Why are the taxpayers of B.C.footing the bill for the clean-up? Shouldn't the "All Nations Corporation" or it's principals be held responsible?
Or does that part not apply to native corporations?

Yup,

I wondered how long some redneck was going to take in trying to slander native people once again.

Ben shame on you. I was born at night but not last night, and my goodness the tongue in cheek way you write these stories leads many a person to assume the company above is native owned.

Andy, notice it says All-Nations, which pretty much could mean it could be from any nation. There is a real distinction from All-Nations to First Nations.

Now Andy, if it was the good ol' boys all-nations corporation, you would have no problem with it wouldn't you? Or does the label 'redneck' not apply to you?

Means bend over here it comes again

I see nothing in this story that suggests anything derogatory to natives or suggesting that it was or was not native owned. The company was called "All Nations" plain and simple. This is bad for the taxpayer regardless of who owns it. I am however NOT speaking for Andyfreeze

Yes it DOES say "All Native Corporation".So the question remains the same: Why are they (the company)not being held respnsible for the cleaning up of the site? Which is what I originally asked.
An if it IS or was a native corporation, the same thing applies.Why are THEY not responsible for the clean-up?
I guess if that question makes me a redneck,that's the way it goes.Bizarre!
Is that an uncomfortable question for some?
I still don't have an answer,so I will do some digging and see what I find.

Andy, It says "All Nations Corporation" not All Native. You are however 100% correct with your question, former share holders of this company (native or not) should be held responsible (if you can find them). I think Big_B concern was your assumption it was native owned at the time of closure. It may have been but it doesnt matter tax payers should not be paying for this. And again there is nothing in the original story that suggested it was native owned. Who cares who owned it they should pay to clean it up not the taxpayers. And for that matter who owns it now?. Whomever they are may not have made the mess but its becomes there problem in my mind.

My mistake.That is what I meant to write.Thanks.

And yes, I agree with you vocer.They SHOULD be held responsible WHOEVER they are.Native or not is not the point.I don't care either!
So far I can find nothing on the company but will check with someone in Fort St.James and see what the score is.
I am a firm believer in holding these companies feet to fire for cleaning up this kind of mess.And that includes mining as well.
And if Big_B knows the answer,maybe he can tell us?

What company? It is dust, it died!

It doesn't matter what color owned the business, they walked away and they ain't coming back.

Or maybe you would prefer a more clear company dissolution where the investors have no more energy or just had enough and want to walk away, then they are all shot.

Or maybe you are a religious person and believe you will get blood from a stone?

I say call in the City of Prince George councillors. The solution is to bring in the stump grinders and mulch the whole thing, then compost the pile and sell it as black dirt to local gardeners. Works in PG because we have lots of fresh air and don't waste it on burning.

I agree with everyone saying whoever owned the mill should clean it up. It sounds like an absolute disaster waiting to happen.

YOu know in this day and age of value added products, is there some way to salvage this stuff rather than just burning it?

I'm curious to know.

By the way Andy, I apologize for getting all pissy earlier.

Thanks Big_B.No problem at all and no offence taken.
That was actually my first thought...why couldn't this stuff, which apparently is mostly sawdust and chips,be used for co-generation (if we had one),hog fuel etc.?I realize there are costs involved but it does seem like there should be a better use for it.
And haven't been able to find out exactly who owns or owned the mill but some names have been thrown around. Should know tomorrow.

So, here we have a situation where it is not cost effective to transport sawdust and chips to a cogen plant in PG, let's say.

Yet, everyone is talking about cutting down dead trees a few hundred kilometers from PG, transporting them into town, chipping them and using them as feedstock to make pellets or generate energy.

That is, of course, much more expensive than simply hauling the sawdust and chips from a defunct plant which does not require harvesting and chipping.

So, why are people so enamoured with using the dead trees for bioenergy? There is just no money in it and this is one more indication of that.

Yet another case for instituting a requirement for companies like this to post a bond, to cover clean up costs in the event they become insolvent, or decide to leave the country. The bond amount should be proportionate to the potential cost of cleanup, and that figure could change year to year, depending on the activities of the operation. Another good reason for a bond is to pay other liabilities like wages, suppliers, taxes. These items are often unpaid when companies become insolvent, or when unscrupulous management decides to keep the earnings and stop paying the bills.
A large bond would keep some people from even starting a business, but maybe that is a good thing too. If you go into an enterprise without enough capital, the odds are greater that you will fail before you can begin to make a profit. And in this case, like so many others, someone else has to foot the bill to clean up.
metalman.

As near as I can find out,the last guy to operate the mill was a local Fort St.James logger who went broke about 3 years ago.A lot of people lost a lot of money when he did I am told.
There were other operators before him however,including this All Nations Corporation meaning the mess was not all his.
So why does nobody have to pay for any of the clean-up? Is it because they all went broke? Should each operator not be held responsible to pay his share?
I would assume what is happening is all the former operators are claiming to be too broke to clean it up.
I gather the millsite is just outside of FJS off the north/Tachie road.
So the taxpayers get to foot the bill to the tune of 500,000 bucks!?
Interesting scenario but probably not unusual.I will keep digging.
And does anyone know if this wood waste would be good for manufacturing pellets?

Check with the council in the fort.

Metalman says"...A large bond would keep some people from even starting a business, but maybe that is a good thing too. If you go into an enterprise without enough capital, the odds are greater that you will fail before you can begin to make a profit. And in this case, like so many others, someone else has to foot the bill to clean up..."

Great, that should eliminate about 90% of the business starts in the province. If guys like Patison or Rempel don't do it, no one else will because the cost is too great.

Another smart NDP idea to shut down the province. No one moves, no one gets hurt.

Surety bonds for such things as performance and materials in the construction industry are a normal part of business. The cost of the bond is anywhere between 0.5% to 2% of the face value depending on the quality and reliability of the company.

So, a contractor who builds a $10million building or roadway will typically post a bond for the total amount which will cost a out $50,000 for that type of surety bond. Who pays for the bond? The owner of the building, since it is part of the cost of putting up the building. Each contractor bidding has to provide it, thus it is not a matter of one contractor having an advantage over another.

The same goes if someone starts a business which may cause a liability which may not be borne by the business but by the community. Each business of a certain type wishing to operate in that community will have to post a bond which will reflect the cleanup cost.

So, for a $1 million estimated cleanup cost, a bond my cost 2% for that sort of surety which will make it $20,000. Anyone who wishes to start a sawmill business which includes storing substantial wood waste would simply have to post that bond. It is a cost of doing business in today’s world. End of story.

But also doesn't this indicate that our environmental laws are not working or do not exist. Why was the pile allowed to get so large in the first place ? There was no plan to deal with the waste right from day one ! This shouldn't have been allowed.

You are quite right. Our environmental laws are not working all the time. SOme situations fall between the cracks and there are many more cracks than most people think. The asphalt situation and the pellet plant situation in th BCR which put out more than 350tons/year of PM when its permit was for about 1/5th of that are just recent examples.

The question is how high a pile is one allowed to accumulate. Sort of similar to the question of how large an inventory is one allowed to have in a log yard? I expect that the amount of feedstock one requires and where it is stored is up to the individual businesses.

However bonding is a viable option form my point of view if this happens to often. Perfomance bonds are probably more common than most people believe.

Okay everyone, sometimes you just cannot pre plan a perfect world. Sometimes s**t just happens no matter what precautions are taken, no matter how thoroughly someone plans for something to "work out", sometimes, IT JUST DOESN'T. And sometimes a mess is left behind. And sometimes people get hurt, and sometimes yadi yaddi yadddi...yada......

So, what's left? The next thing to do is "clean up the messes, make things right again, learn from the experience and make changes for betterment in the future. Those who were forced to abandon the project have now created work for someone else. Someone else now has an opportunity to benefit from their failure, Kind of like "the world going round".

Did it ever occur to any of you that the people who were involved with trying to make this mill a success may not have planned to have it all go wrong this way?

My quote for the day: There are those who do, and those who talk about doing.

And before any of you blast me, I will admit to being mostly a talker about doin, but I do not envy the doers, well, at least not all the time.

Andy,

I grew up in FSJ and it sounds like the old Gregory Forest Products mill which started up in 1987.

That mill was doomed from the start. When it was first built, it was a state of the art mill and they actually had to bring in workers from Sweden to set it up. The crazy part is that about halfway through, Mr. Gregory decides that the Swedes should go home and locals can set up the rest. Guess what, the mill opens and the section the Swedes set up works fine, but the rest is constantly breaking down and in need of repair.

My dad owned an excavating company (ok, one backhoe) and did work for Gregory Forest Products cleaning ditches out. MY dad offerred to slope them properly so they wouldn't cave in, but was told no, just clean them out. 6 months later, he cleaned them out again.

Poor planning all around, and now we all have to pay the price for poor planning.