hope they don't waste to much time investagating sounds like he got what he deserved

downnotout - really is your comment necessary!! it is people like you that make my stomach really turn!!! maybe one day it will be one of your family members who go to the wrong side of the law and end up the same way!! GOD forbid!!

stop and think that no matter what he did he still has people who cared about him and are going to read what you said!! think before you type!!

He may have been low life street scum, but he was murdered and our justice system MUST find and convict his murderer.
To do otherwise would only encourage vigilantism. Then where would it end?

As much as law abiding citizens appreciate the underworld serving up an unforgiving and irrevocable sentence within their ranks, we still need the official justice system to do its job.

In court on Monday facing 10 charges. To bad the other 3 were not with him this time......

We rely on our judicial system too much, sometimes the shades of gray sure do come in handy.

Nope, holding someone to a gunpoint is a serious crime. If the system was really concerned than he should have been kept in jail

Anastasia I'm with downnotout! Any person that has the audacity to hold a semi-automatic gun to an unsuspecting homeowner deserves to be at the other end of the barrel. Their is no room for these people in society; our city, our country and our world are better off without them. Plus their is another bright side to this, now we don't have to pay taxes for him stay at the hilton on the hill for the next 5-10 years. That is of course assuming that our justice system, that people want to believe in, wouldn't find a way to just give him a slap on the wrist.

Superdave - I am not saying that what he did in this life was right, howver, I(speaking for myself)still don't think that stating he got what he deserved is necessary.

Also, we don't house people at the Hilton for more than 2yrs, it is 2yrs less a day, but I know what you are saying, I don't like working to pay of them to be there either!!

It seems that each time we have a fatality, whether an out of bounds skier or a known or suspected criminal, there are all these inane posts of "sympathies".
I would assume that the majority of readers do feel that sympathy or empathy, so it really goes without saying. It is not that I am unfeeling, it is that I have no qualms about the harsh reality.

Nice is nice, but PC is getting in the way of effective application of the law. The underworld does not have any such restrictions and neither does the real world of nature.

On the other hand, this was a criminal that lived a criminal life. Criminals do not develop in isolation, they are nurtured into the life.
If he really cared for his family unit, he would not be a criminal.
If his family unit really cared for this family member, they should and would have discouraged or prevented his life choice. How did they think he supported himself without going to a job every day? They knew he was a criminal.

He was a criminal and this act takes any future harm to innocents out of possibility. It protects YOU in the most cost effective manner. Lead pills are cheap, conviction and secure custody is extremely costly.

Yes, a human life has been taken prematurely. Yes it was a violent end to a violent life. Yes, another person will be investigated, charged, convicted, and securely detained so those costs still exist. This way, we the taxpayers get a 2 4 1 deal.
So what is the downside?

Let 'er rip!

Live by the gun - expect to die by the gun.
I have no feelings or sympathy for the Guy whatsoever, but certainly feel for his family!! I'll bet he's left a lot of pain and heartache behind him, and that it didn't just start yesterday!! Its a rare family these days who are not touched in some way by the druggies, gangs, theives, and cheap little thugs we've spawned over the years, even its just in trying to figure out how to keep your own kids from being "recruited" by these parasites.
Like others have noted, thankfully there's one less we'll have to provide room and board to, which would have been ongoing probably for the rest of his and our lives.

So, Loki, have you considered conducting classes for parents of wayward children? I assume that you must know a few things that a lot of us have missed, or you would not suggest that the family unit could have prevented this latest dead druggie from becoming a criminal. I have to go back to the parenting manual to try and find the section I must have missed;
'how to exert complete control over your children until you have them through universty and into a career'
As I posted previously, I sympathize with the family of young Mr. Marshall, but I sure as heck am not going to judge those I don't know. And if you have read any of my previous rants on the subject of organized crime and druggies you will know that I am far from your average bleeding heart Liberal.
metalman.

Cudos to whoever took out the trash.

Whoever is probably not far behind.

I cannot conduct parenting classes because some of my methods would be considered too harsh.
In defense of my statements about the family having an impact:
I used to be in that world so I know it well. I know the people and the attitudes that prevail.
I also have three offspring in or approaching adult hood. Two are in college or university and the youngest is finishing grade 12 and will be going to college in their chosen field.
Only the boy has had a run in with the law. When he heard me tell the RCMP to lock him him up, he decided that it would be better not to break the law anymore. That incident was instigated by his "friend" who had stuffed candy bars into my boys coat pockets. The point is my parenting has been a resounding success.

It is a cultural thing. Not cultural like Canadian culture, rather the circle of influence culture. When all one's friends have a certain attitude, you will tend to adopt that attitude so that you will not be cast or shunned from the group.

The same goes for criminality. IF, his family had made more efforts to encourage a better class of associates, he would not have fallen so deeply into crime life. They accepted that is what he was, so by ineffective action not only allowed, but also enabled his lifestyle to the detriment of his victims and himself.

By allowing our children an unstructured life with unfettered choices, we get this result. Our job as parents is to raise functioning, contributing adults. Nothing more, nothing more is needed. It is incumbent on parents to set the structure, set boundaries and enforce those rules. Nothing different than being a free member of a free society. By allowing our children whatever associates they want, we are telling them it is OK to do whatever the heck they want. Sort of like every example given for poor parenting results when we see urban teens "hangin out" on the street corner. If they are just "hangin", then they will find trouble. There is truth is the saying, "idle hands are the devils playground.

1. Provide a structured home environment
That means you the parent is in control, not the kids. The inmates do not run the asylum! That does not mean drill Sargent regimentation.
2. Approve their personal associations. Not choose their friends, discourage bad influences
3. Have them set long, mid and short term goals
4. Have them plan to achieve those goals
5. Set performance expectations: this means chores done regularly and to a specified quality, same with homework
6. Set rules of the house and ensure they are obeyed by all including their visitors. Bad influences will not come back and good ones will appreciate your home environment
7. Follow through with repercussions of not following the rules. If a spanking was promised for an infraction, then a spanking will be delivered, Metaphorically speaking.
I believe the quickest route to a child's brain is through the seat of their pants. That is only until 11 or 12. If they have not got it by then, they will have struggles in society
8. DO NOT GIVE THEM THEIR EVERY WANT AND DESIRE. Provide the necessitous and a few wants, be a little nice. Make them earn the rest. No sense of entitlement this way.
9. Make them walk. They do not need a ride every where and most kids these days are way out of shape.
10. Make sure they have a social life. Slack jaw distance communication (computer) is not a social life. Face to face interaction on a regular basis has the most positive effects
11. Lead by example. Continue to develop your career and make sure they are aware of that process, even get them involved somehow. Have a good circle of friends yourself.
12. DO NOT GIVE THEM THEIR EVERY WANT AND DESIRE. There is a reason this is on the list twice
13. ALL children need to be involved with an extracurricular activity. It does not matter if it is Cadets or Scouting, or volunteering, or a part time job. They absolutely must have a regular activity outside of the house and the school.
Hint hint, Cadets can provide almost half the credits needed to graduate grade 12.

This list is not exhaustive by any means, but it is a great foundation to build from. You will notice many of the concepts are derived from the work place.

"I also have three offspring in or approaching adult hood. Two are in college or university and the youngest is finishing grade 12 and will be going to college in their chosen field."
With all due respect, CONGRATULATIONS.
metalman.

Somehow, my heart does not bleed. Just say no to drugs.

Not to far from the clubhouse, is it?

Curious Loki...Have you ever had anyone that was close to you die a violent,
unnaturally caused death? I've found that most people who claim to understand the "harsh realities" have never experienced them.
Humans are pack animals, we derive comfort from the spoken & written expressions of sympathy or empathy that our fellow humans can give us. While I struggle with finding sympathy for any of these gang related fatalities, some mother,
father, sister or brother is grieving for
their boy. He may have chosen a path that led to his death & maybe even deserved what he recieved (I don't have the moral
superiority to make that call), remember that anyone from any walk of life can go bad no matter what their upbringing.

I live in the neighbourhood and couldn't imagine how I would have coped if I found someone dead on my front lawn. One day an innocent bystander is going to be accidently shot. Scary thing is it could be anywhere...downtown, College Heights, North Nechako, Hart Highlands.
I do applaud the RCMP for their commendable efforts in combatting organized crime. Keeping on top of all this 100% is an impossible job. I appreciate the efforts that has been put into this investigation. There was an intensive (visible) RCMP presence in our neighbourhood for over 12 hours yesterday. I hope the resident whose front yard was used as a dumping ground is receiving adequate support to deal with the trauma.

If they go bad--whose fault is it?? Who was their guide? My kids didn't 'go bad'--gee, I wonder how come! I'll tell you why---cause I had a lot to say about their life style when they were young and foolish!!! Any parent who isn't too busy to disipline their kids, will have responsible law-abiding kids. When I was teaching high school, there were too many kids doing whatever they wanted while their parents worked long hours and didn't enforce 'rules'.

Supertech, I would respectfully disagree
that all children who are raised well will turn out to be law abiding citizens. Rather
the majority more than likely will. For
reasons that baffle researchers, psychologists etc. there are just some bad eggs out there. Drawn to the dark side?
Who knows, I don't. I will agree with you &
Loki that our current parenting model is seriously flawed. WAY too much permissiveness & alot of kids have figured out that for the most part the law is on their side (as long as they don't cross it)
& when it comes down to it parents & step
parents can quite easily be stripped of any pecieved authority. You're dead on Loki
sometimes the inmates are running the asylum.

alas, in the end we can only do our best and hope for the best while preparing for the worst. As detoe says, we are not 100% yet.

I do hope the family finds comfort by the time this settles.

Um, i disagree with the statement that 'anyone can go bad regardless of their upbringing'. At some point we have to distinguish between good and bad folk. We also have to start to blame folks for their actions and stop acting like they just accidently stepped in some bad while they were walking the dog.
This also involves letting the parent take some blame. I am with Loki on this one.

He made the choice to hold a gun to an innocent homeowners head. Had that happened to anyone in my family I'm not sure the results would have been any different. I can't see relying on the justice system in a situation like this, as evidenced by his out walking the streets in the first place. I'm glad I've never had to be put into that situation.

Anyone else wonder how or why he was in court on Monday on ten home invasion / weapons charges and on the street by Tuesday night to be shot?

Detoe, thank you, your words echo my thoughts.
metalman.

I just feeeeeeel the luv on this site!

The dude may have been found there, but I doubt he was shot there.

Nice call interceptor, the real villan is the judicial system that turned these four out on the street on the 15th when they in fact should have been still in jail accumulating double credits for time already served. When our judicial systems wonder why law abiding citizens take the law into their own hands, all they will have to do is look in the mirror to find the reason why.

Traumatized by someone being killed just outside your home? Hmmm? As long as it doesn't interrupt my watching Die Hard I and Die Hard II on my telly. After a kid enjoying a violent video game needs counseling after being exposed to a real murder? Hmmmm again. If after being exposed to a dead guy, just walk away convincing yourself that he is not really dead. He will get up. Just like in the movies. Simple.

detoe43: To answer your question, no. I do not associate with that element of society. I made the choice in my early twenties to get out of that world. Of course my time pre-dates the current level of violence. The worst we ever had was a beating up. A black eye and maybe a broken nose. Guns were used for target practice and hunting wild game.

Were the weapons used in this incident or even the home invasion he was accused of registered? That gun registry sure has helped "curb" gun violence on the street.