L E T   'E R   R I P !!!

Please people get out and vote on Saturday ! Those who don't vote, please don't complain again for the next three years about how the city is run. That is reserved for those of us who do really care.

Plus don't forget the school board trustees. They oversee a budget much larger than the city's, and impacts the youth of this city. Hopefully you want people in there who are doing things right. Bigger impact on civilization then any politician who wants to do something for downtown, like the last 20 years of downtown attention we have had.

I think anyone who is concerned about the wild spending habits of the City of Prince George recently should consider voting for Cameron Stolz for City Council in tomorrow's election.

The following is what his platform is with regards to "taxes",

"Under our current council, property taxes have risen out of control – having jumped 16.5% in the last three years alone! (4%, 5% and 7.5%) In business, if you spend more than you make you go broke. The current city council is spending more then it makes but it gets to reach into our pockets for more money - without any regard to how it affects pensioners or those who already have tight budgets.

In these uncertain economic times we need a new approach where City Hall must control its spending—and responsible spending is something I will bring to Council"

I got this quote from the following web site:

http://www.cameronstolz.ca/index_files/myplatform.htm

Cassidy Briggs is an 8yr old that desperately needs a liver transplant. Her story was featured on Global TV news Nov 13. Trust fund has been set up with the Bank of Montreal as our medical system has denied coverage for the procedure.

Maybe give up your Timmy's run today and instead donate to her cause.

As for the council: Out with the old - in with the new!

Extravagant spending is disrespectful to taxpayers and especially irresponsible in today's fiscal meltdown environment!

We have a problem once citizens feel more and more like victims of council's policies, not to mention the mayor's.

Shelf the pie-in-the-sky mentality and elect some people with common sense!

It's time for a reality check.

IMHO.

.

I think people should only vote for a few candidates whom you really know the position of those candidates... or don't vote for any at all. We need informed votes, and we need only those candidates endorsed with a vote, who truly deserve to be endorsed.

I will likely only cast four-five votes for city council. I could not recommend the others for a job, so why would I give them my vote. I also will not be voting on the school district candidates... because I don't have an interest in it, so it makes little sense to pick a name that sounds good with out knowing the full impact of that decision? If a politician can vote present, then why can't the voter when it comes to endorsing something one doesn't know the outcome of? If a person only votes for one name at least they voted and exercised their rights.

I think it would be good if Dan Rogers was the next mayor of PG, so I will be voting for that.

.

Why is Cassidy Briggs' liver transplant not covered by Medicare? Is there a donor liver? If so, simply stated WTF!! A life saving transplant is not covered, but for the rotund a stomach staple is. I better Google and find out more.

We shall see who wins. My money is on the most famous, not the most suitable.

When voting ask yourself this question..does the canidate I'm voting for need the money? by this I mean don't vote for someone that is in it for the $20k a year, vote for succesfull people that are doing it because they want to do what's right.
For what it's worth Zurowski is the only choice for mayor, IMHO Rogers is NOT a leader.Good luck to all candidates

Lunarguy - that is a great philosophy (if you don't vote, you can't complain) however it is fatally flawed! A persons vote CANNOT change the outcome of the election when all the politicians are the same. Sure you can boot one fool out and call up another, but in the end there is no change.

I too believe that Cameron Stolz would be a good addition to city councillor. If I was allowed to vote (rural resident am I) then he and Donnie Z. would be getting my vote. Don is not necessarily my favourite guy for Mayor, but only he and Rogers have a snowballs' chance, so the job should go to the guy with more business experience. Think about it for a moment: Don ZUroski is a self made millionaire, (does not need the job for the money and expense account)he started as a pump jockey working for Keith's Shell station on 15th ave, bought Keith out a few years later and proceeded to build the Automagic mini empire, before wisely selling out and making a bundle. He has business smarts, knows lots of people in business, and is very current, he knows the issues.
metalman.

Then again, my personal experience of Dan is that he is available, interested in individual citizens and keeps his promises.
We have had too many tax increases during the past three years. The backbone of the community are the retired paople who have paid taxes for many years and they need to be respected.
So, it is a double-edged sword, look after the people who have contributed to the community for years and also be bright and progressive and interested in all facets of the community.
Dan fits the bill for me.

By voting for Don or Dan for mayor, we are asking for the samething that has been happening! Do you want more tax increase? do you want fiscal mismanagment? I know i don't ant that leaves 2 people. I am going to vote for the person that I see is down to earth, not going to ruin the downtown, or Prince George for that matter, any more than current council/mayor have! And if you have been to the debates, you should recognize this. "dredge the river, F*** the fish"
That says it all....Feterly will be my vote!

I find it funny when some people on this forum b**ch and complain about mayor and council, and then are willing to cast a vote for Zurowski! Are you guys nuts? If he gets in, your in for more of the same fiscal mismanagement your so against. Dan's the man with my vote!

Well I wasn't available for the last free for all, but I am for today's.
I will respond to some ridiculous posts I have read from last week.
That doesn't include yours Heidi.

Heidi1555 wrote..."I'm one of those scared s!@$less ones (I think it was lostfaith who used those words in previous post?)."

Acrider54 wrote that Heidi.
I do agree with what Acrider wrote though.

Posted by: acrider54 on November 6 2008 4:14 PM
"Ah yes, the first snowfall of the season, as usual there are the few that are not prepared. Running around with the all season tires with a death grip on the wheel and using nothing but tunnel vision, driving 30km p/h in a 100 zone. Then you wonder why drivers are in the ditch. If you're not ready and scared s#$@less, do everyone a favour and stay home!"
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Posted by: red2b on November 7 2008 7:38 AM
"I find it laughable that some people blame YRB or the city for the icey roads less than 2 hrs. after the first snowfall of the year starts. Maybe there should be sanding trucks on standby at Peden Hill from Nov. 1st so that the road can be sanded at the first snow flake. Maybe the city should have trucks (lots of trucks) so that the main streets can all be sanded within 1 hr of the first snow flake.
If this was the case then those same people would crab about the cost or "why did they do that street before my street". Some people just cannot be pleased. It is like they have 'lostfaith'."

Some people just do not understand basic logic and I didn't expect you to understand either Red2b.

You say..."Some people just cannot be pleased. It is like they have 'lostfaith'"

On the contrary I am easily pleased. Usually people being at the ready and doing their jobs when they need to be pleases me. Especially when I'm paying for them to do so.

How about you red2b what pleases you lazy ass attempts at the jobs people get paid for?

Just for the record, the blame for this BS doesn't fall on the laps of the regular employees of YRB, it falls on managements lap.

I don't recall seeing anywhere that anyone was "blaming" YRB or the city for the "icy roads".
Usually mother nature is to "blame" for that.
People are blaming YRB for not/never being ready for this, every winter.

Nobody thinks YRB should be on standby at Peden hill starting on Nov 1.

What part of them being there taking care of one of the worst spots in town when they need to be eludes you? It's not rocket science.

If they were there we wouldn't be having this discussion, plain and simple.

Not much use plowing and sanding any other part of Hwy 16 west beyond Peden hill if no one can get past that spot, is there.

Thats all anyone is asking...be there when you SHOULD be, Not after you should have been, as is always the case for YRB and Peden hill.
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Posted by: vocer on November 7 2008 8:20 AM
"hey reb2 "that was beautiful"

Get a room you two.
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Posted by: He speaks on November 7 2008 8:43 AM
"There is a fine balance between economy and keeping the roads safe. However known trouble area such as Peden hill should always be ready to be sanded. If it takes a hour to accumulate the first inch of snow. The sand trucks should be able to mobilize with in 1/2 hr anyway. Its relatively easy. sand it up the hill, turn around at Domano area and sand it down the hill. Do it every half hour."

Most people can't grasp that concept He speaks.
It's like they are the ones that dispatch the trucks.
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Posted by: loggor on November 7 2008 9:51 AM
"Re:reb2's comment-As a driver on Hwy16 west the snow fell early and small town Fraser Lake and Vanderhoof had sand trucks on the road almost immediately. I'm on my way home and won't you know it the hi-way is bare ip to Bednesti then there is that magical snow all the way to Prince George. I don't know why the small towns are prepared but the hiway between P.G. and Bednesti was the worst. All these roads are serviced by YRB maybe it's the management in P.G."

Absolutely bang on Loggor. YRB Vanderhoof and YRB PG are in fact two different companies.
People travelling west will note that fact about 1 km west of Bednesti during winter road conditions, if you make it that far from here.
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Posted by: lifeisgood44 on November 7 2008 11:34 AM
"re-reb2,s i have been driving between prince george and fraserlake professinaly for almost2 years i find that the road conditions between prince george and bednessti are apauling in the winter just look at the number of deaths that have occured in this strech of hwy.two nights ago i was returning to prince george from fraserlake aprrox.1:30am low and behold there is a yrb sand truck park on the side of the road suprise!!!!!! that night the roads were bare and dry.then the snow comes and were were they know where to be found strange.and the vanderhoof side 4 sand trucks working on the roads.i had spun out on the mudd river hill phone yrb to ask if they could put some sand down they told me to put chains on which i did then after i made it off the hill two more trucks spun outstill no sand. so not a fan off YRB PRINCE GEORGE i do not think it is the workers i belive the problem lies in managment.also the commment about cost what about when TRB was on strike and the company still got paid for there services and did nothing gee i wonder where all that money went.so next time it snows think about the deaths that may have been spared if they used a little sand."

lifeisgood44, you are another in the know, good post.
P.S. Brown ones outpull the blue ones.
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Posted by: Bridge on November 7 2008 5:22 PM
"What a fine collection of opinions today folks! Makes for some good reading.

We have a civic election coming up and here you are back on the rant about bad drivers. Well heres my slant on some of the good reading;

I’m going north on Ospika in the outside lane the other day when I catch up to this rig it’s a sleigh that some guy has put wheels under as there is no snow yet. He is wearing a red coat with this peaked hat that has a tassel on the end. And you wont believe this but its being pulled by eight tiny reign deers. He’s on the Cell phone making a left turn at Ospika and 15th. He’s on the center line using both turn slots. People are flashing their lights and blowing their horns.

He cut off the guy behind him making a right turn into Timmy’s. The guy is blowing his horn and shaking his fist but the old guy just keeps on trucking. He’s at the order board still on his phone. The person at the desk doesn’t know if they are being talked to or what’s happening. When he gets to the takeout window the old girl almost hawks up her faults teeth. She hands him his donut and coffee that was finally ordered. He gives her twenty bucks and says keep the change. He mutters something about these Prince George drivers are the mos t stupid in the world all they ever do is whine about my driving habits.

He tweaks his nose and he’s off towards the horse in the sky. He is last seen in the Casino Hotel parking lot with a fist full of money heading for the entrance.

Cheers"

Great story Bridge but how many times are you going to post that same story here?
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Thats all for now, BBL8tr

Cornflakes and piss. YUK!!

May I suggest you ask your mommy for something different for breakfast.

Cornflakes and piss. YUK!!

Whatever happened to the talk of expanding the fibre optic system downtown, for more high speed internet access, or the heated sidewalks [OMG]?? Large areas of our city don't even have the option of broadband unless your willing to pay large monthly fees for wireless.

Whatever happened to our candidates concerns over the consistently higher rates we pay for fuel in our city?? How is it possible that once you cross over to the BCR site that diesel is $0.10 per litre cheaper?? IMO if they can sell gasoline for 0.88 a litre in Ottawa they can sell it for that here...which candidate or political party is speaking out on these issues? Surely not the ones collecting the gasoline taxes to pay for the 2010 party?

Air quality? WHy are they still burning slash piles..?? Twice this month I have witnessed the burning of slash piles east of PG during periods of high winds...guess the plan is to create some jobs fire fighting?? Apparently there are a lot of displaced forestry workers that could use the work, just wish they would let us know so we wouldn't get so alarmed when we see flames shooting hundreds of feet into the air at night.

Hey Tiny,
The Stroll For Liver has been in Prince George for two years now. Usually runs the end of May or beginning of June. The first year had a tiny turn out, second year was better and had Shirley Bond come out and speak. The funds raised goes to help people like that poor little sweetie pie Cassidy.
I was approached over Myspace by Amanda Molsen (organizer of Stroll For Liver who lives in Vancouver and has had a liver transplant) to try and raise funds for the Stroll in Prince George. I've done it two years in a row and wouldn't have been able do as well as I did if it wasn't for Roger Kollner's (Remax) pledges each year! A little plug for Roger there as he deserves it, nice guy! :)
This years Stroll For Liver should be bigger as more and more people are aware of its presence in our city now. Hope to see more people out this year!
A man my daughter and I had met at the Stroll recently passed away from his long battle with liver disease.
It's easy to get a team together and collect pledges.
www.liver.ca

I would like to urge everyone to get out there and vote on Saturday!!
Even if you have never voted before,or think it is a waste of time, do it anyway.
After you go to the little booth and mark your ballot,there is a great feeling of satisfaction for doing so, and knowing you have done your civic duty!
We can all make a difference,especially when we vote!
It is probably the most selfless thing you will ever do!
Vote,because politicians actually play the odds on how many will turn out to cast a ballot.
Those of them with borderline popularity issues do better at the polls when only a few vote.
It works in their favour,now get out there and make a difference!!
VOTE!

Lostfaith, I'm going to post the santa story whenever the posters start to whine about other drivers. But then there are those that will never learn.

So when you vote tomorrow remember not to vote for those that gave us the 4%. Those are Zurowski, Basserman, Krause and Graten.

As has been pointed out if Zurowski gets in then we will have more of the smae old stuff. Cameron Stoltz sounds good but remember if Zurowski makes it these people are in business and the economy will be their big push. We want a council that will become engaged with the taxpayer and not the economy.

There are a number of good candidates runing and dont forget that some have their own agenda. The downtown is a big issue but it is not an issue that a single councilor should be involved with. It is the responsability of the entire council.

Cheers

The Citizen Newspaper published their own wish list for city council this morning!

My personal opinion is that they have taken inequitable advantage of their strong community voice and may unfairly influence the decisions of numerous voters.

They should stick to reporting news instead of creating it...but their legal department got around that one by printing it as an editorial...and then drew high attention to their 'opinion' by stating their disclaimer as headline news!

Shame on you, Citizen!

I bet Zurowski is pissed after all the advertising dollars he sent The Citizen over the past few weeks.

Roger still gets my vote but never the less, what the Citizen did was 'just wrong'!

Taken from the Citizen this morning....

WHAT ARE YOUR VIEWS ON HOUSING FOR THE HOMELESS?

EUGENE FETTERLY: " Sucks to be them, if you think that's bad, you should try being an exploited home owner and taxpayer, that's worse"

Enough said. Finally, someone that gets it. I'm sick of worrying about other people all the time when the honest "Joe taxpayer" citizen takes it in the rear over and over again. Times are getting pretty tough with more and more people losing jobs and finding it harder to make ends meet and put food on the table for their families. Why not focus on that? Or pretty soon, we're all gonna be homeless.

Fetterly for Mayor. Just my opinion in the 250.

Cameron Stolz said - "In business, if you spend more than you make you go broke."

But it is amazing how many business people keep doing that anyway and how many go broke and try again, and go broke, and try again.

They are just like the general population. Balance is the impotant virtue.

Well I had help from the Citizen Newspaper deciding who to vote for, anybody that they didn't recommend.

I encourage everyone to get out there and vote, but please be informed. Know who you are voting for and why. So many people go in there, see a name they recognize from all of those cheesy signs out there and mark an X based on recognition only. If you don't have a clue who you are voting for and what they stand for, then in my opinion, please don't bother.

On my way into work this morning, the intersection was full of people hollding signs for various incumbments. It reminded me of the clown selling flowers, or the $5 pizza signage. My mind is already made up and seeing those signs out there, distracting me from my driving, is not going to change my mind. What is disturbing though, is that those who have not paid any attention to the facts will be affected by this and unfortunatley, the result will be votes based on ignorance.

To all you Dan fan's, good luck you say you want change eh, well get ready for lots of commitees and meetings and overall time waisting. This is just my opinion but honestly I really believe he is not a person capable of of anything but saying lots and delivering nothing.

I agree cobrasnake..Dan Rogers is a master of recapulation.

Sorry ..should be recapitulation

Anybody see the Citizen today... Top of the front page...Endorsing Dan Rogers and and a slate of councillors. IMO this is very inappropriate. News media should report the news not try to control it. There are probably lots of Citizen advertisers in town a little choked at this attempt to sway the results.

OMFG - It's snowing again!
I sure hope the disaster relief organizations are better prepared tis time.

"F**K the Fish" - The River
"Sucks to be them" - The Homeless

Now, maybe he won't win, but he will stir the pot!!! He calls a spade a spade and for that, he has my vote.

I like Dans style. In the past we have not been consulted on important issues. Its time someone took a moment to do some meaningfull studies and consulted with the taxpayer. After all we dont need to have all our problems solved in a day or two. The Horizon airline affair is a result of to much haste and not enough consultation

Go Dan go.

Above all its a great change to see that the people on this site are giving some thought to the community and the up coming election. We only have an election every three years but we can have our liver checked any day of the week.

Cheers

Re: Dan Rogers
I was going to vote just to vote against Rogers but then I thought;
a) he will just keep trying aqain & again until people get worn down & elect him
b) PG is like a pos winter beater car- if it gets trashed who really cares, it was a cheap piece of junk to begin with
c) if thats what people want, then let's just get it over with - it's only a few years.

(I putting on my trusty flame-proof suit)

Thanks for the info Heidi :) Just ripped my heart out seeing that on the news last night. With all the provincial handouts to pet projects and this young lady can't get a necessary procedure done...sickens me actually.
FYI I am not fund raising for the family, just passing the info along. The family also has a support group for Cassidy on facebook as well - but all that info can be found on the Global BC website.

As for the civic election tomorrow imo new blood on council would be a welcome change. But I always advise my friends to vote for the person they think will be most responsive to them should they need to get in touch with City Hall.

As for the mayoral candidates:

Don - seemed quick to grab the chatter of the city for his campaign;

Dan - seemed to be vague with no specifics

Eugene - no nonsense but lacks sensitivity

Dane - young, inexperienced yet showed intelligence, diplomacy and real sense of community spirit (which I think we need more of)

Just my observational opinion, but I honestly think Dane Greenwell is our best choice because he is neutral and more concerned with citizens and will be lead us. Councilors will be able to make effective decisions because they would have an unbiased leader at the helm.

My best wishes to all candidates. Will be an interesting Sat night :D

*will be able to* lead us.

grr...lol sorry about that :0P

$500,000 for a liver transplant. We have inflated housing prices and something is happening to cure that. Time to cure inflated medical prices.

Hey death to socialism, to compare PG to a pos beater car is a joke and a perfect reflection of you. You call it a cheap piece of junk, I call it a diamond in the rough and a very well kept secret. If you don't like PG, it's quite simple leave, go to Vancouver and sit in traffic for hours then go home to your $3000 a month mortgage payment in your ESL neighnourhood, oh yah dont forget to take your umbrella

As to the 2008 council and mayoral election: The common thread I am seeing is do not vote for the old guard, bring in some fresh meat.
Followed by the suggestion to vote for Dan or Don, and even Eugene.
These are the old guard mixed with the incapable.
I say vote for Mister Dane Greenwell.
I have not listened intently to what the candidates are saying, but from the news it seems they are all rehashing the same old same old. Funny thing, they all know the problems, none seems to have ANY solutions.
By voting for this young man that is fresh to politics would definitely get around being part of the old guard.
He would have no choice but to listen and to seek good advice and guidance from his mayoral cabinet.
Give the boy a chance, I am sure he will step up to prove himself not just capable, but also most worthy.

Eugene calls a spade a spade and would get my vote just as a protest of the status quo. Unfortunately it will probably be a very close race so Dan will get the tick on the ballot if for no other reason than he has stated the citizen of PG will get a vote on the PAC. I don't seeing Don making this pledge. It is time for new blood in the mayor's chair and not recycle someone from the existing council.

As for the incumbent council members none will will get the tick after the disappointing performance of the past 3 years.

To bad Eugene did not run for council. I am sure he would have been elected. What Eugene says and writes is what most citizens think but are afraid to say out loud as it may offend. While other candidates sit on the fence Eugene stands on one side of the fence or the other.

Cobra, you forgot to compare me to Hitler. Sorry for having an opinion.

BTW, where did I mention Vancouver?

It will be interesting to see if the rest of PG thinks the same way as the posters here on bitteroldgeezer.com

(feeds out more line)

Wow Gus that is crazy!!! Cure inflated medical prices for sure. Here's wishing we all stay healthy.

How are the roads out there this afternoon guys? Hart Hwy and intersections?

Do good may sound good but vote for what is 'Best for All' not just yourself. The science fiction writer, Robert Heinlein called this issue "Bread and Circuses" - a reference to Roman Emperors providing food and entertainment to distract the masses. In "To Sail beyond the Sunset" the character Lazarus Long discusses this problem:

"A perfect democracy, a 'warm body' democracy in which every adult may vote and all votes count equally has no internal feedback for self correction. It depends solely on the wisdom and self-restraint of citizens...which is opposed by the folly and lack of self-restraint of other citizens. What is supposed to happen in a democracy is that each sovereign citizen will always vote in the public interest for the safety and welfare of all. But what does happen is that he votes his own self-interest as he sees it...which for the majority translates as 'Bread and Circuses'

"Bread and Circuses is the cancer of democracy, the fatal disease for which there is no cure. Democracy often works beautifully at first. But once a state extends the franchise to every warm body, be he producer or parasite, that day marks the beginning of the end of the state. For when the plebs discover that they can vote themselves bread and circuses without limit and that the productive members of the body politic cannot stop them, they will do so, until the state bleeds to death or in its weakened condition the state succumbs to an invader--the barbarians enter Rome."

For the last 30 Years that I know of the Hwy. changes for the better at Bednesti going west.

Heidi - the cost is the one quoted in the Vanvouver paper as being the family would have to pay if they had to go to the USA.

Here are some Canadian costs.
http://www.cmaj.ca/news/04_12_02.shtml

***WARNING*** driving complaint below!!

I just wish people would actually turn on their lights!! yes we know you have daytime running lights, but...........what freakin good does that do for the people behind you?? nothing that's what!! especially when you are too freakin lazy to brush the little bit of snow off your car!! and WINDOWS!! especially lighter colored vehicles!! and you can't see them!!

**RANT OVER**

What is best for all is not agreed to by all. "Therein lies the rub" as some author from old time England used to say.

Shame on you Anastasia for expecting common sense to rule the day.

An article in a local newspaper on Nov. 12, 2008, quoted Eugene Fetterly as saying the following:

Why do you want to be mayor?
Eugene Fetterly: "I want to be mayor because it seems to me that none of the mayors in the past have had the guts to go to city hall's administration and say 'look, you guys start doing your job, you're being too complacent."

What are the top five issues facing the city?
Eugene Fetterly: Pay down the city's debt, make administration more accountable, "separating the needs from the wants," cleaning up the air, and "pulling people out of the trough."
Asked to elaborate, Fetterly said council members shouldn't get additional pay for sitting on such bodies as the regional district.

How would you address these challenges in your first 90 days in office?
Eugene Fetterly: Right away Fetterly would require department heads at city hall to come before council explain why they are good for the city and earning their money.
"We should fire the dead wood," he said adding he would freeze city wages for three years.

How would you do these things and still be fiscally responsible?
Eugene Fetterly: Fetterly said more of the city's work should be contracted out to the private sector.

Another local newspaper article (Nov.8, 2008) quoted Eugene Fetterly as saying the following:

"Obviously no one down there at city hall has taken time out to look at what's happening with the world economy."

Tomorrow I will be voting for Eugene Fetterly for the position of Mayor of Prince George.

"How would you do these things and still be fiscally responsible?
Eugene Fetterly: Fetterly said more of the city's work should be contracted out to the private sector."

Ya ok that will be great. Do you think it will be cheaper/better than what the city can do it for?
Look at what other privatization schemes have given us, hwy's contractors, ICBC, CNR.

Looks pretty nasty out there. I have been hearing the sirens regulalry this afternoon. Be careful out there everyone. I didn't see any sand trucks parked at the bottom of peden hill this morning waiting for the anticipated snowfall :-)

Yes I agree the citizens move is questionable however they are being straight up and I respect that. The media always takes particular candidates side but just in less in your face ways, I like in your face. Also what the hell this is a free society and they to should have the right to free speach. It also helps that I like their list for the most part minus 2 council candidates.

I call BS on the comment that Dan can't get things done and he has a lack of business experience. He just doesn't walk all over people along the way. The comment about Don and his self made million does not mean he will be a sucess as mayor. Does it not say more when a non millionair like Dan puts his ass on the line because he wants to make our community more prosperous.

If Don gets in you will see a stand alone biomass burner at the foot of 1st ave just off hwy16 bridge on the table within 6 months. If you don't believe me ask him. He beat around the question at the civic center debate when he responded "I do not support a biomass project in the immeadiate core of the downtown business district" Even the origional site was theoretically outside that description. The question was "do you support a community energy system in the bowl" Like I said before I like it straight up, that statement is not it's full of convienient holes. There are better options for our communities health and pocket book. See the responses on www.maccpg.org

Have any of you who talk about how Dan is so bad actually sat down and had a conversation with him. I have with Don and Dan. Don is still talking to much of the same old and he doesn't mean what he says as the above example. Dan's term off from council has given him a great new perspective and I believe him when he speaks. Maybe in 3 years Don will be a little more balanced after being off council to. I personally am a fan of a 3 consecutive term limit. IMHO Anyone on council currently with 3+ terms should go at least this time around.

Have a good snowy friday and drive safe it's crazy out there.

Open netpen salmon farms.
It won't be long and they will be gone.
The battle against these environmentally destructive salmon farming companies is gaining more and more backing.


International Declaration Against Unsustainable
Salmon Farming
We are global environmentalists, First Nations, scientists, tourism business owners and
operators, and fishermen/women fighting to save our coasts. We have inspected salmon
farms, and held summits in Chile, Canada and Norway. We conclude that the science is
conclusive: open-net cage salmon farming is severely impacting the world’s oceans.
Specifically salmon farming is:
1. Ecologically devastating (e.g.: destabilizing ecosystems by killing wild salmon across the
northern hemisphere, discharging invasive species. Depriving wildlife such as bears, eagles,
whales as well as human communities of a primary food source, causing massive viral and
sea lice epidemics, and genetic pollution)
2. Socially destructive: (e.g.: leading to worker death and labor law infractions in Chile,
threatening valuable local economies, degrading traditional food resources and ignoring the
rights of Canadian First Nations, Chilean artisanal fishermen, and Norwegian and Sami
fisherman)
3. Threatening local food security with drug, feed and feces discharge: (e.g.: chemical net
antifoulants, unapproved louse chemotherapeutics, antibiotics, flesh colorants, tons of
nitrogen and phosphorous associated with toxic algae blooms)
4. Threatening the global food supply by fishing the North Atlantic and South Pacific to
produce aquaculture feed resulting in a net loss of fish supply available to feed people,
affecting also the marine food web.
We found that the salmon farm corporations, largely Norwegian owned, are denying impact
and distracting the public from hearing the truth in all our countries. We found that
governments are complicit with the fish farming industry delaying protection of ocean
resources and also withholding the truth from the public that salmon farms kill wild salmon
and harm other indigenous species.
The United Nations Code of Conduct for Responsible Fisheries adopted in 1995 states “As
a primary goal, aquaculture development should conserve genetic diversity and minimize
negative effects of farmed fish on wild fish populations, while increasing supplies of fish
for human consumption.” We declare each of these principles violated by today’s global
marine salmon farming industry.
Ocean ecosystems are essential to life on earth. As such we are resolved to protect our
oceans from salmon farming. We are calling for a global moratorium on raising salmon in
net pens and an immediate halt to the destruction of public ocean resources by this
industry. We invite others to learn more and sign at www.ourglobalocean.org
It is our intention to prevent this industry from continuing to devastate our Oceans.

Signed this day November 2, 2008
Chief Bob Chamberlin Kwicksutaineuk/Ah-kwa-mish, Canadian First Nation.
Kurt Willy Oddekalv, Green Warriors, Norway
Wolfram Heise Proyecto Pumalin, Chile
Alfredo Quarto, Mangrove Action Project, U.S.A.
Alexandra Morton, Adopt-a-fry.org, Canada
Darren Blaney, Homalco Canadian First Nation
Captain Paul Watson, President, Sea Shepherd Conservation Society, USA
Anne Mosness, Go Wild Campaign, USA
Craig Orr, Stan Proboszcz, Watershed Watch, Canada
Terry Anderson, Wild Salmon Alliance, Canada
Darlene Schanfald, Olympic Environmental Council, USA
Ocean Aura Design Inc., Canada
Don Staniford, USA
Brian Gunn, President, Wilderness Tourism Association, Canada
Bruce Sandison, Scottish Sporting Services, Scotland
Ronald Pfeil Mann, Isla Magdalena Nacional Park, Chile
Steve Strand, Retired University of California Los Angeles, Marine Biology, Canada
Myrna Boulding, President, Strathcona Park Lodge and Outdoor Education Centre.
Steve Lawson, First Nations Environmental Network, Canada
Bartlett Naylor, Capital Strategies, USA
Doug Tompkins USA Juan Carlos Cardenas, Centro Ecoceanos, Chile



JUST SAY NO TO FARMED SALMON

Be careful out there! No matter how good a driver you are, or how prepared with snow tires and good wipers and 4 x 4, there's some idiot out there without snow tires, no weight in the back of the pickup, and going too fast! I've already seen 6 upside down and in the ditch today.

And YRB WAS out on Peden Hill BEFORE the snow started - they sprayed that de-icer on both sides of the highway before the snow started. and they were sanding at 7:30 already in anticipation of the snow, which started around 10am.

Do go vote tomorrow - and think about who you're voting for. Change is good, but if all the incumbents are gone, and there's a new mayor, the learning curve will be awfully steep, and the continuity and history will be gone.

Leave a couple of the best ones, (like Munoz and Krause), and pick half a dozen of the most promising new candidates (I'm going with Frizell, Green, Wilbur, Arcand, Stolz).

Some of the old timers (Gratton, Basserman, Moose) need to be gone... too complacent, no new ideas. If they knew all the solutions, like they say they do now, then why didn't they bring them forward 3, 6, 9, 12 or 15 years ago?

Proof is in the pudding folks! I'm sure we'll be saying the same thing about some of the newcomers next time :(

"JUST SAY NO TO FARMED SALMON"

I do say no every time I go shopping. Wouldn't touch the stuff with a ten foot pole!

If enough shoppers boycott it they might stop farming it.

Educate me.

What has Munoz done that deserves my vote tomorrow. She was off my list ... but I have seen more than a few positive comments of late. I ask this sincerely. Anyone?

Early in September a letter appeared in the Free Press by Fetterly, "Signatures Needed by Eugene Fetterly". He had this rant about Dan Rogers and was looking for signatures to run for the mayors office. I will not repeat the words he used in closing his letter. Would imagine that many of you saw the words he used and it turned me off on Eugene Fetterly as candidate for the mayors chair.

After all we no longer live in the wild west and shoot from the hip. We have to put our brain into gear and use some diplomacy with the a reponce to others.

I dont really think the Fetterly is serious about the election I think he is just having a hoot. So vote for him if you like but it will be a wasted vote.

Re; Munoz
After watching several of the debates, council sessions & listening to her on Meisner and Shaw etc.....Munoz always seems to be the one who's done her homework and is the most knowledgable and prepared. She has demonstrated her willingness to work hard...to learn as much as she can about the issues....and THEN make well informed decisions - unlike many of the old guard who seem complacent. She's more of a do-er than a talker...and that's what we need. She's a keeper in my opinion.

By the way... although I agree with many (not all)of the Citizen's "choices" for Mayor & Council - I too think it is unfair of them to have endorsed any of the candidates DIRECTLY. Use your paper to "educate people" as to the differences between candidates & their positions!!! Influencing people in that way is fair....swaying the vote the day before the election is NOT! Especially when all these candidates spent so much money with your paper. You may find a way to justify it and call it ethical....but fair??? No...it was not.

I agree on the farmed salmon diplomat and lostfaith!
No reason to eat it other than people cannot afford the real stuff most times!
I understand that, but it is still no excuse!
Tasteless crap that swims and lives in it's own dirt!
No thanks,and I too hope to see these farms gone one day soon!
Unfortunately they have an overseas market that is apparently pretty strong so only time with tell.
I also notice it is actually showing up in cans, but so far I have only seen it in the U.S.and I don't recall the brand.
I have a list of issues that I will be using when I vote in the provincial election next May and this is one of the things that will help decide who I vote for.
I will NOT support a politician who supports open net fish farms.

Posted by: diplomat on November 14 2008 2:21 PM
"JUST SAY NO TO FARMED SALMON"

"I do say no every time I go shopping. Wouldn't touch the stuff with a ten foot pole!

If enough shoppers boycott it they might stop farming it."

Boycotting is great and will help.
One of the biggest problems with boycotting is the fact that these destructive salmon farm operations on our BC coast export 90% of there toxic fish to the US market.

In other words we have foriegn companies destroying our BC environment to feed other foriegners.

She is aproachable. She put a motion forward in coucil to scratch the propossed location for the energy system by the school because of those concerned in the community.

Agree we can't scape them all I'm voting for Debora and Brian. I have not really had a chance to talk to Krause. I know he definately supports the less fortunate.

Agree on farmed Salmon I don't buy it.

I'll be voting for Rogers for mayor. I think he has the ability to do the job well and I believe he is the best candidate. I don't like Zuroski's seemingly intentional platform of pleasing everyone. I want a mayor to take a stand and lead, not sit around hoping that they don't upset one group or another. I think he would be a better councillor that the man in charge.

I'm still not sure how many votes I'll be casting for councillors, however, I do plan on ensuring that new candidates receive my vote. I will likely also vote for Krause even though I don't agree with everything that he stands for. One man can't do anything on his own, but his positions do provide some needed balance to a group like city council. I'll be doing some additional research tonight before heading to the poll tomorrow.

Don or Dan? I don't know. I said that Don would not get my vote if I could vote in municipal elections, and I have always agreed that we need new people on council, but Dan or Don will become mayor, both are veterans of PG politics, so take your pick.
Fetterly? Says what the common man is thinking maybe, those who know him might not agree that he would be the right guy to head the council, but he will never win the vote anyway, so a vote for Eugene is a wasted vote, sorry. Same goes for Dane, I think it would be great if he became mayor, that would shake things up, but he does not have experience.
Let me close by asking a tough question; If Cassidy Briggs was the daughter of a politician, doctor, judge, celebrity, or was related to same, do you think that she would get the transplant and pronto?
(of course she would)
metalman.
Farmed salmon? Bad news, bears. It ain't natural, they should ban all of the fish farms, and manage the fisheries properly. Oh shoot, it's too late, we already screwed up all the fisheries. Cut up all the fishing boats and factory processors and go back to dories, but give them a four stroke outboard instead of the paddles. Think of how many jobs that would create!
Road conditions: poor. But, here is a news flash!!! drive according to the conditions!
I was just out and about, and did not even spin the (winter) tires when I let out the clutch or lock up coming to a stop. My secret is I take it easy, and watch the other drivers carefully, try to spot their stupid moves before they affect me.

ROTFLMAO Lostfaith must work for YRB. Too funny. Get to work lost and do you job lol.

LMAO, not to hard seeing stupid moves around this neck of the woods for sure.

Deborah Munoz is the only one of the current City Councilors I will be voting for tomorrow.

The following is from an article on opinion250.com dated Mar. 31, 2008.

"Prince George, B.C. - Council Chambers at Prince George City Hall were packed this evening to hear City Councilor Debora Munoz present her case to have a biomass community heating system either moved out of the bowl, or scrapped."

"Councilor Munoz presented a motion that called for the City not to proceed with the project. She says she was very concerned the project has proceeded to the point it had without there being any public consultation. "

"Councilor Munoz's motion was defeated,...."

The following is the link to the article:

http://www.opinion250.com/blog/view/8886

The following is taken from the minutes of a Prince George City Council meeting on Mar. 31, 2008

Moved by Councillor Munoz, seconded by Councillor Zurowski, that:

The proposed biomass Community Energy System project for the

downtown not proceed.

Moved by Councillor Zurowski, seconded by Councillor Sethen, that

the motion BE AMENDED to read “…not proceed at the proposed 4th

Avenue and Scotia Street location.”

His Worship Mayor Kinsley ruled the amendment was out of order as it was in

direct contradiction to the intent of the main motion.

Main Motion.

Defeated

His Worship Mayor Kinsley and Councillors Bassermann, Gratton, Scott, Sethen,

and Zurowski were recorded opposed."

The following is the link to the minutes of this City Council meeting.

http://www.city.pg.bc.ca/cityhall/minutes/2008/Minutes_2008_03_31.pdf

Ben and Elaine: Could you please post an update on your web site with information as to what the current status of this project is.

Just say no to crack eagleone.
Have you hugged your bear friends good night yet?

Good post Andyfreeze

Me? Not one incumbent is getting my vote. Maybe a petition can be started after the election to get Eugene a job as an executive adviser to the mayor. Buy him a suit and pay him an honorarium.

I am just shocked that I agree completely with lostfaiths comments on driving this week... ;-)

Anastasia - If you cannot see a car in front of you because its lights are not on, just what do you think is actually there? In other words, if you cannot recognize whats in front of you as anything other than open road with time to stop then you are outdriving conditions.
Make sense?

Have a good weekend all and happy voting

Keep Monoz. Replace the remaining council. Enough said!

LOL

Dan Rogers for mayor!
A+ for air quality
chair of the trails task force
got on a bike and rode through the streets to bring attention to the sorry plight of cyclists here
endorsement by a slate of local doctors as being our best chance for bringing about a healthier community
seeing homelessness & other downtown issues as joint responsibility of the city and not sloughing it off on the other levels of government
sensitive to local businesses' needs
sensitive to the fact the world is changing! we are evolving (we have to) for the sake of: economic sustainability (not these ridiculous industry-focused up and down turns -- we need stability!) & environmental stewardship.

Go Rogers!

The City needed Rogers three years ago and we lost him. We can't go back but we can go forward. Cheers for the doctors!

I have to admit I am having difficulty re-electing many of the incumbents. I like the role Skakun plays, so I will give him the nod. But, the rest? I'm struggling. I am looking at the current situation and have to give credit/blame to the current council for the situation we find ourselves in. Who else can we give credit/blame to?

I know most if not all of them are great people with servants hearts. And I thank them for their commitment to serve this community. But, I'm not happy with our air quality, our streets, our downtown situation and our financial situation in this city. So, I am voting for change. That means that there will be new faces on our city council. So many people aren't happy and want change. So, if we want to change the results, we need to change the people. Do the right thing tomorrow and vote for the people who will address the issues that are on your heart and on the minds and hearts of others.

Dan wants to spend millions on a trail system. I would think the priority is to give what we've already got a face lift already!

Just give real deep thought whom you want chairing meetings and who you want to represent your views on how your hard earned tax dollars should be spent.

I think Dan and Don, despite their charm, experience and abilities, would be a mistake for this term. City Hall needs a real shake down!

I would rather see tax money go to the candidate that is actually learning, thinking and doing...don't you agree?

tinyapplecord, please read the report of the trails task force (chaired by Dan Rogers). Not only did they come up with recommendations, they also came up with a list of funding sources - don't know where you came up with your info that he wants to spend millions.

This city is a great place - just a bit backward and behind the times. We could be a leader. We could be a really cool place. Time to get off the hicksville wagon.

Exactly active, but who do you think is going to pay for it all.
I will pay my share after other priorities are taken care of first.

Such as our tremendous bylaw services allowing heavy trucks to park down at the end of Domano.

Elite Transportation truck # 321 stay out you are destroying the streets I pay for.

I do not agree with what the Citizen did with their article in the paper today on the election. I won't be voting for Murray Krause as he is too focused on the Homeless and he is not putting them in "his" neighbourhood. I won't be voting for anyone that voted for the Eight Million Dollar Homeless Shelter on Queensway. We are rolling out the red carpet and then we are wondering why the Downtown is going to pot. The Homeless come in a lot of different varieties, some down on their luck and some with some very bad baggage. The New Friendship Lodge should not have been put in a residential area around Schools and Parks. There were only three councilors that listened to the people's concerns in the areas affected. Glen, Brian and Sherry. I would love to vote for Sherri Green but am worried she might want to push more of the Downtown's problems into my neighbourhood. I am voting for Dave Wilbur as I like his platform and we should take advantage of his profession. We need to vote for people that listen to the people. We are paying the bills.I agree that the air quality needs to be improved but Industry meens jobs.

I will not be voting for any of the present group at city hall. Don't forget who chaired the finance committee through the last 3 years. I will only vote for four of the newcomers. Go Dan

I am just shocked that I agree completely with lostfaiths comments on driving this week... ;-)

Anastasia - If you cannot see a car in front of you because its lights are not on, just what do you think is actually there? In other words, if you cannot recognize whats in front of you as anything other than open road with time to stop then you are outdriving conditions.
Make sense?

Have a good weekend all and happy voting

Wow, thanks everyone! I love the Friday assortment. I'm just sorry that today was so busy and I'm getting to this so late.

Now, on to the newest Report Card.

Disclaimer: The following Report Card was generated by the thoughtful submissions of one very opinionated person (me) and in no way conveys views of the establishment. In addition, no animals were hurt in the production of this report card (which might not hold true for the feelings of thin skinned candidates.

Ranking of Mayoral Candidates:

1. Dan Rogers: A
2. Don Zurowski A-
3. Dane Greenwell C
4. Eugene Fetterly C-

Editorial comments: 1)Dan Rogers: like his platform, like his over all values, reminds me of a democrat from Oregon. 2) Don Zurowski: overall like the guy, and I don't typically like Republican look alikes. I got rather annoyed with his overpolished pictures......is that makeup? 3) Dane Greenwell: impresses me in a tremendous way, young, fresh talent with an enormous lack of self absorption. 4) Eugene Fetterly : the best campaign one liners, and my vote for court jester!

Ranking of Council Candidates:

1. Garth Frizzell: A
2. Debora Munoz: A
3. Brian Skakun: A
4. Cameron Stolz: B+
5. Dave Wilbur: B+
6. Shari Green: B
7. Mary Anne Arcand: B
8. Greg Kauk: B
9. Brad Gibbons: B-
10. Murry Krause: B-
11. Ellen Cranston: C+
12. Trent Derrick: C
13. Diane Nakamura: C
14. Harry Ulch: C
15. Shirley Gratton: C
16. Don Basserman: C
17. Dwayne Stene: C
18. Glen "Moose" Scott: C

Editorial Comments on selected candidates:
1) Garth Frizzel: very impressive, young, talented, bright, clearly expressed ideas, I love that he has his business downtown. I look for great things from him. 2) and 3) Debora and Brian: they are hard for me to tell apart in that they both have terrific follow through, do their homework, and have critical thinking skills. 4) Cameron: this guy really impressed me, I like his platform, and I love his store! 5) Dave Wilbur: new to me, but impressed me, and I like many of the folks who plugged him in the paper. 6)Shari Green: single overriding issue, and I'm good with that! 7)Mary Ann Arcand: impressed me tremendously up until she was a no show for PACHA's request.....now a wild card 8)Greg Kauk: the cow thing just isn't doing it for me, but he's kinda quirky in a fun way. 9)Brad Gibbons: liked his CNC presentation, like what he does for a living, 10)11)12)13) Murry, Trent, Ellen, Diane: all lovely people in different ways, I hope one day Ellen stops talking in groups as though we are her kindergarten class. 14)Harry: never seemed like he really wanted to run 15)Shirley and Don: members of the "pacemakers club", and I think the flower baskets are lovely. 16)Glen "Moose" Scott: did anyone else think that this man looked embalmed at the presentation at CNC? In all honesty, I've seen better skin during some viewings!

Alright: I'm done. Thanks for indulging me.

All of these elections have been great fun, and overall, I have thoroughly enjoyed the banter. As a dual citizen, my Obama/Biden vote was my favorite. A part of history, to be sure! But having a chance to vote in three, so close together, has really tickled my funny bone, and challenged my intellect!
Thanks All.

ps. Remember: Vote Early and Vote Often!