Carol, I agree that the tax leaves a lot to be desired. Campbell's explanation or justification makes no sense at all. If we are going to get back all we pay into this tax then the purpose is inane. Why bother?

Here is the "BUT", until you and the other parties can match or beat the present government votes, by at least one vote,not one thing is going to change and criminal Cambell is going to bum rush anything through that he sees fit. "The joy of having a dictaor dressed in a democratic cloak."

Nice try though...I truly wish you scads of luck in your endeavours.

Oh, what is there to say about Carole? Her and her party are not telling British Columbians the truth about their carbon tax plans. I for one don't trust her or her orgnaized labour cronies.

She tells us that she's for working class families when she wants to axe a progressive, revenue-neutral tax for something that will raise our income taxes and do nothing to solve climate change.

As a northerner, I'm supporting the BC Liberals on this one...at least they're upfront about the tax and not hiding their real agenda like old Carole. Carole, you couldn't get my vote...even if you gave me your $100 climate action dividend...

BC racer and Carol deserve one another vote her and her tribe in and you will quickly see what a real f#$%& up is in a real hurry...

Only an idiot would vote NDP.

link to socialist hypocrisy:

http://www.cbc.ca/canada/british-columbia/story/2008/06/24/bc-ndp-rebate-donations.html?ref=rss

The carbon tax is "revenue neutral" only in the fact that it does not reduce provincial government taxation levels overall. It is not "revenue neutral" to those who actually have to pay it at the gas pump.

Since the wellhead price per barrel of oil has increase significantly, and provincial royalties are based on a percentage of that, the provincial income from oil has increased significantly in tandem with that increased price. We are already paying a distorted price due to speculators, and the provincial Liberal Government is raking it in as a consequence. The carbon tax is redundant.

However, I got my Provincial Government $100 bribe yesterday. I am giving it to my son as a wedding present on July 18th.

As to the stupid insult from Death, this "idiot" remembers that NDP MLAs also donate their excess income to charities all around the province. You know, the exorbitant pay increases Mr. Campbell and his cronies rammed down everyone's throat after repeatedly claiming that the Province didn't have the money for pay increases for the workers who actually keep provincial services running. Look up hypocrite in a dictionary and you may see a picture of Campbell and his government members.

If you donate the bribe to the NDP, you can claim it on your income tax and get most of it back. No hypocrisy, just sound economic tax sense.

To Dozer, why did you refer to Carol James and her supporters as "her and her tribe"? Were you making an oblique, bigoted, racial statement in reference to her ancestry?

The NDP may not be the answer but we can't sit back and let the Liberals tax us with useless taxes. This won't help the environment any more than the gun registry reduced gun crime.

Well said Ruez!
If we simply lay down for this crap,what will they whack us with next time?
And there WILL be a next time!
We need to remember there is a trickledown effect to this tax as well.
It is not just about what happens at the pumps or on our heating costs come winter time.
Additional fuel costs the any business pays out WILL be passed on to the consumer, so we will be paying more for everything!
I never heard Campbell mention that.
Maybe he just missed that!

If you donate the bribe to the NDP, you can claim it on your income tax and get most of it back. No hypocrisy, just sound economic tax sense.

Need I say More?

Last time the NDP were in power one in ten people in this province were on social assistance. I don't wish to finance that again.

I should slapped quotation marks on that, I don't need that idiotic statement attributed to me. This forum has a really crappy format.

I don't think either the Liberals or the NDP can be trusted.
I do believe that we need a minority government no matter who is elected or what party.
At least that way they can't just go out and do whatever their little minds feel like.
I am not sure what party is best...
but do know that a major majority government sure isn't the way to go.

And to DOZER...who said I had any plans to vote for Carol...I did say I wished her well in her endeavours....I know nothing is going to happen to stop the tax, and as I said above we need a different type of government that what we have now.

I would suggest that if people still run out and buy 1 ton 4x4's as daily drivers, that perhaps the carbon tax isn't high enough :)

"The NDP may not be the answer but we can't sit back and let the Liberals tax us with useless taxes. This won't help the environment any more than the gun registry reduced gun crime."

Everyone will get the same income tax reduction. But those who reduce their carbon footprint will pay less carbon tax and do better financially than those who don't.

This is an incentive to reduce personal consumption of items that have a carbon tax applied top them.

BCRacer:"...not one thing is going to change and criminal Cambell is going to bum rush anything through that he sees fit."

In my opinion, the statement (*criminal*) when referring to any un-convicted of a crime person may very well be out of order and perhaps even actionable.

Sorry diplomat, he is a convicted impaired driver...therefore he has a criminal record....

If he has received a pardon, I will gladly retract my statement

That's funny. .. The NDP lobbying to lower taxes! The NDP loves tax money. The NDP have never went on a diet when it comes to the mighty tax dollar.

Which reminds me of a TV news clip, do you still remember who was at the front of the line up of school kids when the NDP introduced a free lunch program in their urban strong holds?

It was Harcourt with a huge grin, first one in line for a free lunch. The kids ate what Harcourt left behind.

Its sure nice to get a great big hundred bucks when in the first month it will be taxed back from us.
Whether you side with the liberals or the NDP, it really doesn't matter as they are about the same when it comes down to it.
We need some accountability to democratic process that meet with the realities which people face.
Our premier's fancy visions of "green at any cost" might be his pursuit of a legacy to leave, but it should be the people's choice as to how fast we pay the piper to do this.
If we break our economy in order to attempt the speediest and loftiest heights of conservation and emissions reductions, we will likely end up with the realities such that third world countries now have.
Strong economies provide the options and funding required for the changes needed.
It takes money to fix this and where is it going to come from if our economy is dead?
The NDP did this to the forest industry through an incredibly expensive assault on timber harvesting costs and all because of their "green" intentions. Forest practices are now worse than they ever were and its because when you push too hard--too fast the pendulum must swing back to correct itself.
Whether you love or hate the NDP, we need to reduce this unacountable liberal dictator's ability to choke us to death.

"If he has received a pardon, I will gladly retract my statement" Very charitable. He pleaded guilty to a misdemeanor in the USA which is a lesser criminal offense. By this definition you are living in a country which is full of criminals - people who were convicted of impaired driving. Tens of thousands in B.C. alone, or more...hundreds of thousands?

Hey there diplomat, your kinda touchy about what people think of our premier.
Fact is your kinda defensive of many things which our premier does.
I see a few posts of yours which are almost like your part of the liberal team.
Who else would defend the actions of drinking and driving as some sort of irelavent behaviour?
A little political tip for ya;
You won't win this argument as people see a spade as a spade.

Whats the point in debating about NDP vs Liberal or what ever else is out there? None of them can do the job of running this province. Lets bring a party in the can run the whole province not just the lower mainland while focusing on the agenda of the working people of the province. Hey its ok to dream!!

Woodchipper: "Fact is your kinda defensive of many things which our premier does."

Drinking and driving is not some sort of irrelevant behaviour - don't try to put words in my mouth, I never said that it was.

After enduring four (4) NDP premiers (not counting Dave Barrett) and their shenanigans I learned to live with this one, one who is a much better, even though not perfect.

Lesser evil, Sir! Unfortunately. You got anything better in your bag of tricks?

"Everyone will get the same income tax reduction. But those who reduce their carbon footprint will pay less carbon tax and do better financially than those who don't."

Yes in theory it works, here is the problem it gets cold here in the winter (Much colder than down south where the majority of BCer's live). I have three options 1) Run my furnace, be warm and pay more tax. 2) Burn wood, pollute more than I would with my gas furnace 3) Don't heat my house and have the Minstry come and take my kids from me. I will go with number 1 and pay more, if I lived in Vancouver I wouldn't have my furnace on as much and would pay less. So instead of an equal taxation policy I am taxed more becuase of geography.

Moreover, because there is a much larger population base in the lower mainland, it doesn't mater who we vote for, we can't change which party gets in. Therefore, we have taxation without representation and are no longer in a democracy. All hail King Campbell.

Travism, I agree with you. We are at a disadvantage in the north because of the colder climate. This carbon tax thing should have been brought in years ago with very small annual increases in order to allow people to plan for it and gradually adjust to it instead of dumping it into our laps without any warning or consultation.

And, the federal Liberals (if elected) would add to the problem because they would bring in a federal carbon tax which would really make our eyes pop out.

For decades nobody did anything and now they want to fix the whole problem practically overnight.

Posted by: Harbinger on June 25 2008 4:27 PM
Last time the NDP were in power one in ten people in this province were on social assistance. I don't wish to finance that again.


Thats because people from all over the country came to BC.

Posted by: NMG on June 25 2008 7:00 PM
I would suggest that if people still run out and buy 1 ton 4x4's as daily drivers, that perhaps the carbon tax isn't high enough :)


I would be an idiot if I tried to tow my boat and camper with a toyota Corolla.

Posted by: diplomat on June 26 2008 7:20 AM
"If he has received a pardon, I will gladly retract my statement" Very charitable. He pleaded guilty to a misdemeanor in the USA which is a lesser criminal offense. By this definition you are living in a country which is full of criminals - people who were convicted of impaired driving. Tens of thousands in B.C. alone, or more...hundreds of thousands?


Anyone convicted of a crime anywhere is a criminal.

"I would be an idiot if I tried to tow my boat and camper with a toyota Corolla"

I agree. Then again, I'd also wager that 75% of people driving a full sized truck or SUV wouldn't even know how to back up a trailer or plug their lights in, purely because they've never done it :)

Diplomat, I just thought it to be odd that someone would actually support a counter productive and perhaps disasterous tax being rammed down our throats.
I also found it odd that you seemed to take such offense to people offended by a premier caught for impaired driving.

If you read my posts, I do not support the NDP either and yes I certainly remember the smucks which they called their leaders.

If there is anything to be learned from the question of partisan blindness its that we shouldn't support any party which doesn't work for us.
It is this BC voter focus on polarised ideals which sends us from left to right while serving very little actual good to the people.

I don't know if you understand this diplomat, but it takes far less support to carry a bad provincial policy forward than it does to have it stopped. Fact is that our system has arrived at a point where other than election day--nothing that comes down from government can be stopped.

When people cheer on the government such as you do, and especially this cocky bunch--what will they do to us next?

There is something very wrong when a new minister such as Pat Bell supports what very few who elected him agree with.
This is blind partisan fellowship which allows a premier to become a dictator.
It isn't about choosing the lesser of two evils as you suggest diplomat--it is about demanding that our MLA's do not submit to the evils of dictatorship rule--regardless of which political party it is.
Thats the trick....diplomat.

I agree woodchipper, but I also understand where diplomat is coming from, for the most part.
Where it gets stinky is that politicians are supposed be ELECTED REPRESENTATIVES and by that,I would assume it should mean they represent the voters in their riding who elected them.
That is not what happens anymore,if in fact it ever did.
Now,they all represent the party leader,and in Campbells case,it is my way or the highway!
Blind loyalty, and in the Campbell government they are not only blind,they are deaf,dumb,and stupid!
Seems to me that to be a member of the Campbell Liberals,the first thing to go is your self-respect!
Therein lies the problem with the party system in general!

The point I tried to make was that we perhaps are the stupid ones by being sucked into polarised positions being more important than holding our MLA's accountable to what "we" the voters need.
Both major BC parties have learned how to distract the voters from the issues.

Glen Clark might have even been a better dictator than Gordo but what is killing us is that we are still following this blind partisan distraction.

What diplomat said was that you must choose the lesser of two evils and that is exactly what most people have done for many past elections. Justifying this partisan choice by throwing mud at the other party doesn't fix anything because it just solidifies the arrogance of the dictator while totally ignoring the real issue. Not holding our elected MLAs accountable to who elected them is the core problem. We in the north do not vote for the premier, we vote for a MLA which if we are lucky might become a cabinet minister and have a bit more pull within government. Perhaps even a vital local ministry such as Pat Bell in forestry.

Which team does Pat play for and what priorities does he work towards?
Answer: Who we allow him to play for and under the wishes of his constituents for the duration of his term(s) as we decide.
And NOT a liberal dictator.
There is a key distinction here that diplomat and many others are missing.
If we don't allow our MLAs to become puppets this dictatorship thing doesn't work.