet. The reason is very simple, there is a finite source in many places and they need to restrict the use of water from aquifers that others need to access as well.”
=========================================================================
Well, Heaven forbid that anyone should be charged for anything in some other part of the world that we’re not charged with here. I’m sure our governments will move in short order to correct this potential source of lost revenues. To preserve this precious commodity, water, of course. So our food prices, already on the rise, rise still further. But no worry, we can divert some of this new found tax revenue towards helping stock food banks to help feed those who can then no longer afford to feed themselves. We’ll have to ‘ration’ them, though. Can’t have anyone taking more than their ‘share’, can we? And we wonder why there’s poverty in the midst of plenty.

gopg2015:-” (SOCREDIBLE:-)“how would producers know what to produce?”

The same as always, one offers something for sale and if someone buys it, then make some more. If you think it will sell, but are not sure, you can also speculate that people will buy it.

If you make a mistake, then you go bankrupt. Businesses go bankrupt every day.
=======================================================================

Why don’t you just say, “Because it was profitable.”? Afraid of that little word ‘profit’? Businesses go bankrupt when there is none, do they not?

Al Gore’s 20 room (8 bathrooms) mansion in Nashville uses more electricity in one month than the average home uses in a year.

The following is an article from the Toronto Sun Oct 12 2013
There are two David Suzukis.

Most of us know one of the Suzukis. Let’s call him Saint Suzuki. That’s the Suzuki whose TV show on the CBC constantly lectures us about our lifestyle. He says we need to consume less, buy less and use less fossil fuels.

But then there’s another Suzuki. Let’s call him Secret Suzuki, because he’s far less well-known.

Secret Suzuki is the one who lives on Vancouver’s elite Point Grey Road, on a double lot, overlooking English Bay, right above the exclusive Kitsilano Yacht Club. The City of Vancouver assesses the land value alone at over $8 million. And that’s just one of Secret Suzuki’s properties.

He has another million-dollar home in Vancouver. And then there’s another home on Quadra Island. That’s three homes right there, if you count the double lot on Point Grey Road as just one property.

But then there’s his large property holdings on Nelson Island. What’s so fascinating about that one is that he co-owns the property with an oil company, Kootenay Oil Distributors Ltd. They don’t plan to drill for oil together. It’s a beautiful tourist spot — maybe perfect for a nice big condo development.

Of course, there’s nothing wrong with co-owning any property along with an oil company. But isn’t Saint Suzuki against fossil fuel companies — especially oil companies?

Saint Suzuki tells us that the world is desperately overcrowded, that we’re overpopulated, and that we’re going to run out of things.

But in his own life, Secret Suzuki has five children.

There’s nothing wrong with having five children. It’s a blessing. But then why does he think other people should have fewer kids?

Saint Suzuki rails against corporations and profits. He even gave a well-received anti-capitalist speech at the Occupy Vancouver protest.

But Secret Suzuki himself has several corporations. One of them, the David Suzuki Foundation, took in a whopping $9 million last year and has $12 million in assets. More than 10 million of that is invested in stocks and bonds.

Saint Suzuki despises lobbyists, and says they have a disproportionate control of political power in Ottawa. But Secret Suzuki himself has nine paid lobbyists registered in Ottawa’s lobbyist registry. Not one. Nine.

Saint Suzuki despises politicians, and says they can’t be trusted. Secret Suzuki starred in a Liberal party TV ad along with former Ontario premier Dalton McGuinty.

Saint Suzuki says corporations have to be less obsessed by profits, and do more for the public good. They need to especially think of the interests of the next generation, our children.

But Secret Suzuki has made a tidy profit off young people. His standard speaking fee at universities in Canada is $30,000 plus expenses. He billed Quebec’s John Abbott College a cool $41,000 to visit them.

Saint Suzuki speaks in the language of tolerance and equality and liberalism — utterly politically correct.

But Secret Suzuki engages in conduct that should cause feminists to raise an eyebrow. When he visited John Abbott College, his assistant called with special requests to go along with his speaking fee. Here is an internal e-mail from the college’s Mary Milburn: “We have learned, via Dr. Suzuki’s assistant, that although the Dr. does not like to have bodyguards per se, he does not mind having a couple of ladies (females) that would act as body guards.” The college’s Jim Anderson got involved in selecting the coeds, too: “Please be certain that the women are nicely dressed, we don’t want them in evening gowns, but definitely NOT Police Tech uniforms.” All of this bizarre selection of girls, dressed just so, was the result of Secret Suzuki’s special request. If he were a conservative, he’d be called a dirty old man. But he’s a saint. So the college went along with it.

David Suzuki is not a criminal. But he is not a saint. He’s a real man — a capitalist millionaire, a politician, a man with a staff of lobbyists, a prolific father, a wealthy landlord. If only he’d stop scolding the rest of us for aspiring to do the same.

All we are doing in this fight against “Climate Change” is making the world’s millionaires richer.

Gotta laugh, China will save the world with its solar panels…

Hey did you guys ever stop and think – if China stopped or even slowed its increase of co2 Canada would have to do absolutely nothing? For all of our co2 we can muster in Canada the country called China has increased their emissions by over 3 times what we emit as an entire nation in only the last few years. Not their entire emissions but just the increase in emissions. China just announced they will start to pay attention to co2 emissions by about 2030. By that time they will have increased by over 10 ties what we emit in co2 as an entire nation. Our contribution to the co2 crisis (if in fact there is one) is so minuscule compared to some countries it is laughable, like sending one 50 year old destroyer to a war zone, just what do you think you will accomplish? What you will accomplish is destroying any internal economy we have in favour of buying dollar store junk from a country that couldn’t give a rats behind

Burning of fossil fuels:

Today the air in Beijing is so polluted that factories are being ordered to shut down, traffic is being restricted and people can’t see the end of one city block for the thick dense air!

The pollution is 24 times (!!!) over the allowable maximum! The authorities are hoping that winds (usually blowing in our direction!) will disperse some of the thick smog! It will arrive here diluted, but still carrying fine particulates!

Both China and India are so polluted that people are dying 10 to 15 years earlier from heart and lung disease!

The only thing missing in this picture is the border collie and the farmer

Hart Guy:”Who cares if the Chinese take up the slack SUPPLYING the solar panel market? The point is that those buying the panels in order to build a plant to generate and supply electricity can’t seem to make a profit doing so!”

As long as they keep buying the panels from the producer why would the producer go belly up? The Chinese sell billions of dollars worth of the things and they make a profit!

I do not watch the Grey Cup or any other football game. It is a gladiator sport, too many players die from scrambled brains due to repeated concussions and far too many end up paralyzed in wheelchairs. Why? Because instead of trying to avoid crashing into each other they slam into each other with the greatest force they can muster. Kind of silly, isn’t it?

gopg2015

The Spanish plant is not the only one shut down, look up Solandra and all the subsidies that went into it. Google is after the US government for 500 million to back up its investment in solar. Musk of tesla has made his billions by collecting government subsidies.

If wind and solar are free how come the power from them is so expensive?

Run of the river plants, 65 billion in contracts to them and their power generation is more expensive than BC hydro generation.

#Energiewende

PG the pollution in Beijing is caused by old technology. Besides if it wasn’t for coal and oil there would be no wind generation, solar production factories. Alaloss would have no imaginary solar generation, oh wait.

The Chinese are building coal generation for themselves and building plants in other parts of the world.

It’s so amusing reading the blog talking points being repeated here as if they were true . The fossil fuel industry is built on scarcity , depletion and ever esquilating costs of production . Mean while the business model for solar , wind , wave and geothermal is and has been lowering costs of production . They have also been growing exponentially . The ICE cars have only met their targets for mileage and emittions by lying about them . The fossils are having their Kodak moments and so are the big utilities . The Stone Age didn’t end because we ran out of rocks . I can just imagine a Stone Age pretend seaman ranting ad nausium against those hypocrites using stone axes to fall timber to forge those sissy copper knives that have to be sharpened . And what about all those moths being killed by the fires .

I guess our CC deniers aren’t aware of PM Camron has been busy destroying some of Britons renewable energy sector . Alex Jones must just love the guy . I know the fossils do .

Seamutt:”PG the pollution in Beijing is caused by old technology.”

I rubbed my eyes in disbelief and then I rubbed them again! Yes! That is precisely what the discussion is all about: Replace old technology with as much as possible of the new green technology!

Green means more energy coming from renewable sources, less energy coming from burning fossil fuels = less CO2 and cleaner air! As a long term bonus global warming may even slow down and eventually reversed!

Great piece on ‘Saint Suzuki’. He was spotted by a reporter for a Campbell River paper once, putting the garbage from his home on Quadra Island in a downtown business’s dumpster. So he wouldn’t have to pay any tipping fees taking it to the CR landfill.

Saw him interviewed on a talk show once, and he extolled Tommy Douglas as one of his great hero’s. I wonder if he realised that same Tommy Douglas, at the end of World War Two, wanted every Canadian of Japanese origin deported to Japan, or, if they refused to go, castrated?

ataloss:-“The fossil fuel industry is built on scarcity , depletion and ever esquilating costs of production .”
=======================================================================

I think the word is ‘escalating’. But no matter, because the rest of what you’re saying is just as wrong. There is NO scarcity. In spite of all the depletion that has taken place, the world’s supply of oil ~ its ‘known’ supplies of oil ~ are absolutely enormous. And we haven’t even begun to look at ALL the areas where oil might still be found in commercial quantities. As for escalating costs of production, much oil is produced at lower costs of production than in times past. And there is evidence that rather than oil being composed of animal remnants from eons ago, it comes instead from geologic re-actions inside the Earth, and some thought to be worked out oilfields are actually being replenished.

Socred . So are you saying that the fossil fuel industry is not controlled by supply side marketing/management . Or price fixing like say just before the high mileage driving season ? Or there’s a shortage because the refineries are changing gears ? Really ? I get it now . It costs so much that it needs government hand outs to stay afloat because there is too much of it and it’s getting cheaper to find . Wow!

Socred:” the world’s supply of oil ~ its ‘known’ supplies of oil ~ are absolutely enormous.”

Too bad! Because there is so much of the stuff they are burning it instead of preserving as much of it as possible for the tens of thousands of other uses such as plastics. There is ultimately a finite amount on the planet! Does it make any sense to make it go up in smoke when it will be needed for the 10 or 15 billions of people who will inhabit this planet within the next three generations? Those enormous numbers of people are not going anywhere any time soon! How many light years away is the next habitable planet?

So Ataloss you missed the part that Cameron is taking away the exorbitant green subsidies. also you left out the part where their failed green has caused a drastic increase in costs resulting in very high disconnection rates as people cannot afford to pay. You also left out the part where businesses and manufacturing is shutting down and moving to areas of cheaper energy such as China. You have to quit reading CBC headlines.

Hasen’t been a statistically significant rise in temperature for 18 years 9 months now.