10 Days Pay Price For RCMP Beating? One Man's Opinion

Thursday, September 20, 2007 03:45 AM

Ten days pay for two off duty RCMP officers who decided to beat up a few folks when they left a bar , lied about where they were stationed and then used their position when an investigating RCMP officer was sent to the scene, just doesn’t cut it.

If we are going to have police forces complain that the judges in the country are not stiff enough in the sentences, then they had better listen to what they are saying.

One of the officers received a conditional discharge for his part in the assaults. Hopefully someone has come along to see the matter will get to the civil court.

It adds another black mark to the RCMP.

Judge Ramsay sits in jail, at least one officer escaped the net when it was ruled by the RCMP they had waited too long to have a disciplinary hearing. That hearing was for the same kind of conduct for which Ramsay is serving a 7 year sentence.

You must be careful to say that the officer in question (who was stationed in Prince George at the time of the alleged misconduct) was never criminally charged with any offence related to the matter.

To add insult to injury in the case of the liquored up Mounties who roughed up some citizens, not even the Mayor of that community was told that one of the RCMP officers that his city hired had been charged with a criminal offence.

If that wasn’t enough, the RCMP did not release the details of the "10 day without pay penalty" until such time as the media dug it out.

Ask yourself this, would the RCMP be happy if two men, trained in fighting, assaulted three police officers received a penalty of ten days without pay?

I’m Meisner and that’s one man’s opinion

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Posted on Thursday, September 20, 2007 03:45 AM in Views by Ben Meisner

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Comments

Posted by: Truth on September 20 2007 5:13 AM

One of the cops enjoyed a stay of proceedings. Both were given months of cozy office work, prior to Crown disposition.

http://www.cknw.com/news/news_local.cfm?cat=74281417912&rem=64383&red=801141723aPBIny&wids=410&gi=1&gm=news_local.cfm

How about a Surrey cop being acquitted, even though he was videotaped inflicting an injurious kick to a head to a captive. The prostrate suspect wasn't co-operating because he was writhing in agony with a do bite. The judge was a former Deputy Regional Crown Counsel; they are cop friendly.

http://www.provincialcourt.bc.ca/judgments/pc/2005/01/p05_0188.htm

Then there was the Donovan Tait case - decided by another former Deputy Regional Crown Counsel, where a cop broke the jaw of a handcuffed suspect.
http://www.provincialcourt.bc.ca/judgments/pc/2005/02/p05_0273.htm

Both cop cases were unique in that the cops were allowed to continue police duties after being charged. Tait moved to another police service so that he wouldn't have to serve desk duties. Williams remained on full police service, with no restriction on use of his service revolver.

Posted by: pisspulper on September 20 2007 7:14 AM

Truth, once again you have linked us to death and provided no opinion. There are no details of the Maple Ridge case here. So what's your point? In the case against Williams, i agree with the judge's ascertion. Seems a very reasonable reaction. As for a restriction on use of his service revolver, i see no evidence that a revolver was even unholstered or discharged. Tait himself pleaded guilty, acknowledges his mistake and has dealt with the civil matter. Perhaps frustration and over-reaction are sometimes justified when dealing with criminals and idiots. The officers know fully well the repeat offenders and the weak judicial system that put these yard apes back on the street in mere hours. Truth, how would you react if i spat on your face and humiliated you in front of your family and friends. I bet you'd unholster your laptop and barrage me with links until i finally submit in defeat. No i don't condone using excessive force, police officers are civilians after the uniform comes off, have families and lives like everyone else, they aren't perfect robotic defenders of justice. Sometimes s--t happens.

Posted by: snappi on September 20 2007 7:49 AM

Absolutely correct as usual Ben, and no the RCMP certainly wouldn't be happy if they were assaulted by a kick boxer either. Once again people in power get away vertually scott free. Just like the RCMP that were accused of abuse along with Ramsey. We haven't heard much about that either. Did they or didn't they? If so why haven't they been charged? I believe that if the RCMP or anyone else in a position of power want to behave like mere civilians, they should be penalized as such.

Posted by: metalman on September 20 2007 9:03 AM

Come on you guys, don't you remember there are multiple 'justice' systems in CANADA? You have your common one, for the average taxpaying bloke, another for the aboriginal first nations persons, and yet another for the friends of the court (cops, lawyers, judges, family members of same) Don't tell me I am wrong, I have seen this with my own eyes. I am speaking in general terms of course, for there are exceptions, such as the Judge Ramsey case.
I agree that cops need to have a personal life, but that is NO excuse for the kind of off duty behaviour reported above. Our professional police force is expected to be above that kind of misbehaving on or off duty, after all, they have power of arrest when off duty, do they not?
metalamn.

Posted by: Buzz on September 20 2007 9:14 AM

Pisspulper: well said! (and your line about "barrage me with links" was hilarious!)

Posted by: heidi1555 on September 20 2007 10:48 AM

Two members that look like ticking time bombs. Hopefully they learned their lesson from this small baby finger tap on the wrist punishment.
This is what I read the other day:
http://www.canada.com/nationalpost/news/story.html?id=93d8414a-7272-472b-bfc2-c43a1894ebf1&k=61961

Posted by: pisspulper on September 20 2007 2:14 PM

Thanks Heidi for the LINK. I was in no way defending theses officers, just didn't have any facts. And yes they got off very light, but doesn't everyone. Also thanks Buzz, i'm still reeling over that one myself. Only clowning around Truth.

Posted by: Truth on September 20 2007 4:09 PM

The Province has been running a laughable daily series on "thugs," for Neanderthals who move their lips when their read. For equal time purposes, they should do one on "slugs" or cops.

The average cop delivers 1 conviction per unit per month.

As for the BS about getting "thugs" off the streets: the average cop serves to incarcerate 1 offender per unit per year.

Cops unfound most substantiable crime complaints that come before them.

The work product of slugs is: slime.

Posted by: dgdiggler on September 20 2007 6:12 PM

Oh yes Heidi 1555 they must be ticking time bombs like that St. Arnaud guy.

Posted by: dgdiggler on September 20 2007 6:14 PM

And Ben, 10 days pay is over 2,000 dollars so it's quite a lot more of a fine then they would receive in court. So they're feeling it.

Posted by: heidi1555 on September 21 2007 7:12 AM

Well then it's lucky two on duty officers didn't come and shoot them dead!

Posted by: heidi1555 on September 21 2007 7:15 AM

They're feeling it like a punch in the face?

Posted by: diplomat on September 21 2007 11:39 AM

http://www.cbc.ca/canada/story/2007/09/21/rcmp-audit.html?ref=rss

Not very encouraging if true, to say the least.

Posted by: northman on September 21 2007 3:07 PM

If you want to act like a juvenile idiot on your off time and get a holiday for it looks like the RCMP is the organization to work for.

Posted by: heidi1555 on September 21 2007 6:23 PM

Yes, they're not as stupid as they must've looked that night. Getting paid for that behaviour is just plain crazy! It's like working in a department store and shoplifting on your 15 min. coffee break...get caught by boss and have them say,"Oh no Heidi here take the size medium instead!It will fit you much better! I'm taking off early so i'll say now have a good long weekend and see you on your next shift come thursday...don't forget payday friday!!!!"
Is that what this world is coming to? Also, how often are the RCMP tested for steriods and that sort of thing? It's a fair question.

Posted by: heidi1555 on September 21 2007 6:59 PM

I should say that when I said "Getting paid" it's because I feel 10 days is nothing. Will they have trouble collecting change at the grocery store? Doubt it. Will their heat be cut off? Doubt it. Their backs are covered all too well. I'm afraid this is something the officers involved are probably literally laughing at and they were given the message that doing what they did isn't serious.

Posted by: trollunderthebridge on September 21 2007 7:04 PM

Awesome comparison as usual Heidi.They test the police for steroids every week I think. Seriously though, your hatred for the folks in red serge is getting kind of old.The folks that run this website can't stand them either.There must be better things to talk about.

Posted by: heidi1555 on September 21 2007 11:24 PM

Why were you put on desk duty troll? And what can I say about my comparison besides that I was tired. If you're smart then you'd get sarcastic me. It's some of the bodies that fill the red I HAD hatred for....I chose to stop hating for my kids sake. Feel bad for their mothers for any upsets. Love and respect the honest ones and always have. According to this article what is the better thing to talk about? I'd love to have a face to face debate with you... Can't teach an old dog new tricks I know but at least you can get him to stop hu!!ing your leg. Sorry still tired I guess.

Posted by: heidi1555 on September 22 2007 7:14 PM

Well dkdiggler maybe I shouldn't have said "ticking time bombs". I do feel people are transformed when handed power though. Get that rush of excitement and get caught up in it. Can you tell me what things are said to people in training to get them mentally ready? Maybe that's an area to look at also? A total transformation would be nice to see. Would like to get in touch with my sisters friend who recently went through training after being a sheriff for a few years.

Posted by: dgdiggler on September 22 2007 10:15 PM

Heidi : its not "what" is said to people in training , nor is it what is taught in the training. There is also the possibility that most people now a days in training may be a tad too young with very little in the way of life experience in relation to the police powers they are empowered with once they get out into the real world. RCMP training does impart assertiveness and some of the boys who go out when off duty to unwind simply forget or don't realise that the rcmp code of conduct governs their off duty conduct as well as their on duty conduct.
The RCMP is very short staffed these days and experienced members are retiring faster than the RCMP can hire them...hence many younger people are applying. The interview process and the background checks etc can and do weed out unsuitable applicants but sometimes it is just unknown how someone will perform once they are out there.....

Posted by: dgdiggler on September 22 2007 10:23 PM

Put it this way Heidi: I don't know what you do for a living, but if you were on days off from work, went out to the bar, got a little drunk and boisterous and started a fight with someone..etc...
Now, when you head back to work on monday your boss tells you you can't work there because he found out you were causing trouble on your own free time. How would you react to that?

Posted by: dgdiggler on September 22 2007 10:34 PM

And Ben, in future why don't you state rcmp management instead of just rcmp. The guy patrolling your street or catching the guy who just broke into crazy willies ( remember when?) is a different cat from upper management who make all the big decisions.