I can't wait for the day when a viable alternative to fossil fuel is found and marketed. It'll be nice to see the oil companies begging and pleading for customers after what they've done to us.

I fully agree with you Ben. As I have stated before, I wonder when the tanker-trucks will be escorted to their destinations under armed guard. Do you think Big Oil will sit up and take notice that maybe they have finally gone too far when a few of these truckloads are given away for free?? Come on people, there has to be a way for us to fight back. It's getting high time for a revolution!

I agree Ben!
I also think that the "demand" issue is largely a greed driven method of socking it to us.
Fun with numbers.
I believe that SOME of what we are seeing IS in fact justified,but not all of it and anyone who buys into the rhetoric may also be in the market to buy a bridge.
A large part of the pricing structure is just that...greed and spin by the producers and the retailers as well.
Looking at the profits just announced by the different oil companies more or less verifies that!
And when we tear hell out of the oil companies here in Canada,it IS important to remember that this oil IS coming from crown land, which is an asset that belongs to the canadian people!
And let's not forget our federal and provincial governments who have also decided to reap the profits at the expense of the taxpayers!
What our elected leaders have actually said to the oil barons is... just see that we get lots of dough and we will keep our mouths shut... while you do whatever you want!
They BOTH need their collective asses kicked and WE need to rattle some political cages.
The government's hands-off attitude regarding the oil companies has gotten very stale indeed!

C'mon guys, you know what the whole thing is all about, it is greed, pure and simple.
Love of money, and power over the unwashed masses, that is what these people live for.
RUEZ; we're getting there, slow but sure.
GAMBY;ever watch the aussie movie Mad Max?
A/freeze; Correct, the government could have legislated against Big Oil reaping obscene profits, after all, the oil (should) belongs to us, the taxpayers. Too late now.
metalman.

The government wont stop the greed while there getting there share

Although the oil, coal and natural gas in the ground belong to us, the people, we sell the rights to look for them, find them, extract them, refine them, market them...the government collects taxes and royalties...but as the final consumers we are allowed to pay the price that is fixed by the oil moguls and the stock market speculators!

Maybe the Mexicans (the government owns the resource, does all the refining and distribution and collects all the profits - gasoline is cheaper in Mexico) and Hugo Chavez in Venezuela weren't so stupid when they refused to relinquish everything to the oil barons?

Good one on the Mad Max reference metalman!
It may be just a movie,but someone had some insightful and serious thoughts on where we were heading!
And when you stop to consider it,the world is already fighting "wars" and killing people over oil!
They just call it fighting for "democracy" now!

"It'll be nice to see the oil companies begging and pleading" ....????

They are investing their money in new technologies, so they can continue to profit ..... look at them more as energy companies rather than oil companies.....

http://www.shell.com/home/content/shellsolar/news_and_library/press_releases/2006/energy_challenge_0202.html

If you have a successful business, it is typically worth while to diversify it into areas which have some association with your key product so that you develop resilience for the time when that key product morphes into an associatied product.

Note that they are working with China to help develop wind energy there ....... I wonder what plans for joint development our contingent is putting into their back pocket to descuss with the Chinese ....

The reason for high food prices: BioFuels - food is now being grown not for food but for fuel - largely driven by the US Bio-Fuel market - increasing the cost of grain to go into gas tanks.

Oil companies making profits?? Well - the last time I checked we live in a capitalist society. Oil prices are driven by the market - what the market will bare is what we are all willing to pay. Are we to let oil fall into government hands and be regulated by them? I think that would be a way worse alternative than what we have now - they have to decrease in price eventually - its simple economics.

HEY!!! Let us start a revolution! But I will have to pass on this one. I have to go to work tomorrow. Drat!

While it is a fact that oil companies are there to make a profit it is also a fact that oil is a global commodity, and one which is absolutely necessary (at this point ) for the wellbeing of the people of every country of the world. As such , it can well be argued that some controls on the price of fuel (and thus profits of oil companies) would be ethical and should be implemented.
In the west it is our own fault if we have to pay more for fuel, as we seem to use it at the same rate rerardless of the price. I am a big fuel user (out of necessity) but i do cut down on my fuel use as the price increases. My experieces in Vancouver and elsewhere with the near empty commuter lanes suggest that there are options for others to reduce their fuel consumption when the price goes up.
THere are people in other parts of the world who do not have such options and are faced with faced with economic hardship (the real kind, as opposed to canadian hardship) or even starvation when they cannot afford fuel or fertilizer to produce or move food. As well, the promotion of biofuels as a way to ease our enviro-guilt while burning as much fuel as we can has increased the prices of grains all over the world. While it may be laudable to worry about global warming, biofuels are causing hardship now.
The global issues around oil pricing and supply and the effect of bio fuels on world hunger are mirrors for what is going on with virtually every commodity in the world. Our willingness to buy commodities, regardless of price (esp. the chinese these days) drives up the prices. However, for some reason this doesnt result in better living standards in poor countries who supply commodities or labour. Worse yet, those countries without oil or mineral wealth must compete for these things in order to survive.
One does not have to look far to see the problem with supply and demand models in actual practice. WHile the price of fule , feed and fertilizer all went up drastically last year, the price of beef at auction was down at least 25 percent from what is was the year before, and more like 35 percent from what is was several years ago, when beef at the store was cheaper. Feedlot buyers were not willing to pay much since they were facing increased fuel and feed costs and could not expect the slaughterhouse buyers to be willing to pay more than last year. For the most part this was due to the fact that most of canadian beff is STILL shipped to the US for cutting and then shipped back to us. With the US dollar devalued against ours the prices for the feedlots were expected to be low.
Macleans magasine and others have reported that beef prices are going to hurt. This is likely so. As we have learned, headlines about commodity prices have a way of making it to our bottom line (witness the gas price increase immediately after oil first hit 100 dollars, even though it would be weeks before that expensive oil was processed). SO when the price of beef increases who got the extra profit? Not the farmer, probably not the local feedlot. SO, when the price of gas goes through the roof, who benefits? Not the farmers, and probably not the people in a lot of the oil producing countries.

We will sit around talk about whine and cry about the high cost of fuel and in the end we will do nothing. We will expect the dead and dying to do it all for us.

We deserve the high cost of fuel. We are suckers for punishment. In Prince George we are just a small USA. The forest industry is dead and we sit on our butts and waite for a government bail out. When the mortgage companies forclose on your homes maybe then you will see the world around you.

For Gods sake wake up its time we pulled the switch and stoppedd exporing our natural resources and the PROFITS. In Eastern Canada Buzz Hargrove is eating crow as the big auto industry find that they are also in a bind. They kept building trucks and SUV's like there is no tomorrow while the foreign car builders took over the market in smaller vehicles.

We are stuupid stupid stupid we think the glory days will go on forever.

Cheers

As long as I get my cheque twice a month, I don't care. Sums it up, don't it?

But have you camping in a Honda with two adults three kids and all your gear plus pulling the boat,or gone to home depot and bought lumber.Sometimes owning a small car just isn't practical for some folk.

oops!bad grammar.

Bridge: "In Eastern Canada Buzz Hargrove is eating crow as the big auto industry find that they are also in a bind. They kept building trucks and SUV's like there is no tomorrow while the foreign car builders took over the market in smaller vehicles."

Actually, you are picking on the wrong guy! I heard him say years ago that the bosses should design and build vehicles that the customers wish to buy! The Union has never had a say in those decisions! Most of the small cars that Ford and GM sell at the moment are imported from Asian subsidiaries of Ford and GM.

The Canadian workers are in a bind, but Ford and GM would be just as happy if all their vehicles were made in countries where the weekly pay is about the same as a daily wage in Canada!

And if it came to the crunch of survival or else that is exactly what they would do!

Diplomat, I should explain, Buzz Hargrove is a victem like all of us. He did what he had to to keep the guys working. Buzz is a very inteligent person and like you say he saw the writing on the wall.

The Economist has an artical in this months issue on how Fiat turned their Corpoation around and this was possible because they involved their workers in the rebuilding of their operation. And can you imagine who it was that accomplished this with the Italian work force that is volitile most of the time.

The CEO that got things right was a do somrthing Canadian. So lets get our shit together with the oil companies and do something about the high price of fuel.

Cheers

I still like the idea that someone was circulating around the e-mail circuits; to boycott two major producers, they suggest Shell and PetroCan. Of course I don't hand my pound of flesh and 1st born to Shell and pee can anyway, so it is easy for me.
Thhe idea is sound I think, but how do you ever get enough folks to participate so that the Poobaws would even notice? I don't know.
metalman.

Boycott as many producers as you wish. You are only shifting money. The amount of oil taken out of the ground remains unchanged. The amount pushed through piplines remains unchanged. The amount refined remains unchanged, as does the amount delivered to gas tanks at gas stations.

The only real change that will make a difference is a total reduction in gas use. So, everyone reduce the total purchased by at least 10% and preferrably 25%.

An afterthought. Rather than a negative boycott approach, how about a postive support approach. Do some research.

Find out which oil company spends the highest proportion of their earnings in reinvesting not only in explorations, but also in researching and developing alternative energies and creating an infrastructure to deliver them. Support those companies and buy product from those companies and give them and others the reason why you are supporting them rather than others.

In other words, become part of the solution rather than part of the problem.

It's largely consumer driven. We're the ones who LOVE our daily drivers that get 10-15 MPG. We're the ones who LOVE 350 hp in a 1/2 ton, when 200 was perfectly adequate 15 years ago. We're the ones who crave 200 hp outboards when 90's were the norm for many years.

There are choices that people can make to reduce the amount of gas they use (and thus impact the demand), but most of us choose not to because we are creatures of habit. We like the rumble of a V8. We like the Hemi badges on the side of the truck. We like the smell of a diesel (well some people do . . . LOL). We like mowing our lawn every 2 days because it makes our yard look better. We use snowblowers instead of a shovel. We warm our cars up for 20 minutes in the winter before getting in, when gloves and a scarf would accomplish the same thing. We let our cars idle while we run into Mr. G for a pop. It goes on and on and on.

I'd hazard a guess that every single person on Opinion 250 COULD reduce the amount of gas they used if they tried. That's the only way I can ever see the price going down and it's the only way it will end up costing you and I less. We have to reduce the demand.

Well said Bridge! Hargrove is a good man!

When GM, Ford and Chrysler build pickup trucks they make mega profits on each vehicle. When they build small cars they take as long to put together as a truck but they can't make even one third of the profit on those compared to pickup trucks.

They also managed to have trucks excluded from the mandated fuel economy goals for cars set long ago by the government.

Pushing a pickup truck down the road means overcoming a wind resistance equal to a couple of sheets of plywood facing flat against the wind.

The shape of a truck, the high cab, the big box, the exposed frame underneath all contribute to make it have a very poor coefficient of drag compared to a lower to the ground and streamlined car.

Result: Gas guzzlers.

Absolutely right diplomat!

Hugo Chavez has it right?
Nationalize our oil and gas?
Buzz Hargrove is a good man?

Sounds like the communist party may have a
chance at power.

dow7500, you are a riot! The fifties used the commie scare for anything new and different!

This is 2008 and one of the West's biggest trading partner is...hang on to your seat...Communist China!

Is anybody still scared by *Communism*? No, as long as the merchandise is cheap enough!

I sure wish we owned our own resources, like the Mexicanos! Is Mexico communist? Or Venezuela? Or Buzz Hargrove?

McCarthy is still alive, apparently...like Elvis!

Cheers!

Everyone knows the price of gas goes up in the spring. If you have been watching there have also been several attempts to bump it up from individual stations. The fact is that they will charge what they can get away with. If we cut our fuel consumption by 10, 20 , 30 percent it will not reduce the price of gas as they will still be able to raise the price without causing a direct reduction in use. LEts face it, they would rather sell you 1000 litres at 1.75 than 2000 at 1.00. It is a balancing act, getting the optimum profit while keeping us from getting mad. If we get mad we will cut down our fuel use for a while . Theres the important bit. We cut down use in the short term as a reaction, but pick up our use after prices fall. If we react to big price increases then the oil companies actually lose money. If we make it clear that we will cut our use as a response to the spring price gouge ( and only return to normal use when the price drops we will have shifted gasoline from an essential (thus best regulated) to a semi luxury, with us having some control over pricing.

We already nationalized our oil and gas, Petro Canada that used to be Gulf Canada.

It really does not matter what efforts are made to economize our fuel consumption. The fact of the matter is that we have wasted almost all of this precious resource by living in a suburban environment that forces us to drive to work, play, shopping.
What we need to do is cut the natural gas lines to our home, implying we need an alternate heating source. and we need to mandate that ALL new buildings whether residential or commercial have some generating capacity. We also need to create a reward system to encourage existing building be modified in a like manner. This will not replace the power supplied by BC hydro, but will help a lot.
We need to live closer to work so we can walk.
We need shopping centers to be smaller and in more location so we can walk.
We also need to force ALL auto makers to build alternative to fossil fueled vehicles.

Loki: "We already nationalized our oil and gas, Petro Canada that used to be Gulf Canada.'

Starting from about 1990 on it has been gradually sold and privatized.

"In his 2004 federal budget, Finance Minister Ralph Goodale pledged to sell the government's remaining stake in the company and by the end of the year it had sold its 19% stake, 49 million shares in all, for net proceeds of $3.2 billion. As of June, 2007 the company's largest shareholders were Capital Research and Management Company (a Capital Group company), with 7.3%, and Barclays, with 4%."

You can see that there is no more government ownership of any part of Petro Canada.

It's a trickle down effect. It's taking toll on other buisness such as RV, boating, snowmobiling, quads, anything that has to do with fuel. Some of the dealers are seeing buisness disappear while big oil just gets richer.

Basically big oil has control of almost everything ie food prices, furniture, appliances and so on. All these items have to be delivered and trucked around. Truckers have to raise their rates to make up for high fuel costs and retailers have to up their price for delivery. Meanwhile the oil barons live like kings. Well on second thought, I guess they are kings and queens.

Pretty soon we will alll be staying home and holiday travel will be for the rich only. An overnighter in Hixon will be our holiday for the year.

Do the math.
Canada supplies a hugh portion of the crude oil used by the USA. We read about the backlash in the USA about gasoline prices reaching $3.60 a US gallon. I would be pleased to only pay $3.60 per gallon. Given there are 3.78 liters in a US gallon this means our American neighbours are paying about $1.00 per liter for gasoline made from Canadian crude.
The only conclusion I can come to is our our federal and provincial governments are feasting on the dollars we pay at the pumps.
Don't you just love the announcements by Bond, Rustad, and company about all the wonderful things the provincial government is doing in our city with provincial government funds at no cost to the city taxpayer. Last time I checked the taxpayers whether and individual or business contribute to the provincial coffers in abundant amounts. Of course maybe I am wrong and our local liberal continguent just go out to the money tree in Victoria and pluck another million or so to refill the till.

Resident:"Don't you just love the announcements by Bond, Rustad, and company about all the wonderful things the provincial government is doing in our city with provincial government funds at no cost to the city taxpayer."

Yeah, I love them. Is it possible they mean that that these funds are contributed and they don't show up on our individual property tax bills as the tax increases mandated by City Hall do? If the government doesn't give us something out of the provincial coffers it will just give it to some other town which asks for it more vigorously than we do?

Since that money will be spend in any case why not be happy that it was spent here in P.G.?

I hope that there will be more announcements soon to help us deal with some of our broken down infrastructure.

Maybe you are right diplomat. If the liberals are going to spend our tax dollars it may as well be in our town.

My only other thought would be to leave the tax dollars in our pocket and let us do the spending in PG.

Given the waste of tax payers dollars pumping more water into the Nechako this winter and the 7 years spent on a community energy system and if it is ever built will cost us tax payers millions, I am not sure I can afford "BIG BROTHER" looking after me any longer.

Maybe we could raise some funds by having a city to city (i.e. PG and Kamloops), competition to see who has the most, biggest, and deepest pot holes. My bet is on PG hands down. Our elected public officials could use the winning of the competition in their election propaganda next November.