"On University Hill, a speed of 80-to 100 kilometres is not unusual."

Yea well with no exits/entrances the speed limit on this road is to low.


Thats the opinion of someone that actually lives in Prince George.

I've been on university hill road many times and I am in agreement that the speed limit could be bumped up to around 70. The current 50 where it turns off into the university grounds is ok.

I don't agree with Ben about the police presence decreased in the city. Where do you get that information from? I find it ironic that when there are many out on the road for a ticket blitz, everyone complains. Sounds like a catch 22 situation to me.

Most schools have playgrounds in them, so the 30k speed limit doesn't change when school is out.

I agree with Ben! It is every day police presence that makes a difference and not the occasional ticket blitz! Every day police presence has been declining steadily. It's a fact.

Whenever the police sets up a ticket blitz speeding drivers warn each other by flashing their headlights and in no time at all traffic slows down to the crawl of a funeral procession.

As soon as the cops leave it's back to the Indy 500 again.

I travel University Way regularly and the speed limit is already 70. Driving up the hill, drivers pass by me at least doing 90 and most going around 100. It turns into 50 near the University entrance, then goes back to 70. There is a lot of wildlife, walkers, and cyclists on this stretch and this is plenty fast enough, IMO.

Police dept must of decreased the officers in the traffic section and moved them to the criminal section to deal with the drugs and gang violence. Should move some back to traffic and for the people who deal with drugs, lock them up for a longer time. Then less drugs around and the VLA area will improve.

The cops can do no right. Either their presence is too high or not high enough. When they set up speed traps, people complain, now we're saying they should be writing more tickets.

In any case, I'd be happy if they focussed their time and effort in known crash areas (like Hwy 16 and Domano), rather than setting up at the bottom of a hill. All too often you see these guys in areas where they know people speed and it's an easy ticket.

I travel up University and Tyner at least twice a day. I typically go between 75 and 80 and few people pass me. There was one person probably doing in the 100 range a few days ago, but that is extremely rare from my experience. Besides, the road is breaking up big time is is not being fixed.

The tyner part I typically stay in the 70 to 75 range and when it is dark or dusk slow down because of animals which have virtually disappeared since the construction. I find there too I drive about the average speed of other drivers on the road at the same time as I am.

speeding infractions are nothing more than a cash cow and a quota target. It is claimed that defined speed limits are imposed to ensure public safety. Vehicles crash at various speeds in various conditions. Conclusion: limiting speed for public safety is a farce. It comes down to driver ability to drive the conditions.

Enough people fight with staying within the bounds of the law that it indicates to me that it is not wanted. Why else would there be radar detectors on the market. Just another way to get around an unpopular law.

So again the government has created a situation where normally law abiding citizens are turned into criminals because the limit is set too low. Who asked for these limits? I don't recall any vote for it. It was arbitrarily imposed!

Most major roads already are built to much higher specifications than the imposed limit.

Let 'r rip!

This article is a perfect example showing that Ben Meisner reads his own website.

On Friday September 4th I got involved in an online debate during "Friday Free For All" where subscribers to Opinion250 basically teamed up to let me know that I was a huge danger to other motorists just because I drive the speed limit.

In all of my life I can honestly say that I have never been told that I'm self-righteous simply because I am obeying the law.

I mean really people, give your head a shake. I could barley believe how people were defending their excessive speeds.

Hasts off to you Ben, for you've stood up for the honest drivers here in PG. You have also intelligently tried to send out a message that we need to use caution this week (until next summer) because the kids are back in school and the speeds in our school zones are about to change.

Please remember that the maximum in a school zone is 30km per hour and that it is NOT okay to calculate another 9km per hour to that maximum thereby making it 39km per hour.

iT's just rediculous to think that way.

I'm Newtechie and that's NOT my Opinion... THAT'S THE LAW!

Who was advocating speeding in a school zone? As usual newtechie, you've warped what people have said into your own reality. Not the way to win a debate.

speeding infractions are nothing more than a cash cow and a quota target. It is claimed that defined speed limits are imposed to ensure public safety. Vehicles crash at various speeds in various conditions. Conclusion: limiting speed for public safety is a farce. It comes down to driver ability to drive the conditions.

Enough people fight with staying within the bounds of the law that it indicates to me that it is not wanted. Why else would there be radar detectors on the market. Just another way to get around an unpopular law.

So again the government has created a situation where normally law abiding citizens are turned into criminals because the limit is set too low. Who asked for these limits? I don't recall any vote for it. It was arbitrarily imposed!

Most major roads already are built to much higher specifications than the imposed limit.

Let 'r rip!

LOL...

MrPG you are one to talk. Now you're sounding hypocritical. Are you telling me that you honestly drive in excess of the speed limits until you get to a school zone then all of a sudden your doing EXACTLY 30km?

Ha ha ha ha.... okay then MrPG. Let's go with that if it let's you sleep at night.

But listen... both you and I know the truth. You speed, you defend it (vigorously), and I also know that you certainly aren't driving 30km an hour in a school zone if YOU don't see any kids around regardless of what you say.

So although no one came right out and defended speeding in a school zone it's quite obvious what they meant. If they believe it's okay to exceed the speed then they will... anywhere and anytime.

Laugh (or LOL) all you want, you don't know anything. I drive the speed limit in school zones, as do most people -- and yes, people do speed through school zones, but I'm not one of them.

Outside of school zones, I probably average about 10 km/h over, I keep up with the flow of traffic, unlike yourself.

So go on and keep LOL'ing and telling yourself whatever gets you through the day. It doesn't make it fact.

What's happening with the driving public is that without the RCMP collecting cash for government coffers people are driving a more reasonable speed.

Speed does not kill.

Crashing kills.

In Germany the accident rate on the (very fast) Autobahn is 3.2 fatalities per billion km driven. On the (slow, heavily speed enforced) United States Interstate Highway system that rate jumps to 5 fatalities per billion km driven. (source: http://www.gettingaroundgermany.info/autobahn.htm)

The fact that there is a decreased police presence and people are driving quickly without a spate of accidents and deaths tells me that the speed limits are too low(or for the most part useless).

I'm not advocating blasting through school zones or quiet residential areas, but on main thoroughfares let's be more reasonable.

If you have a line of traffic stacked behind you (even if you are driving the arbitrarily imposed limit) you ARE a danger to traffic and should pull off and let people pass.

Wow, you're really getting backed into a corner.

So first of all you're saying that you speed because you keep up with the masses and that I'm wrong because I obey the speed limit.

Then you go on to say that you don't speed in school zones (which is not true -YOU KNOW YOU SPEED BECAUSE YOU'RE A SPEEDER AND THAT'S WHAT SPEEDERS DO-... but let's go with your comment "I drive the speed limit in school zones"...

Shame on you MrPg... am I to assume that you are once again hypocritical? Am I?

But... I'm confused. You have done nothing but defend speeding and "cut me down" for obeying the fact that I travel the posted speeds.

Since Friday you've done nothing but redicule me for obeying the law (which is a rediculous thing to do to someone obeying the law) and NOW you're saying that you obey the law when you drive through school zones??????

Well that's just rediculous. So I'm an idiot for obeying the speed limits yet you're not when you travel through school zones doing 30km an hour?

How is that NOT hypocritical?

C'mon MrPg... pick a side. Ya can't have it both ways.

Your fumbling over yerself trying to be right. It's getting so bad now that I'm starting to feel embarrassed for you.

Okay I'm done with this... you're not making any sense and you're starting to change your own rules.

You're funny newtechie. You actually believe that I care about what your twisted logic -- how cute. Yawn... got anything else?

Here's some interesting information about Montana's experiment with speed limit free highways: http://www.hwysafety.com/hwy_montana_2001.htm

nettechie:
You were not slammed by every other poster for obeying the law. You took the position that regardless if the law was just and reasonable, you blindly obeyed the law when everyone else thinks it is not just or reasonable.

Up here in the north, we have a much more independent mentality. We think for ourselves and obey the laws so as not to pay the piper, not to be "good obedient citizens".

In your youth, did you grow your hair long? Even though your dad forbade it. Did you get bootleg liquor because you were under age? I know it is not quite apples to apples, but the principle is the same. You selectively obeyed the rules set out by the authority over you and got away with what you could. If you deny it, then we know one of two things: you are lying, or you have never had an original thought of your own. If case 1, you are human, if case two, I wonder how you get by (the term sheeple was coined for case two). There are often a third option but I cannot think of one.

Now if you want to blindly obey every law and rule set out by authorities, you would be most welcome in countries such as China, Afghanistan, Iran, etc. Canada was born by people that had independent thought and refused to kowtow to those authorities.

My final question for you is: Are you a real Canadian with independent thoughts, or are you moving?

Here's some interesting information about Montana's experiment with speed limit free highways: http://www.hwysafety.com/hwy_montana_2001.htm

There are four primary contributors to this confusion: In the last 30 years we have institutionalized a billion dollar enforcement industry... a press that transitioned from investigative into a business... the ever ominous politicians looking to get reelected or establishing a legacy... and the ignored traffic safety engineering community who has relentlessly documented cause and effect safety strategies, requires peer review and verification before a standard is adopted as the most effective solution

The National Highway Traffic Safety Administration (NHTSA) personifies the traffic enforcement industry, because this industry is its primary constituent.

The National Highway Traffic Safety Administration (NHTSA) personifies the traffic enforcement industry, because this industry is its primary constituent. In its role, it first created �Speed Kills�, next was �Road Rage� and then the �Aggressive Driving� slogans and supporting propaganda campaigns to scare the public into growing the enforcement industry (revenues, equipment, staffing). Its press releases as a matter of practice grossly misrepresent data (invent a crisis, then the need to intervene) � engineering findings never support its conclusions. At what cost? Fatality rates in 2000 increased again, sound engineering practices have been undermined, road blocks for checking your papers are now legal and common, vehicle confiscation for minor infractions now accepted practice, mothers are thrown into jail for not wearing seat belts � and a public gladly sacrificing its liberty to false safety idols.

Here is what the Montana data shows. (chart below) After all the politically correct safety programs were in place and fully operational, complete with federal safety funds, more laws and citations being issued. Here are the results.

1. After the new Speed Limits were established, interstates fatal accidents went up 111%. From a modern low of 27 with no daytime limits, to a new high of 56 fatal accidents with speed limits.

2. On interstates and federal primary highways combined, Montana went from a modern low of 101 with no daytime limits, to a new high of 143 fatal accidents with speed limits.

3. After a 6 year downward trend in the percentage of multiple vehicle accidents on its 2 lane primary highways, multiple vehicle accident rates increased again.

4. With the expectation of higher speed when there was no daytime limit, Montana�s seat belt usage was well above the national average on its highways without a primary law, lane and road courtesy increased, speeds remained relatively stable and fatal accidents dropped to a modern low. After the new limits, fatal accidents climbed to a modern high on these classifications of highway, road courtesy decreased and flow conflict accidents rose again.

I predict after the Domano and 16 intersection is finished, i.e. being only widened and new white lines, it will only take about 8 (calendar days) for some ninny to have a serious accident there. The expenditure of about 9 million pesos does not guarantee an absence of doofi (plural for doofus?) in this intersection in the future. Get back to me on this. Especially if I'm wrong.

I find all this banter about how fast people should be driving, and what lane they should be in very amusing. Until such a time when I lose my 40% discount and roadstar savings, I think I will continue with what has worked for me to date.

Just like to point out that the Autobahn in Germany is the MOST heavily enforced road network in the world. This is done with Police officers in both marked and unmarked cars, use of aircraft and the most hated (in BC) of devices video cameras (photo radar for the uninitiated). They also do have speed limits on the autobahn, both maximum and minimum speeds which can be changed electronically based upon traffic flow and congestion.

"Until such a time when I lose my 40% discount and roadstar savings"....

I have has that for probably 10 years of whenever it first started.

The reason why?

1. I know how to stop and look both ways at an intersection before moving on.

2. I know what the difference between yield and stop is

3. I know that the person in front of me likely does not and will come to a stop, even if the lane he is about to enter has not got a car in sight in it, so I am prepared to stop instead of bumping into him (a neat little defensive driving technique one has to know about when there are idiots on the road who actually think that stopping is safer driving than yielding forgettting completely about the person behind them since they are only capable of looking straight ahead with 5degree tunnel vision)

4. I know the differnce between merge and yield

5. I know how to drive defensively to avoid the probable yield and eventual stop of the driver in front of me ... who would not be as lucky if he were trying to merge onto an LA freeway.

6. I know that when I have two lane traffic in one direction I stay to the right no matter how fast or slow I go and only move to the left lane when that lane is clear and the car in front of me is slower than I drive.

7. I also drive defensively when in the left lane watching for people who do not check properly before they enter the left lane while I am even with their rear bumper, out of view of the rear view mirror and only in view of the side view mirror which many drivers do not know how to use.

As a result, the only accidents I have had since my youth have been when I have been hit in the rear - once, some decades ago, I was the third car from the rear of 5 stopped to wait for the signal to changee so we could make a left hand turn, and the bunch of us were hit by a driver going 50 to 60 kmph (not speeding), without noticing that traffic in front was stopped. My car was smashed front and back, as were most of the other cars.

That accident, btw, was not speeding. It was inattention to what you were supposed to be doing, driving the car. That is the single main cause of accidents. Inability to pay attention to driving, failing to yield the right of way, understanding that there are other dirvers on the road and whether you are speeding, going the speed limit, or going below the speed limit, understanding that the road is not your personal property, but is there to be shared by others.

It is about respect. Not about "I have a right". Those who belive the latter obviously have never teaken a defensive driving course.

Bang on gus, this is what some folks can't wrap their brains around.

Speeding on a motorcycle is much worse than in a vehicle. People are not looking specifically for a bike when driving and that makes an accident more apt to happen than a car speeding. Our highway speeds are too low.
I drove the Banff Jasper highway when the road was gravel with some pavement back in 1959. The speed limit was 65 MPH. The cars were not as controllable,had poorer brakes,the lights were hardly lights. The new vehicles today can easily handle that road at 65 MPH. Now we have a 90 KPH limit in the park with double fines and double fines for construction areas. Speeding tickets are not about safety, they're about cash. Same as seatbelts. No one will ever convince me otherwise. Period.

http://www.etsc.eu/documents/Speed_Fact_Sheet_1.pdf

The continuing debate of whether Germany should follow the neighbouring countries and have speed limits on the Autobahn. There are some controlled section, but much is still uncontrolled.

There are some interessting german blogs about driving on the A as they call it. while the recommended speed in some sections is 130, the average is more in the range of 140 to 160. Expect to get a light horn form someone behind you if you are in the left-most lane at that soeed for too long. The closing speed could be 20 to 30km/h and even higher. 200 is possible, even 220 for some. if you are going 140, the closing speed is 60 to 80 which can be very dangerous. Left lane hoggers who go the 130 recommended speed are dangerous drivers unless they move over to yield to the faster car.

Watching in the mirror becomes a more important routine under those conditions.

The comment on the attached sheet that foreign drivers who are not used to that can be dangerous drivers is interesting. The accident statistic should really differentiate to show that this might be the case or not.

Here are some fatality rates per 1 billion km driven for 2004.

1. United Kingdom 7.5
2. Finland 7.6
3. Netherlands 7.7
4. Australia 8.0
5. Norway 8.3
6. Sweden 8.3
7. Switzerland 8.8
8. Canada 8.9
9. USA 9.4
10. Germany 9.7
11. Denmark 9.7
12. France 10.9
13. Ireland 10.9
14. Japan 11.2
15. Austria 11.7
16. New Zealand 12.4
17. Iceland 16.0
18. Belgium g 16.3
19. Slovenia 16.7
20. Republic of Korea g 26.0
21. Greece 26.7
22. Czech Republic 31.7
23. Slovak Republic 46.9

I see that the UK is lowest.

I knew there must be some advantage to driving on the wrong side of the road. Everyone seems to drive more careful as a result. :-)

newtechie = troll

Hey salsa...

That's bullying... and it's not allowed here.

Be careful.

Newtechie if you are walking down a sidewalk and you are blocking someone who is walking faster do you step aside or hold your ground?

Oh geez, I didn't realize that there are speed limits on sidewalks...

Nice try...

Hey nerdtechie,please elaborate on careful

newtechie its about being safe. That person trying to get around you may take chances to do so. If there was an accident would you feel any responsibility.
Lets not forget about common courtesy.
You feel safe in your car that is why you act the way you do. Try blocking someone on the sidewalk and see what may happen. Let us know the result.

newtechie,
Can't you just do the courteous thing & move over??????? Get over it.