This scum is ruining our town.

I must say, I am sickened w/ the state of this little city. We were downtown today at a restaurant outside and saw some guy kick another guy in the head and then chase him down the street. the establishment we were at had it's windows boarded up and I asked the waiter if this is from the infamous "shooting" and he said "no, from the 3 break in's we've had". However, last week I was shopping downtown and thought all seemed fine and this time I felt almost like I was in East Vancouver (the bad part of East van). This city is way too small. It really feels like downtown is just one big crime scene, skid row. Very sad, I don't know what can be done; where would all the "riff raff" go? It doesn't really seem like downtown is big enough for a good part and a bad part - seems like the bad stuff is definitely taking over - I'll shop west of town any day!

yes it is very scary.....I sure wish i knew if there was any plans on dealing with this.

wow...before i was giving OWL a hard time for giving our city a bad rep.

kudos to opinion250 for being the first local media to report this!

Moses, just what would you have the mayor do? Rewrite the criminal code? Fire Liberal judges? Get a big stick and clean up downtown like "walking Tall"?. Sadly, the inmates are running the asylum right now. It has to change. Do you have any ideas?

Seeing we all comment on this growing problem maybe we should all have a meeting at Tims and put some ideas down on paper and together take it to City and see where we begin fixing this problem...It needs to be dealt with! Is anyone willing to partake?

The problem isn't people from Prince George and mostly never has been. The problem as I see it is imported from the surrounding communities throughout Northern BC (both victims and perps for the most part). They have social sickness in their communities and because they are to small for anonymity they then export their problems to PG and we see it in our downtown as a result.

The long term solution is to solve the social sickness in northern feeder communities, and the short term solution is anyones guess but probably involves a city plan to mitigate the disturbance and interaction with places we would like to develop in town. The city, who pays the RCMP, would be the ones taking a led role in this strategy. Long term that is a failure of the provincial and federal governments to provide economic opportunity and health education in smaller rural northern communities for the low end of the labor skill sector who are most vulnerable.

The people that come here from the surrounding communities and destroy themselves in our community are doing so out of desperation and loss of any hope for a good future. For them the life of a crack head in PG is a big step up in life and by this point most are beyond recovery IMO and therefore should be managed possibly through city planning with some sort of goal that I don't know.

"""Get a big stick and clean up downtown like "walking Tall"?. Sadly, the inmates are running the asylum right now. It has to change. Do you have any ideas?"""

Sounds like something they haven't tried yet? But I dont think they have tried a one way bus ticket to Victoria & $200.00 spending money either, put these two untried ideas to work and your downtown would be cleaned up lickity-split!!

But, Jim, what do you do when Vancouver gives its street people $200 and a bus ticket to come to Prince George? Sauce for the goose is sauce for the gander, remember, and just today in Beijing the Premier promised to solve the homeless problems in Vancouver by the time the 2010 Olympics start.

I remember there was an opportunity many years ago, maybe 15 or 20, when there was millions of dollars made available to PG to renovate downtown. It required that downtown voters approve it, but it looked like it was going through.

Then one downtown "activist", visited all his friends and talked them into rejecting the renovations. He preferred it the way it was for some reason. Blame him and the other downtown merchants. PG had an opportunity, but once the renovations were turned down businesses who wanted the renovations done started to move out of the area, except for a few die hards.

At the time, the present situation was foretold by proponents of the renovation. I would suggest that the only feasible way to renovate the area now is to expropriate most of the businesses and build a shopping mall like the West Edmontomn Mall. Who can afford that? Who would want to do that? How many voters would be willing to support the debt for that to happen?

Just one observation on the news articel. One of those arrested was "59 year old Brent Herbert". It is not just young people in the gangs, then.

There are provisions of the law already to address issues such as vagrancy, loitering and common nuisance.

Enforce the laws and Prince George downtown will belong to the ordinary law abiding citizens once more:

VAGRANCY

179. (1) Every one commits vagrancy who

(a) supports himself in whole or in part by gaming or crime and has no lawful profession or calling by which to maintain himself; or
(b) having at any time been convicted of an offence under section 151 , 152 or 153 , section 160(3) or section 173(2) or section 271 , 272 , 273 , or of an offence under a provision referred to in paragraph (b) of the definition "serious personal injury offence" in section 687 of the Criminal Code, chapter C-34 of the Revised Statutes of Canada, 1970, as it read before January 4, 1983, is found loitering in or near a school ground, playground, public park or bathing area.

(2) Every one who commits vagrancy is guilty of an offence punishable on summary conviction. [R.S., c.C-34, s.175; 1972, c.13, s.12; 1984, c.40, s.20; R.S.C. 1985, c.27 (1st Supp.), s.22; c.19 (3rd Supp.), s.8.]

COMMON NUISANCE... / Definition.

180. (1) Every one who commits a common nuisance and thereby

(a) endangers the lives, safety or health of the public, or
(b) causes physical injury to any person,

is guilty of an indictable offence and liable to imprisonment for a term not exceeding two years.

(2) For the purposes of this section, every one commits a common nuisance who does an unlawful act or fails to discharge a legal duty and thereby

(a) endangers the lives, safety, health, property or comfort of the public; or
(b) obstructs the public in the exercise or enjoyment of any right that is common to all the subjects of Her Majesty in Canada. [R.S., c.C-34, s.176.]

The problem is the jail on the hill. Most of the inmates are not local to begin with, but are transferred in from other parts of the province. They then "network" while they are there and when they are released they are given a bus ticket that they sell or simply throw away and they decide to stay with their new friends.

That is how all of the gangs came to be in the city over the past few years. They were happily imported with the tax payer footing the bill to boot.

Has no one thought about why all of these guys are from the lower mainland? It's not a coincidence.

The worse they are, the more likely they will be tranferred to PGRCC to be held. Then they see the thriving drug trade and relatively low cost of living. Why on earth would they get back on that bus?

Even the pathetic few who do get back on the bus, find their way back here.

Interview the "residents" on the streets downtown and find out where they are from. You can bet it's not here!

Someone should do a story on that, or at least investigate it.

Start with who is incarcerated right now and trace their beginnings. It will lead you right to the very start of this "gang war".

There are provisions of the law already to address issues such as vagrancy, loitering and common nuisance.

Enforce the laws and Prince George downtown will belong to the ordinary law abiding citizens once more:

VAGRANCY

179. (1) Every one commits vagrancy who

(a) supports himself in whole or in part by gaming or crime and has no lawful profession or calling by which to maintain himself; or
(b) having at any time been convicted of an offence under section 151 , 152 or 153 , section 160(3) or section 173(2) or section 271 , 272 , 273 , or of an offence under a provision referred to in paragraph (b) of the definition "serious personal injury offence" in section 687 of the Criminal Code, chapter C-34 of the Revised Statutes of Canada, 1970, as it read before January 4, 1983, is found loitering in or near a school ground, playground, public park or bathing area.

(2) Every one who commits vagrancy is guilty of an offence punishable on summary conviction. [R.S., c.C-34, s.175; 1972, c.13, s.12; 1984, c.40, s.20; R.S.C. 1985, c.27 (1st Supp.), s.22; c.19 (3rd Supp.), s.8.]

COMMON NUISANCE... / Definition.

180. (1) Every one who commits a common nuisance and thereby

(a) endangers the lives, safety or health of the public, or
(b) causes physical injury to any person,

is guilty of an indictable offence and liable to imprisonment for a term not exceeding two years.

(2) For the purposes of this section, every one commits a common nuisance who does an unlawful act or fails to discharge a legal duty and thereby

(a) endangers the lives, safety, health, property or comfort of the public; or
(b) obstructs the public in the exercise or enjoyment of any right that is common to all the subjects of Her Majesty in Canada. [R.S., c.C-34, s.176.]

Not one person on here even gave any thought to the poor woman who was beaten and raped!! OMG! What if she were you're mother, daughter or grandaughter? Then would you at the very least say how sorry you are that this happened to her? This is not the first rape PG has seen in the last little while either! There was one less than a month ago, but she was a recovering drug addict so no one cared! Are women safe in this town? I think not! People being held againts their will and beaten or raped is not something to not worry about! This problem may be only happening in the drug trade for now but it is only a matter of time that that changes. Be careful ladies and never walk alone!!

Let me be the first to say I am truly sorry for the woman who was raped! I hope for you to recover from this as quickly as possible. :{

And not hang around any more crack houses.

Does that justify forcible confinement and sexual slavery with multiple rapes, Vigil01?

In any case, I re-read the article carefully, and I could find no statement that she hung around crack houses, only that she was imprisoned in one against her will. At the moment we don't know how she got involved and any statements about it are just guesses.

Shellshadow is correct.

Read between the lines.

People should know where their kids are.

Yes, I think it's horrible as well. The most horrible thing that can happen to a woman.

I hope she is ok and I hope she will never again associate with whomever or in whatever situation allowed her to be in that situation to begin with.

By the way, nothing would ever justify that.

I am all for capital punishment when it comes to rape, child molestation and murder.

Lets the see the storm that statement will cause.

I'll drink to that Vigil01

cheers :)

I do feel sorry for the woman victim and I hope that the two rapists are neutered so that they don't ever do it again!

"...when there was millions of dollars made available to PG to renovate downtown."

Sorry for the double post about vagrancy, loitering and nuisance making!

We have plenty of laws in place to pick up any of these misfits and keep them locked up and then the community will be safe.

59 is a little long in the tooth to be involved in this kind of thing. I guess stupid people remain stupid people. They're too stupid to earn an honest living so they steal and sell drugs.

The woman victim? I realize she's young but there are better choices in life than to get involved with these low lifes. I hope she learns from this how ruthless and evil these people are. Don't for one minute thing she was a random choice. She was targeted. She probably owed them money for drugs. The only thing I feel sorry for is she got involved with drugs in the first place.

There is something fundamentally wrong with PG. Too much crime, too many jails around this small city which feed into more crime in PG. But even the administration in the university (UNBC)
is dominated by gang mentality and special interest groups (according to the 2003 UNBC report).

One can blame the criminal gangs in downtown for lack of education, money/economy or police/judiciary problems; but how can one justify the gang mentality in the university in PG?
Those in univ are fully employed and educated.

What is common between both gang groups is the root of problems. What makes a prof (forming a gang of fellow professors and bullying others) different from a less educated gang member in downtown who bullies and attacks others?

The source of both is excessive and uncontrolled narcissism and egotism with no respect for the community and other people's rights. Who is supposed to control this sickness in PG? the politicians, the government?

Maybe the government and politicians suffer from the same sickness.

It is a vicious cycle.