and so it begins The greed of a few bankers translates into hardship for many yet the big banks are going to get saved "Justice for all"

This is excellent news.

There has been an over production of these materials, and the market has been flooded for too long now, and the prices are down to levels that we haven't seen in decades.

Better to suffer some pain now, as this problem will not go away with some cutting.

This has nothing to do with greed or bankers, this has everything to do with smart business.

Good luck to Canfor, and to their management. They have to make hard choices, which are not pleasant or popular. Keep up the good work.

Very sad news for the forest industry- very few markets left- poles and the log export market to Japan and China if they can pay- check out the prices of lumber at Home depot etc- haven't gone down- better to buy direct from the mills.

An 8 foot 2by4 was just pennies over 2 bucks at the building supply last week. Yet a 1by4 was more, guess cause they are specialty size. Buy a table saw and rip your 2's to 1's and save money if you need them.

Great news......this should have been done much sooner.

West Fraser led the pack ...they have always been the industry leader.

Tembec will announce their curtailments in the a.m.....which just leaves Tolko....

This industry needs a kick start and this is it.

Good news.

I can't believe someone is thanking Canfor for doing a good job. You must not be an employee.

Guess there'll be another few hundred people out of work shortly. Not to worry, though, our unemployment rate will magically stay at the same 5% that it has been for the past few years. Thanks to all the poor bastards who have run out of EI and are no longer apparently "part of the workforce" (according to the BS government stats), it seems that our politicians can continue to spin an impressive number about the amount of people still with decent jobs in this region.

It's like a one-for-one program...one guy gets laid off, another guy loses his benefits and goes on welfare, they apparently balance each other out and the unemployment rate does not change. What a crock.

The HRSDC and IPG who feed us these monthly employment stats probably also believe that if you eat a whole tub of Ben & Jerry's, but wash it down with a Diet Coke....that it's "calorie neutral".

To all those thanking Canfor for the future shutdowns wow hope your employer takes away your bread & butter for a couple of weeks . Granted we are facing hard times right now , but for anyone to say they thank you for people now facing hardship even for a short time is BS .

tombstone81:

Your comments are a very accurate description of the current situation!

I cannot believe that some of you out there like to see people and families suffer. You all must be Canfor employees with jobs so high on the ladder you do not care about others because you are safe. How can you applaud Canfor for doing a great job, even for a short time. It is better to keep people working and for them to take LESS profits and everyone will keep spending, this way nobody has anything to spend.

I work in the lumber and pulp industry and this is what is required to stabilize this sinking industry.
My income and the income of many close friends is in play here and while it hurts it is what is needed.
Tembec announced theire cuts today as I said they would-

again this is what is needed.

http://www.cbc.ca/money/story/2009/02/03/tembeccuts.html

leoleo
where have you been - there have been many cutbacks at Canfor and all other companies - in your 1st comment you said "its about time" and "West Fraser lead the pack" - I don't think so. All companies have been cutting back for some time in various ways - all took shutdown at christmas all have lost shifts (starting a year ago), mills have closed, many are on reduced work weeks. Its about time you say???.....this didn't just start happening yesterday and I think canfor and other companies started cutbacks long before West Fraser....but what does that matter, they are all in the same market!

Hey lifesuchs - what profit are you talking about. There are no lumber companies making any profits in todays markets. Companies are loosing money and they may soon be out of business and then there are more job losses that way. Most companies are into overdrafts and loans and are just trying to hang on until the economy turns.
Profit isn't a dirty word....without profit there is no reason for companies to stay in business and employ people!

Winnie....the cuts were small and temporary with most restarting.
For the most part they were not at once which gave little assistance in the market.
Did they work? NO

Already today the market is up and the volumes are substancial.

Tolko will announce further cuts today.....they have already announced they are off the market.

Other positives DR Horton halved their loss and NAR reports pending U.S. home sales rebounded in December by 6.3%

This is a hard decision, but it's the right one. There's no demand for wood right now, so why keep producing it?

cuts were not so small
four operations in the north have been shutdown indefinately for canfor along - think of Mackenzie...
and third shifts totally gone last year at canfor and Winton Global shut down a mill or two indefinately also..... these were not small!

small was a poor choice of words on my part....I should have said they were not enough.
In addition for many consecutive months production has exceeded the surge mechanism in the softwood lumber agreement which clearly hilites that while some mills have curatiled others have ramped up.
There is far to much wood in the system.
Winton Global only had one dimension mill.

Westfraser leads the pack? You arent paying attention. Westfrasers curtailments last week were their first. They have created unwieldy inventories and are now feeling a huge working capital pinch.

Lumber hit $130 yesterday..That says it all.

"Winnie....the cuts were small and temporary with most restarting."

Right. Like Mackenzie and Chetwynd? Hello!

as I said "not enough"

leoleo, you've got some insightful comments, and that's a breath of fresh air in these forums.

Obviously, anyone reading these stories are welcome to post comments, but some are borne of a narrow-minded view, even a real lack of information.

Thanks for providing your thoughts. And your comment about Tembec's cuts were spot on. That displays a real understanding our our current situation.

Understanding the problem is the first step in resolving it. Let's hope more of these manufacturing facilities take the hard steps required to remain profitable.

While you two congratulate yourselves on your brilliant thinking and insightful comments take a moment to feel for the families that will be effected by these cuts. I detect a smug lack of empathy in some posts on this thread.
Hard measures for hard times are probably unavoidable, but save your congratulations and slaps on the back, because there are some good people at the top of these organizations who do care about the effects on the workers and their attitudes are not cavalier. They know that these are not just jobs, but people as well.

I remember very well less than 10 years ago when Canfor started to gobble everything up...specifically that they would be here for 10 and then gone like the wind.....guess what? yes it's that time. Canfor made their cash and now it's time to slink away. Don't think any different fokls...money and greed make the world go 'round and when there's nothing left - the " big businesses" go elsewhere.

I think, Born in BC misread the order of the comments. "The cuts were small and temporary with most restarting" those were not my words.
I was trying to make the point to Leoleo who said most of the previous cuts were small and did not help the market situation. I didn't think they were small.

Anyways, I agree Junco - these are hard situations for all involved and most people care about the effects.

I think, Born in BC misread the order of the comments. "The cuts were small and temporary with most restarting" those were not my words.
I was trying to make the point to Leoleo who said most of the previous cuts were small and did not help the market situation. I didn't think they were small.

Anyways, I agree Junco - these are hard situations for all involved and most people care about the effects.

You know, you're right about my lack of empathy. And also about my coming down on the side of the businesses who are having to downsize, or go as far as shutting down completely (either temporarily, or long term, or forever...).

That comes from experience on the side of the fence occupied by business owners. Preservation of wealth, and the potential to continue working while the economy suffered a downturn is what this is about. Its not about "greed", unless you define that as everybody ending up poor, and no job to go to when there was a turnaround. That's not in anyone's self interest, nor is it what any government would like to see, be in local, provincial, or federal. That's why you'll hear our local politicians come out with sympathetic comments, but little will be done. Sure, they've extended EI benefits, but that's a drop in the bucket.

Like I said in another topic's forum, the signs have been there all along, for the past couple of years, and people who haven't prepared for this, will suffer, similar to the small animal who doesn't prepare for winter, and starves.

I think this is time for people to get reacquainted with their families, either here or in other parts of the country, to see who can provide some help for them when their financial wherewithal suffers. And some will loose their snowmobiles, ATV's, boats, RV's, cars, and even homes. Signs of greed and excess from the working man are completely visible, and now that the chickens are coming home to roost, must be paid for.

"I think, Born in BC misread the order of the comments. "The cuts were small and temporary with most restarting" those were not my words."

Apologies Winnie, I see how you got to your conclusion but my comment was directed at leoleo or whatever his name is.

Thanks Junco for standing up for us small people who are affected by this. There is one mill that said it is cheaper for them to keep on going than to quit and lay everyone off. I congratulate them for being big enough for trying to weather this out. We all understand short lay offs from time to time but it is the no job at all that scaes everyone. We buy the paper all the time and there are not any jobs in there. To the other ones who posted on here please have a heart for the ones who are less fortunate. I hope you never have to experience what we are right now. I just hope everything gets better soon.

"Posted by: leoleo on February 3 2009
as I said "not enough""

Right. Especially by Westfraser. The company you said was a industry leader. The same company that has continued to produce inventory that will not have to be sold at rock bottom pricing AND will delay the rebound of the market. You make it sound like Westfraser invented the shutdown last thursday. I would respectfully suggest thats not the case and you dont have a clue what you are talking about.

It is terrible that families and individuals have to take this downtime now but I really do believe that Canfor has made the right moves and will emerge strong and create/maintain jobs when this is all over. Alot of those jobs will be in PG where Canfor is heavily invested. Thats good for PG. And it will be good for PG residents.

Right on, Born in BC! WF continued to go full-out while mills were being shut down all over BC.

FYI....I am sympathetic to the workers and families as I am one and my income has been affected.
Rustad, Northwood, NCP, Noranda Forest, Canfor are just some of the comapnies I have worked for.

Re West Fraser.... they have made numerous cuts prior to Thursday.
I am not waving their flag just acknowledging that what they did was what the industry needed and thankfully others agree.

And for the 3rd time I admit "small" was a poor choice of words I should have used "they were not enough".

The lumber people used to whine about our dollar being too high and hurting business. Now our loonie is down and may fall farther. But that was then. This is now. Right?

Tolko has now committed....thank you.

4 Cariboo mills shut effective Monday.

2 wk shut at High Level

2 week shut at Lavington

2 week shutdown at Armstrong

PRESS RELEASE

For immediate release: February 3, 2009

Tolko curtails seven sawmills

[VERNON, BC] February 3, 2009 - Tolko Industries Ltd. announced temporary curtailments at seven of its lumber operations today due to continued poor product markets. Curtailments at the Armstrong, Lavington, and High Level are scheduled to be for two weeks, while the curtailments at the Creekside, Lakeview Lumber, Quest Wood, and Soda Creek operations will remain in effect until the market situation allows us to resume production. All of these curtailments will begin February 9, 2009.

“Market conditions for our softwood lumber products continue to be the worst Tolko has seen in its 52-year history,” said Mike Harkies, Tolko Vice President & General Manager, Solid Wood & Kraft Papers. “This decision is difficult and unfortunate but we must take steps to match our production level to market demand.”

The two-week curtailments will reduce Tolko’s lumber production by 68 million board feet. The further curtailment of the four Cariboo operations will reduce Tolko’s lumber production 18.5 million board feet for every week of additional downtime.

Related woodlands activities are being adjusted accordingly.

The curtailments affect approximately 1300 employees. “This announcement does not reflect the performance of our employees. We appreciate their efforts and understanding while we work to manage our business through this difficult period,” said Harkies. “We will also work hard to ensure that we continue to meet our loyal customers’ product needs.

For further information:

Media:
Sheri Greeno
Communications Advisor
250.549.5341
E-mail

Market:
Sam Mowat
General Manager, Marketing & Sales
250.550.1474
E-mail

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Lumber has rebounded to the 160 as company after company shuts down - however the market is so ineastic it would only take one or two to start again to force the prices back down to the 140 level- this could be a very long shut down- one analysis is predicting the TSX to drop below 5000 points by the end of the month.