I dont like Carol James but i the like Axe The Gas Tax idea..

As far as I'm concerned, this price of gas can keep on going up and up. We'll be paying more for our products, because almost everything that we buy, has to be delivered by something that burns fossil fuel.

Eventually, there will be some upheaval in society, because we can't afford the things we actually need (like food, and products to clothe us, and put a roof over our head), and something will come along which offers a better way to fuel our transportation, be it bio-something, solar-something, hydrogen-electric combination, or something completely different than what we've heard is on the horizon. Then we might see some solution to climate change.

This NDP whining is annoying. Carole offers nothing that you won't hear in your neighbourhood pub or coffee shop on the corner. I look for more than that from a person who wants to lead our province. Get your party to do some research on some alternatives, Carole, rather than go for a little sound-bite in the news services, which doesn't serve any purpose.

Irregardless of what I've written, the price of gas hasn't changed comparative to the value of an oz. of gold in the past fifty years. Price of a barrel of light sweet crude oil is in American dollars; that currency has weakened so OPEC has raised the price so that they still get what they had bargained for a couple years ago.

I would like to see our major North American automobile manufacturers build vehicles with efficient diesel engines, which can easily deliver 50 mpg, with very little emissions. And algae based bio-diesel (not from food crops) is right on the horizon, just needs some investment to get the production costs down a bit. Even without that, I can happily drive a 3 yr old VW Passat around getting 50 mpg without trying too hard - a bit more if I drive like an old man :-) I'm looking forward to seeing VW's North American release the end of this year, for their new diesel models.

Of course this will be a battle between the leaders of both parties, regarding gas taxes, but any other leader for this province can not be worse than Ol' Gordo and his goons.

Empty political grand standing. Business as usual for the NDP.

What upsets me to no end is that British Columbians are the only people on earth that has to pay for what humans are doing to the planet?????!!!! What about the other billions of people? What about the rest of Canada if nothing else. It is just another way for the provincial government to help themselves to our choking middle class people's money with another tax grab in the name of saving our planet. Now the natural gas and hydro companies are whining for more money. Food prices and shortages. High gas prices. Losses of jobs due to it. It is not going to end people. Say hello to the beginning of the end of the middle class. Back to the old English rule of taxing the chit out of the poor so that the glutenous riche can squander selfishly.

Long before she realized it was fashionable to be against the tax, I had already announced it's demise in my hands.
We have also got a plan to enlist students in BC's colleges and technical institutions to find the alternatives to these fuels. Something nobody currently has answers for.
I even have a letter for the Suzuki Foundation from some time back when I asked them for alternatives to our carbon based fuels. Guess what? THEY DON'T HAVE ANSWERS EITHER.
Mike Summers, Vanderhoof.

From the NDP website:"New Democrats believe that what we need to do is make big corporations pay for their pollution while providing tools to help ordinary people cut their fuel use, rather than hitting consumers with a tax at the pump while letting big polluters off the hook."

Big corporations will pass any new expenses on to the consumer. Result: Price increases at the pump.

Back to square one.

O.k., don't keep it a secret: What are the *tools* you are going to provide to help *ordinary* people (I'm one of those ordinary ones) cut their fuel use? Free smaller cars? Gasoline rationing? Ban pickups, SUVs and vans?

Who ARE the big polluters that are being *let off the hook* on purpose?

Name them, please! Maybe we can boycott them or drag them into court. Who is letting them off the hook? The federal government? How is the province going to have an influence on that?

I like what beesknees is saying. If gasoline becomes ever more expensive consumption will decrease, pollution will decrease, people will stop buying gas guzzlers and companies will develop more fuel efficient vehicles and completely new technologies that will eliminate the need for carbon based fuels for vehicles altogether.

Gordon is on the right track. It will be up to the consumers (they are the final consumers and pay at the pump) to make the right decisions which will be beneficial to them and for our future.

Lowering the price of gasoline is not a long term solution.

It is just empty political grand standing.

The Liberals are masters of deceit. Bribe us with a $100; stick us with another tax cloaked in a "good for the environment" disguise.
Got to pay the massive 2010 cost somehow.

Hitting the large polluting mega-corporation polluters in the pocket and making them responsible for the costs of their pollution is not necessarily a hit on the Canadian consumer. Most of the large corporations involved are US based, so it would merely reduce the amount of Canadian profits transferred out of our country and into theirs.

The increase in oil costs is going into someone's pockets anyway, and that money is available somewhere in the world. It doesn't just disappear into infinite space, it goes into someone's bank account, probably in corporate America, because the underlying cause of the current increased costs in oil are due to the wars started by George Bush, and the primary oil producers tend to be US or UK owned.

There is, in fact, a fairly benign method of raising enough money to pay for nearly all increased tax needs without hitting the regular person in the pcocket book. It has even been endorsed by a previous Canadian Parliament. It is a small (very small) tax on international currency trading. There is so much money traded around the world that tiny tax rates would raise literally billions of dollars. Put that in effect.

A carbon tax in BC does nothing. And giving us $100 dollars of our own money the year before an election is an insult. The last government to try it got slaughtered. With luck, it will happen again.

As to who these polluter are, well, who owned the Exxon Valdez? Who are the mining companies who want 16 Canadian lakes turned into pools of acid leechate just to keep their costs down?

Posted by: Death to Socialism on June 17 2008 1:29 PM
Empty political grand standing. Business as usual for the NDP.


Typical politics in BC with all parties.
Business as usual for all BC political parties.
They're all the same. No damn good.

If any one thinks for one second that having a gas tax rescinded will lower transportation costs (fuel price), they are sadly mistaken.
The price of fuel does have a large levy element in it but it is the fuel suppliers that will set the final price.
It is still a free market demand economy where the market will charge what the market will bear.
With Peak Oil http://www.theoildrum.com/ now getting the attention of the media and various levels of government, the problem is already here and to such a point as to be unavoidable.
If you need to lower your transportation costs, start walking.
Our entire economy is based on suckers, oops consumers, paying sticker price on every thing and also having a need to buy all these luxuries.
If you want to lower your cost of living, quite being a North American consumer and buy into living a frugal life style such as the Europeans and Chinese. Walk to work and maximize any trips in the internal combustion vehicle

NDP never did and never will move BC in the correct direction. lets not forget the destructive path they led us down last time.....

lostfaith - my point being that no amount of names on a petition will make a govt back off a decision (remember the GST?) & James knows this. Hence, grandstanding & nothing more. This is not a news story, it's a partisan sound bite. Why report it?

Ammonra:"As to who these polluter are, well, who owned the Exxon Valdez? Who are the mining companies who want 16 Canadian lakes turned into pools of acid leechate just to keep their costs down?"

Agreed! And who is extracting the oil from the tarsands? What does any of this have to do with Gordon Campbell, the BC Liberals, the BC (!) NDP and the carbon tax and the efforts to axe it? And, not to forget, how do the the upcoming 2010 Winter Olympics have anything to do with any of this and why do people keep hammering away at that which is an unchangeable committment?

I suggest to do what I did, namely to send a letter to the Prime Minister who does not blame Alberta's tarsands industry for any pollution whatsoever. He also thinks Kyoto is a joke.

Ask him if he knows that the tarsands development all by itself made it impossible for the previous federal Liberals to meet any Kyoto reductions.

How does Carole James connect any of this federal stuff to the local B.C. government? It is a political snow job.

"Typical politics in BC with all parties.
Business as usual for all BC political parties.
They're all the same. No damn good"

Only, some are worse than no damn good, as a whole decade of mismanagement is too soon forgotten and too conveniently swept under the carpet.

Pollution does not respect international nor interprovincial boundaries. Do you remember the acid rain of many years ago? Pollution in one place can and does have in impact in other places, including BC.

Why attack the Olympic Games? I don't know, perhaps the cost or perhaps it is just a convenient target. If you check all my posts you will note that I have never commented on it as a political issue. You may also note that the NDP does not attack the games themselves, just the financial mismanagement of the Liberal Government associated with them.

You shouldn't be too harsh on the Liberals for their decade of mismanagement. It came about as a result of a fixation on helping their corporate friends. At least in the last few months they have apparently seen the light to a small degree. There is hope for them yet. A term or two in opposition may buck their ideas up. It worked for the NDP, and they are ready to assume the reins again.

Its interesting to read all the comments relating to the up coming carbon tax and to wonder where the people making the comments are living. Those in the lower mainland and those who have access to to transit systems are quite free to suggest that we walk or ride the buses, etc. To me that forth the statement "north of Hope, beyond Hope" which is the attitude of most individuals in the lower mainland.

Enough of that however, I haven't yet heard someone suggest that co2 is not the cause of global warming, in fact few comments have been made regarding the fact that we are having what can be termed a normal spring. The global warming scam is perpetrated upon all of the world by a few who will and are making huge profits from promoting the cap in trade process.

I have referred the readers to this site several times with no responses either way to the following web site: www.icecap.us

I urge all of you to check out the information on that and other related sites. Politicians grab on to anything that is currently popular to the electorate and Al Gore has done an admirable job of making co2 emissions the main cause of global warming. There are two questions to this. 1. Is global warming really occuring? and 2. If it is, what is the real cause?

The Chinese are going to abandon their bicycles and start to purchase and drive more automobiles in the future. And our governments want us out of our cars and guess what? Ride bicycles. Strange unforeseen turn of events. I think it is a conspiracy started by the bicycle manufacturers of Canada.

"You shouldn't be too harsh on the Liberals for their decade of mismanagement."

Actually I was referring to the BC NDP decade of the Nineties...nice try by you to deflect the criticism to where it doesn't belong.

Two terms nowadays add up to eight years, not ten as before. (A decade means ten years).

I didn't say that you personally are always referring to the Olympics, but there are so many posts that do lay the blame for everything (and I mean everything) on the Olympics that I get the feeling that there must be a well co-ordinated campaign strategy at work already.

"...does have in impact in other places, including BC."

Then, I would suggest that James contact Layton to do something about it at the federal level rather than point fingers at B.C. provincial politicians who, by the way, may be doing the same thing already, meaning that others are also trying to get Ottawa on board.

Layton keeps supporting the Conservatives no matter what, so they probably don't take any criticism from him too seriously!

He only votes against them when there is no danger of the government being defeated! Very brave approach, but obviously transparently spineless.

Gee...politics! What a bunch of fools we are to allow ourselves to be ruled by a bunch of even bigger fools!

Quote from getajob:"NDP never did and never will move BC in the correct direction. lets not forget the destructive path they led us down last time....."

Amen to that.

Hell of a fine idea, but it will never happen, Campbell wants his money. Teresan gas just got their increase, that will cost us about 140 bucks more per year. In the interior it went up something like 14%. In the Peace 17% but strange enough no rate hike in the Lower Mainland or on the Island. And of course the "Carbon Tax"

To rvuser, there is no doubt global warming is taking place. There is incontrovertible evidence that mean annual temperatures are increasing. In addition, there are disruptions of the normal weather patterns. The vast majority of climatologists agree that the available data supports that.

Most of those climatologists also agree that greenhouse gas emissions are responsible, predominantly carbon dioxide. Disagree with them and accept the views of a very small minority if you wish, but even if you do the annual mean temperatures are still rising.

What does that mean? It means that global warming is taking place. The only area of dispute is why. The small minority say it is due to normal sun fluctuations, so the earth is warming up. The vast majority say it is greenhouse gas driven.

The point is that both groups accept there is a rise in annual mean temperatures. Global warming is here, the only disagreement is why.

It all comes down to the olympics and all the war we are involved in.
Somebody has to pay for it, somehow.

If anyone thinks our world governments are not working together to empty our bank accounts to pay for their wars and other BS they carry on with around the world.
You better think again.

Remember, you are all sheep.

This price fixing story taken from another site.

MONTREAL — After clamping down on a network of gasoline cartels in Quebec for price-fixing, the federal Competition Bureau says it is continuing to investigate whether other Canadians are also getting scammed at the pump.

Criminal charges laid Thursday against 13 people and 11 companies for allegedly fixing gasoline prices in Quebec are the first in Canada since 1955.

Three companies, including Ultramar Ltd., pleaded guilty and were fined a total of $2 million, while a former Ultramar employee received a $50,000 fine.

Competition officials are promising to find out the answer to a question on the minds of thousands of Canadians as gas prices continue to climb: How widespread is price-fixing in the industry?

"We follow the gas market very closely," bureau commissioner Sheridan Scott told a news conference in Montreal as she announced the various criminal charges.

"I can assure you that the Competition Bureau will not hesitate to take action to stop price fixing in this industry."

Ultramar, the only major oil company being investigated, was slapped with a $1.85-million fine after acknowledging its role.

"This is one of the top fines that we have been able to attain for domestic cartels," Scott said.

She stressed there was no evidence that Ultramar’s head office was directly involved in the cartel.

"This is obviously a regrettable situation that we deplore," Christian Houle, Ultramar motorist sales network vice-president, said in a statement.

The other accused companies are mainly local franchisees operating under the banner of such recognizable brands as Esso and Shell.

Les Petroles Therrien Inc., operating under the Petro-T banner, and Distributions Petrolieres Therrien were fined a combined $179,000.

Jacques Ouellet, an Ultramar employee who has since left the company, was fined $50,000.

Consumer groups speculated the charges will only feed long-simmering suspicions of widespread collusion among gasoline retailers.

"I think this story will boost the anger of consumers regarding the price of gasoline," said Charles Tanguay, spokesman for a Quebec association of 11 consumer protection groups.

Tanguay added some of the fleeced clients will likely resort to a class-action lawsuit to attempt to recoup some of their money.

Scott indicated the companies charged represented only a fraction of the total number of stations that took part in the various cartels that operated in Thetford Mines, Victoriaville, Magog and Sherbrooke.

Carol thinks she can get some votes coming her way because of this carbon tax thing.
I doubt it. She's dreaming.
The lower mainland is booming and that's where the votes are.

Ammonra wrote "The increase in oil costs is going into someone's pockets anyway, and that money is available somewhere in the world."

Do these places look like the places the money is available in?

http://www.flickr.com/photos/yubicc/1349282562
http://www.flickr.com/photos/9769864@N02/2560612472
http://www.flickr.com/photos/pbo31/110323842
http://www.flickr.com/photos/za3tooor/9498093
http://www.flickr.com/photos/csconway/2189602205
http://www.flickr.com/photos/zinnie/531513347
http://www.flickr.com/photos/palace/63612246

lol...ok...just an observation...

We all post and gripe about the rising costs of fuel, whine about our politicians sitting on their arses doing nothing for the people. We now get word that a leader is stepping forward to do SOMETHING..and the posts now negate the efforts and party bash.
And we wonder why nothing gets done....hmm.
I say getting behind an effort does NOT mean you have to give up your support for a particular party or mean that you like the leader! This is what we have been asking for right? Representing the will of the people!! Or did I miss something somewhere?

Yes,lostfaith we are all sheep.We had an opportunity in 2004 to let our provincial liberals/ndp know,that this is the people's province,not the government's.However,we were all skeptical,about who was going to benefit from a general strike,everyone was afraid to lose whatever they had or the promise of what could be.We may be more educated,and think we are superior to the generations before us,but we lack whatever they had,to make this country and province what it could be.

If she promises to abolish the provincial gasoline tax or at least regulate how much gas can be sold for (as in the maritimes) then they'll get my vote.

I don't support the NDP or Carole James.
Never have and never will, and their track record shows that's what they deserve, given their restrictive and ill thought out policies.
But sitting back and saying there is nothing we can do, is exactly what Campbell and his little band of merry men are banking on.
This is just the tip of the iceberg, and it will get much worse in a very short time.
If we think we are getting screwed over now,just wait until after the next provincial election.
We ain't seen nothin' yet!
At the very least we need to deliver a strong message to the Liberals that we will not be treated like a cash cow!
With the serious debt the Liberals are facing in regards to the Olymipcs and a number major expenditures on the lower mainland over the next few years,we know exactly where they are going to hit to fatten up the coffers.
The arrogance is getting worse, and our only hope is to send a clear message to Campbell and the Liberals that inspite of the lack of choices,they do not have a free reign to do as they please.
And unfortunately,the ballot box is the only place we can show that.
This is going to require a lot of serious thought and perhaps some tough choices that will be hard to swallow,but I personally cannot sit bck and condone what is happening, and in particular the total disregard and respect for those of us in the north.
We are the ones who will carry much of the load with this assinine carbon tax and no matter how I look at it,it is just plain wrong!

Carole James who?!?!? down with the UNION

Would be nice to have a "Voter's Veto" on such issues as the 'carbon tax'. Take the partisan-ship and whether one likes or detests one leader or another right out of it.

Something like the 'Counter-Petition' process now used locally in many places. Where a Regional District or Municipality wants to implement some zoning change or tax without going to the expense and bother of a Referendum.

A Counter-Petition allows for a mechanism to force voter approval to be sought if there's a suffient number of people that indicate they're opposed.

If that threshold can't be met, the measure goes ahead. But if there is substantial opposition, even after all the pros and cons have been debated, then the Voters get to decide in a referendum on that issue alone.

Not every issue is going to be decided that way, in many cases there may well be more support for a certain proposal than is evident from all the opposing noise surrounding it. But such a mechanism does afford the opportunity for people to reject an unwise or unpopular measure, too.

This is the text of Carol James' petition.

"We, the undersigned, are concerned about climate change but believe that Gordon Campbell's fuel tax is putting the burden on ordinary people while letting the big polluters off the hook. We believe we need real climate change solutions now and support Carole James' plan to axe the fuel tax."

I'm 100% opposed to the Carbon Tax, but there's absolutely "No Way" I'd sign a Petition worded that way. That is no more than NDP 'partisanship' at its worst, and any leader and Party that would deceptively word a Petition that way is clearly NOT fit to govern this Province.

So the NDP spent all the money in BC,Now the Liberals are hording all the money in BC ...are we any better off.

ah I see...so some of you posters believe this isn't actually to get rid of the tax? This is about egos and credit...so even though you don't want this tax you won't sign the petition....DONT BE A FOOL!

The ones that sign a Petition worded that way are the 'fools', tiny.

I'll sign any petition put out by Carol James, or anyone else, if it's worded solely to express my opposition to the imposition of the Carbon Tax. Period.

And if it were simply worded that way, I would have no problem giving Ms. James and her Party full credit for seeking to mobilize voters against a poorly-timed and fundamentally stupid tax. In fact, if I saw this kind of change in attitude in the NDP, I might even actively support them.

But I'll be damned if I'm going to sign something like the way this current Petition is worded. That's like signing a 'blank cheque' in favour of the NDP's climate change prescriptions and it's method of funding those ideas.

Not trusting the people to be able to make a choice in deciding one thing at a time seems to be an NDP habit. What are they afraid of? That presented honestly, we wouldn't like THEIR method for dealing with supposed man-made climate change any more than we like Gordo's?

Hmm I see your point socredible...I have read and reread and read again to try to understand what was wrong with the wording....

Is it the part about climate change solutions and then the Carole James' plan to ... bit?? If so, then I think I see the cynicism now. I signed it just to be done with the lunacy. I choose my candidate on voting day and after that I expect all elected leaders to represent all their constituents so I really don't worry too much about wording on the petition as long as the purpose is clearly defined. I had no trouble signing it as I feel I am supporting an issue not a party. I missed that aspect of your opinion socredible. Thx for pointing it out :) In reality the tax will be axed so I am not a fool. All candidates have to work pretty hard to convince me to vote for them so I feel it is inconsequential.

It's really not inconsequential, tiny, because Ms. James and her Ottawa counterpart will take all the names of people who sign a Petition worded the way their's is, NOT solely as a call for an axing of Gordo's nutty Carbon Tax, but as solid evidence of support for the NDP's alternatives.

Which might well be far costlier to us all than the tax we think we're axing.

They'll go to election, both Federally and Provincially, saying, without a word of a lie, look at all the people in BC who want what WE propose, (because we've asked them, in a Petition, and they've put their names on it.)

And if Ms. James' party got in, and moved to implement HER plan, could any of those who signed agreeing with it then hold HER responsible for doing something THEY have told her publicly, in writing, by Petition that THEY support?

To me this is the type of deception in politics I abhor. It's small wonder so many are now so cynical about ANY "Party" being capable of being representative of anything other than their own narrow interests and agenda. She had a great opportunity here to demonstrate she's listening to what people want and is trying to help them get it. And she's completely blown it with crass opportunism and deception.

Hmm..never considerated that angle...maybe I is the fool afterall.