Is anyone else surprised that city is putting a PAC into their priorities?

They claim they have no money for the necessary stuff but are prepared to put out huge amounts for something that , yes would be nice, but is far from critical we have one.

Lets not forget the money they will just HAPPEN to HAVE for a 100th aAnniversary Celebration

WE HAVE TO HAVE UOR PARTIES

All one has to do it look at what budget cuts to snow removal has done to our roads.
The city has not done much on the other aging infractutre items…but seem to have money for THIS?

It is time these people go!

I wonder if the mayor and her BFF’s will be going to China again, and this agenda is her way of letting us know.

We are already paying for the storm sewer system in this town. Why are they asking for a separate fee for that???

Just like we are paying for snow removal and street maintenance. I am really sick of all these new charges dreamed up by these people. Our taxes should go down by the same amount if they implement this because it will just be double taxation if they institute it.
Next they will be asking for a surcharge to pay for the mayor’s salary!

There’s another thing us taxpayers should have a say in, whether she goes to China or not.
Just let her have the guts to put THAT to a referendum!

Priority # 1 : Roads and Snow removal, drove around in your City yesterday and I have to say some of the Intersection are a Nightmare
. Roads Having Craters to park small Cars in it, no one Cares but you must have a PAC, Priorities are ?
You should have a Vote to keep some in China!

I realize this is everyone’s favourite hot button issue around here, but relax.

The City can ‘prioritize’ the PAC all it wants, but it has already stated that getting the funding federally and provincially will be a challenge because there’s no appetite for these kinds of things right now.

In other words, when it comes to a PAC, I would say it’s unlikely to ever happen.

Perhaps this list contains certain “hot button” issues so the public becomes focused on them and do not notice the issues they will try to slide by to achieve their agenda of reduced services, increased costs and more ‘legacy’ projects to remind future citizens of how great this council was.

I agree I can’t believe they are even considering a performing arts centre.

It is stated in the news that the US Federal Reserve is turning off the tap which has been infusing vast amounts of fiat money into the system, thereby virtually assuring that interest rates are going to increase in North America, if not globally.

Using common sense one may say that adding even more to the debt load of anyone may be a bad idea, if not reckless. That would include wish list project hungry governments at all levels, not excluding our municipal geniuses!

NO!!!!!!!!?

NO!!!!!!!!?

here is a link to the last article written on this PAC back in November 2013.

blog/view/30176/1/council+says+performing+arts+centre++a+priority?id=140&st=360

As previously mentioned the PAC is one of the mayor’s pet projects.

I wrote to city hall have you?

The urge to scratch this PAC itch will be irresistible! Somehow they will sell a whole bunch of assets and put some scheme together to have it, one way or the other, borrowing plenty of course!

The Nutcracker at Vanier Hall was very enjoyable! The hall is not perfect but it is a very good facility!

She has got to know she has no chance to be re-elected if she decides to run again. I am curious/scared to see what she tries to get away with when she doesn’t have to worry about being re-elected in November.

I thought we already had a PAC. It’s called city hall featuring the gong show antics of Queen Green and her supporting cast of councillors.

By the condition of the roads Green is already preparing us for pot hole season.

JohnnyBelt. **When it come’s to a PAC, I would say its unlikely to ever happen**

That’s exactly the kind of thinking that the City wants. While you think it will not happen they are working hard to make it happen.

They may state that they will have trouble getting money from the Feds, and Province, however while they are saying that, they are fully aware that the Gas Tax Fund, which amount to approx. $2,911,000.00 per year for the City of Prince George has now been revised for the next 10 year period to allow this money to be spent on, CULTURE, tourism, sport, and recreation.

Furthermore they neglect to tell you that they can borrow money on future payments of the Gas Tax Fund, so in essence they could borrow $10 Million more or less against future payments. Money from the Gas Tax Fund can be used for Storm Water, so why is the City setting up a Storm Water Levy, when they can use the Gas Tax money. Could it be because they have other uses for this money???

Furthermore. The City has changed the Bylaws to allow money from the sale of land along Highway 16 West to be transferred to the Land Development Reserve and Endowment Reserve. These funds are transferred to the Capital Expenditure Reserve on a yearly basis, to fund the City’s capital expenditure projects that do not have a dedicated funding source. See Bylaw No. 7556 which was repealed, and Bylaw No. 8478 Oct 2012 which outlines the changes.

What this means is that money from the sale of the Tennis Court Lands, the Playhouse Theatre, and other land the City owns along Highway 16 West can be used for Capital Projects. This could amount to many millions of dollars. Add to that money from the Gas Tax Fund, and you are well on your way to funding this project, without going to the electorate for approval.

They of course will get further funding from the Feds, and Province under other funding options.

So, I think for all intents and purposes the PAC is a done deal insofar as funding is concerned, and all that is now required is to get everything in order, hence the accelerated activity now taking place.

What we need is for this project to go to a referendum in this years election to settle the issue once and for all.

We also need some investigative reporting to ascertain just where this project stands, and where the proposed funding is going to come from.

In my opinion. The citizens of Prince George are being manipulated by both Council, and Administration, and the PAC Society. They know exactly what they want, and will go to any lengths to get it, and that includes increasing taxes in other areas, to make other funds available.

Keep your eye on this one.

Palopu: ‘That’s exactly the kind of thinking that the City wants. While you think it will not happen they are working hard to make it happen.”

They can work as hard as they want, but if there is no money Federally or Provincially, this is dead in the water. The thing people should be mad at is the money spent on such things as feasibility studies and ‘planning’.

Times are different today than say, when the airport expansion happened. I don’t think that project would happen today.

This council has got to go, all of them. How dare they even entertain some of the ideas that they do.

It’s pretty simple, not any different than running a household on a yearly income.

It boils down to wants and needs, one may WANT a new big screen but the roof NEEDS to be replaced, one may WANT to go on a vacation but one NEEDS to pay off the credit card.

City hall has been hitting it’s credit card pretty hard for a long time and it’s time to stop. It’s time to take care of our NEEDS and put the WANTS away until the NEEDS are taken care of.

As far as the PAC goes it’s a WANT of a very small minority when the majority NEEDS snow removal, decent roads, water, sewer and garbage removal.

As it sits now our NEEDS are not being met but the thing some WANT are, we are doomed if the city council continues down this path.

PS. We also know that the City has purchased property through out the City, and that some of this property will be used for a PAC.

The general consensus is that it will be the property across the street (South) from the Keg Restaurant. Ie; Ed Delorme garage 620 George St., and the old Norgate Auto Body shop 1041,1007 6th Avenue. The City plans on razing these buildings this year, to make a plaza for the Winter Games, however it would also allow them to do some work on this property under the Winter Games, or some other budget, thus reducing their overall costs.

JohnnyBelt. What part of my post did you not understand???

The sale of the Playhouse Theatre could generate as much as $15 Million dollars. There must be some money left from the sale of the Tennis Court lands to private business, in addition there is the property North and West of the Playhouse. Then there is the Gas Tax Fund money that in 10 years amounts to some $30 Million dollars, plus they can borrow against the Gas Tax future payments.

I think the funding for the project is a done deal. That’s why they have now made it an official project priority.

I think one of the last moves Green will make as mayor will be to sell the Four Seasons Pool, so that young kids no longer have a viable pool for swimming lessons, and use that space and or money to put towards finalizing a PAC before the next election.

The trajectory we are on is about subsidizing the elites through sacrificing the opportunities of the communities youngest and the working poor.

Palopu:”What we need is for this project to go to a referendum in this years election to settle the issue once and for all.”

Fat chance of that happening! Why would they do that if (according to your information) they already have opportunities to access money from other funding options, meaning that money can be diverted from those.

Besides, why would they let people have input into the decision making? Supposing the outcome would be a resounding No?

Couldn’t that be somewhat embarrassing?

Only politicians with guts agree to a referendum.

My #1 priority on my bucket list is to see Queen Green and her band of merry men go down in flames in the November Election.

Prince George. I agree with everything you say, they will avoid a referendum, or an alternative approval process at all costs.

Having said that we need to keep putting pressure on them, because most people in this town are not in favour of spending this amount of money on frivolities. Especially when people are being forced to move out of their houses because of the high cost of services and taxes.

I will refuse to pay the storm utility tax -there is no sewer and storm drains where I reside and the soil is sandy!
Good luck in getting a $ out of me.

^^^^good luck with that one woodwoman. You could always be like Stolz and be in arrears with your taxes. Like, doing a hold out for what is it 2-3 years….:)

Ongoing priorities include:

• Developing 2015 Canada Winter Games Facilities and Opportunities
• Finalizing the Twinning Agreement Between the City of Prince George and the City of Jiangmen.

My 2 personal favs lol Yep…that’s what the average citizen in PG is concerned about! Thje city workers are inches away from a strike and the Citys PRIORITYS are “twinning” a City none of us will ever set foot in! Good job Mayor Green!

Paopu states: “The general consensus is that it will be the property across the street (South) from the Keg Restaurant. Ie; Ed Delorme garage 620 George St., and the old Norgate Auto Body shop 1041,1007 6th Avenue. The City plans on razing these buildings this year, to make a plaza for the Winter Games, however it would also allow them to do some work on this property under the Winter Games, or some other budget, thus reducing their overall costs”
I agree with your comment. I also see something glaring and narcisstic(?) on the Mayor’s part.
She is literally surrounding city hall with ‘legacy’ buildings that whoever the next mayor and council is, will have to look out their windows every day and see her ‘handi-work’. Because she WILL be voted out this election, she will be sitting back and having a good laugh at the new mayor and council and staff as they will have to look out their windows every day and see all the mayhem she has surrounded city hall with. Who knows she might even tear down the four seasons pool and build herself something there too. PAC? She’ll probably have plaques made to put on these new buildings….
sick !!

pac for a city that cant even fund its own canada day fireworks. riiiigggghhhhhttttt.

Look at the nee BC Hydro building. Then look at the new RCMP station.

Can you see the difference in design of the workstations of the two buildings? If there is any, it is not visible from the exterior, unless the police station includes an interior greenhouse.

Actually it does. One of these days we will say plants inside those two narrow spaces with a blank concrete wall and glass on the outside. That is the living wall which is supposed to assist with improving the indoor air quality. God only knows that the officers require that.

Much of the rest of the expenditure deals with the Architectural look of the building. I do not think the BC Hydro building concerned itself too much with the architectural look of the building.

That “architectural look” cost is a cost added due to “culture”.

I would say we spent roughly $2 to $3 million dollars on that look of culture. In addition, I would also say that it is one of the causes of delay in opening the building.

Hello?

You have a vivid imagination. Too many Disney cartoons?

That site has been in the OCP for over a decade. Why that is the case, I have never understood. Whoever proposed that obviously has little city planning expertise.

It is a very bad site because a PAC downtown is supposed to be a catalyst for further development of associated activities.

That site is hemmed in.

1. Nothing can be built to the south since it is the base of Connaught Hill Park.

2. Nothing can be built to the west since it is city hall

3. nothing can be built to the east since it is a busy arterial – Queensway.

4. nothing can be built to the north since it is the parkade.

The best locations for a PAC, if it is to do what it is intended to do, is part of a city block between Victoria and George and 3rd and 10th or so.

Second, pick areas where there are few pre-existing substantial buildings that will block future buildings or re-purposing existing buildings for uses which are associated with a performing arts centre – other small private theatres such as TNW, commercial galleries, night clubs, hotels, restaurants, convention facilities, book stores, dancing schools, etc. etc. In cities with “normal” growth rates and patterns such facilities are built in “found spaces” in older and often more interesting buildings. In fact, planned uses and rental spaces are often far too sterile and can suffer from long waits for rental clients. An example of that is the Convention facility in downtown Nanaimo.

The only way the PAC will happen sooner than later is if there is money there from both the feds and the province so that the max the City will pay is in the $10million range. Of course, that is in 2012 or so dollars. In fact, if my memory serves me correctly, the projected cost of a PAC is already getting close to 3 to 4 years old, so we are looking more at 2010/2011 dollars. But, we may be starting a new trend of cheaper construction as the years pass by …… ;-)

I see that the present chair of the PAC Society has left town for Kelowna. I wonder who will lead the albatross of a project now. The media does not even care anymore.

I have been following the St Catharines, Ontario PAC project for several years.

These kind of projects typically take a considerable time to design and build. The St. Catharines PAC initially came in at too high a price when the project was tendered. The building was scaled down in size as well as quality of materials and re-tendered. Looks like that took an additional half year.

That centre is designed with a775-seat concert hall, a theatre/dance venue with up to 210 seats, a 187-seat film theatre and a 300-seat recital hall. The 2012 budget was $54million in a region where construction costs are typically lower than in BC.

The proposed PG PAC has 3 spaces of similar size to the St. Catherine’s PAC instead of the 4 spaces.

The thing which defines a PAC from a normal theatre is that it has multiple spaces which allow the facility to be “open” 7 days a week and enable it to be a true center of activity.

There is also a theory that having private partners would enhance the viability of a PAC. However, there are very few working examples of that other than in major cities like New York.

New York actually turned a dying theatre district around some 40 years ago when high rise developers were given bonus density if they provided such facilities as theatres on the lower floors of the buildings.

http://www.stcatharines.ca/en/experiencein/DowntownPerformingArtsCentre1.asp