Our Roads In Prince George Are Becoming An Embarrassment

Friday, April 03, 2009 03:45 AM

On July 17^th 2002, Jeanne Anderson of the Prince George Oral History Group conducted an interview with Harold Moffat.

Moffat, who had been Mayor of the city from 1969-1978, pointed out to her what he thought was a major problem in the city, that being that while the city fathers are building facility after facility( he pointed out the Hart Center, multiplex and new civic center) we were doing little to look after the roads in the city.

He said in the interview that it wasn’t very good for your future image to just say that you kept the roads in good shape, you needed something to be remembered by, with the result that the roads were very quickly collapsing .

He was right, but the powers of the day paid no attention to him and today when we look around, we see the results of that neglect.

We have a major problem with our road network and unless the city residents are prepared to take a 7-10% hike in their taxes, it is going to be with us for a long while to come. The neglect of our roads has left many in such repair that they require a brand new street, complete with a new base. That costs money, and while we have increased our patching crews to three and increased our patching budget, it has been like putting a bandage on a wound that was caused by an axe. We are in trouble with our road structure and in spite of the voters to try and get that message across during the election; it seems to have been lost.

Many people say and with very good reason some of these potholes are not potholes they are craters and they are right. You don’t need to travel far to see some streets that are completely pot marked and short of turning them back into gravel , they do not resemble a paved avenue.

How you get City hall to understand that the taxpayers want the basics and that is where the city funds should go first is a mystery. This patch work approach which is beginning to show that we have a road network that is the envy of no one in North America has got to go.

Now all we need is someone at city hall like the late Harold Moffat to stand up and tell it like it is and get on with the job of fixing the mess.

I’m Meisner and that’s one man’s opinion.

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Posted on Friday, April 03, 2009 03:45 AM in Views by Ben Meisner

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Comments

Posted by: taxinapothole on April 3 2009 4:01 AM

you are echoing my statements about the roads Ben. This City needs to go back to the basics. NO PAC at a cost of 54 million. No 4Th Avenue rebuild at a cost of over 6 million. NO increases in wages at City Hall or the workers there within. No money for special interest groups. No money for anything, other than the basics that our tax dollars are supposed to be for!!

Fire protection, Police, water and sewer, garbage collection, and GOOD ROADS. Dan Rogers, you have already showed me why I didn't vote for you. This City is a Sh!t Hole.

300 klm a day. That is what I drive on these nasty roads. Don't have to tell me how bad they are DANNY BOY. Fix them, and fix them now!

Don't you even consider another multi-million dollar project in this City, until you fix these roads. Disgracefull

Posted by: woodwoman on April 3 2009 7:31 AM

One little prairie town between Moose Jaw and Swift Current the people embarrassed their council - made a calendar of potholes - sold thousands across Canada and the rest of the world - the potholes sure got fixed in a hurry- $$ went to a charitable organization.

Posted by: metalman on April 3 2009 7:41 AM

Taxi, I would add NO new police station to your list.
metalman.

Posted by: gus on April 3 2009 7:50 AM

No money for Boundary Road from the City.

Posted by: gus on April 3 2009 7:58 AM

This problem is Canada wide. The engineers, Automobile Association and other lobby groups have been telling the government for some time that roads in this country aer deteriorating at a faster pace than than they are being built. The main culprit, according to them, is a considerable increase in truck traffic and also a decrease in the monitoring and enforcement of load limits.

Maybe some roads simply have to be taken back down to the gravel road standard, that way the graders can work year round .... grading the roads in the summer once a wekk and plowing the snow in the winter once a week, snow fall or no snow fall. Sort of like garbage pick up.

Posted by: diplomat on April 3 2009 8:04 AM

"How you get City hall to understand that the taxpayers want the basics and that is where the city funds should go first is a mystery."

As long as a number of really smart P.G. residents publicly (via letters to the newspapers, here on opinion250 and elsewhere) belittle and dismiss those who complain about this problem as "whiners" nobody at the helm is going to deal with this in a serious manner.

Apparently their mantra that *we are lucky because there are places where the potholes are much worse than in Prince George* is listened to eagerly at City Hall.

The rest of us (whiners) can keep trying to dodge the craters, pay for suspension repairs and busted tires/rims or move elsewhere.

I haven't seen a patching crew up here in the last two weeks or more, although there are huge craters here all over the place, too many to count and too many to report to the City.

No more eager and willing borrowing of vast sums of money for luxury projects like a Performing Arts Centre (with only 8 more seats than Vanier Hall) until this embarrassment has been properly remedied.

BTW, the city looks the shyts with all those crumbled, cracked and patched rough streets, a visible confirmation of blatant neglect if not outright poverty.

Posted by: justanotherday on April 3 2009 8:14 AM

I hope that if it comes down to completly rebuilding our raods the city makes the call to bury all of the power lines that bring this city down. Think what driving down west Ospika would be like without those huge power poles, thats if you have time to look up from dodging the mine field on pot holes.

Posted by: rayban68 on April 3 2009 9:39 AM

Ben you started good and ended ok, but what was that 7-10% tax hike crap in the middle?

Read your own article!!!

We need less waste on unnecessary buildings and special interest spending, and more spending on roads. A re-allocation of the existing tax monies, not an increase in taxes!!!

Posted by: Resident on April 3 2009 9:47 AM

We keep hearing from city hall about the thousands of kilometers of roads in PG that have to be maintained. Let's be realistic. The residental side streets and cresents receive either none or minimal repair. Very seldom does a pothole appear on low traffic residential streets. The issue of potholes is mainly resticted to high traffic maim arteries, Ospika, 15th, 5th, Tabor, etc. so it is not really a situation where all roads are in disrepair but is limited to about 20% of the roads in PG.
I certainly concur the outcry of the citizens in PG fall on deaf ears at city hall when it comes the condition of the roads. Ospika at the CN Centre has been resurfaced 3 years in a row and whatever is being done does not even last 1 year.
Time for city hall to forget about spending taxpayer money on community energy systems, PAC, 4th ave, Boundry Road, and listen to the concerns of the citizens. Maybe a return to yearly elections might jolt the elected officials to remember taxpayers year round rather than for 1 month every few years at election time.

Posted by: seamutt on April 3 2009 10:00 AM

justanotherday putting power lines underground especially big lines can cost anywhere from 3 to 10 times the above ground cost. Now how would that be paid-more taxes. Lets just fix the roads.

Posted by: lostfaith on April 3 2009 11:00 AM

Posted by: rayban68 on April 3 2009 9:39 AM
Ben you started good and ended ok, but what was that 7-10% tax hike crap in the middle?

Read your own article!!!

We need less waste on unnecessary buildings and special interest spending, and more spending on roads. A re-allocation of the existing tax monies, not an increase in taxes!!!"

Not to mention we have already had tax increases that were specifically for road repairs over the past couple of years!!!

Posted by: lostfaith on April 3 2009 11:02 AM

"He was right, but the powers of the day paid no attention to him and today when we look around, we see the results of that neglect."

Nothing has changed, the powers that be are still not paying attention to taxpayers!

Posted by: lostfaith on April 3 2009 11:04 AM

"Maybe some roads simply have to be taken back down to the gravel road standard, that way the graders can work year round .... grading the roads in the summer once a wekk and plowing the snow in the winter once a week, snow fall or no snow fall. Sort of like garbage pick up."

Perfect solution Gus. Then you can whine about the air pollution created from graders working in town all day and night.

Posted by: kitkat on April 3 2009 12:00 PM

The roads are horrible in this town. Saying that they are worse in other towns is a piss poor cop out. Given all the posts on this topic it is obviously an issue that alot of people are upset about. It is time for some action. The roads need to be repaired properly. I guess on the plus side it's impossible to get a speeding ticket though!

Posted by: Nowicki on April 3 2009 12:17 PM

Let companies like Geico enter Canadian Insurance system and the ICBC car insurance premiums in BC will fall by 50% or more. Then drivers can be charged 10% extra for roads and we will have much cheaper insurance and much better roads. PG council/city hall should consider it.

The road system in Canada, compared to our neigbour in the south, is a joke.

Posted by: EGBG on April 3 2009 12:28 PM

YEAH Lets dump millions into repaving the roads in PG.

Fire up every asphalt plant in PG and run them 24/7 to supply the big stinky poluting pavers.

That would be great, we could all have a smooth ride around town, AND we could give all the same people that b!tch about potholes another thing to b!tch about. POOR AIR QUALITY!

You cry when the roads are bad and then you cry when the air is bad because of the TONS of thick black smoke pouring into the air when making asphalt. OH yeah wait a minute the air quality isn't affected by that, or the fact PG in in a geographical BOWL......the air is bad because of the Pulpmills. The same pulpmills which have continuously decreased emissions for the past 20 years!

Posted by: Resident on April 3 2009 1:01 PM

Now that we are on the subject of air pollution for those interested you can go to the Environment Canada "National Pollution Registry Inventory" site and see how many tonnes per year of particulate matter, numerous chemical compounds, and metals being released into the atmosphere by various industries in PG.
As in any case technology exists to clean up or significantly reduce the pollutants but it always comes down to cost and whether it is economically viable to reduce pollutants.
Unfortunately it seems in PG not much gets done to reduce air pollution unless there is an outcry from the public. To many people are willing to sacrifice their own and others health to satisfy the wants of industry.

Posted by: lostfaith on April 3 2009 2:11 PM

Exactly Resident.

Posted by: Loki on April 3 2009 3:09 PM

City council meetings are normally scheduled on a Monday evening to enable citizens to attend and voice their concerns.
Expressing ones concerns (bitching) in a public forum definitely makes the the author feel better, but really it does very little.
Many of the posters, regular and the infrequent, have raised many concerns and have also made some very good suggestions to solve these concerns. The question is, "Are the right people hearing this?"
City hall needs to hear most of this. Do they read opinion 250? I think most likely. Can they bring these expressed concerns and solutions into council chambers? Likely not.

Go to http://city.pg.bc.ca/cityhall/clerk/councilschedule/ to find the schedule for council meetings, and go to the next one. Every second Monday, next one is one the sixth.

Posted by: lostfaith on April 3 2009 3:15 PM

If you write a letter to the mayor they must address it at the city council meeting.

Posted by: Ispy on April 3 2009 4:39 PM

Re:justanotherday

Ospika runs North and South,get a compass dude

Posted by: taxinapothole on April 3 2009 6:58 PM

I will write a letter to Mayor Mr. Rogers lostfaith. What a great idea. We that post here, and are upset with our road conditions, should all write a letter!

And then, we should all drive our vehicles, bumper to bumper (safely of course) around City Hall. As long as we keep moving (very slowly), we are not breaking any laws! Maybe then, Mr. Rogers will pay attention to the "neighborhood"!!

Posted by: Loki on April 3 2009 7:19 PM

May I suggest that this site provide a collaboration page?
Subject: A letter from a group of citizens to our city counsil. Potholes and basic infrstructure maintenance before flights of fancy.

taxinapothole:
take a day or two to compile the input from the opinion250 "whiners"
Maybe comb the archive for gems of wisdom.

Write and mail the letter.

There you go, an action more effecive than whispering in the wind storm.

Posted by: taxinapothole on April 3 2009 8:13 PM

I'm on it Loki, another great idea! I have the next 4 days off, I will put it to good use.

Posted by: Harbinger on April 3 2009 8:34 PM

The parking lot at City hall ain't nothing to write home about either!

Posted by: gus on April 4 2009 9:52 AM

"The road system in Canada, compared to our neigbour in the south, is a joke."

We have one tenth the population.

The road system in the US compared to Europe is a joke.

The too have a better road system because they have more people per sq.km. than the USA. It goes with the territory. Farm roads for farm density population and urban roads for urban density population.

Interestingly people always compare to "our neighbour to the south", conveniently forgetting all about our neighbour to the north.

Alaska has similar problems.

LA = http://www.city-data.com/forum/los-angeles/552203-class-action-law-suit-city-los.html

FARGO = http://www.inforum.com/event/article/id/236064 flood is receding .. back to pothole fixin'

RALEIGH = http://www.wral.com/news/local/story/122921 North Carolina!!!!

DENVER = http://govpro.com/public_works/highways/gov_imp_46256

BTW ... what was that about our neighbours to the south??????

Posted by: gus on April 4 2009 9:56 AM

Nor is the drive up to the City Hall parking lot.

It shows that the real problem might be that they do not know what pavement in a good condition should look like.

Posted by: diplomat on April 4 2009 5:35 PM

Why would people who are too busy managing, planning, estimating, studying etc really important matters give a darn about such a mundane unrewarding annoyance as the surface conditions of roads, streets and sidewalk?

Every once in a while they hire a contractor to measure the comfort index of all the streets who pulls a special wheeled measuring device all over the place.

If the latest deterioration average (as computed) doesn't exceed that of a model standard from some years ago - all is well.

That model standard was not that of pothole and crack free streets - it was an average measurement taken from already deteriorated conditions.

I don't agree to comparing ourselves to others who have the same problem or even worse.

OUR streets are OUR business and OUR concern.